Non-121 Consulting

[schloopy]

Not to burst your bubble, but NJA is essentially the same as 121. You’ll fly two or three legs a day every day you’re on tour unless you’re broken. The only difference is the airports and airplanes will be smaller. You will fly a lot of cool places, but you will immediately repo back to TEB, OPF, or VNY.

I'm aware of the similarities, but you basically pointed out the appeal to me. A more interesting day to day mission but with the security of a 121 operation.

And believe me, I highly respect the folks cautioning against turning down the airlines, and y'all are certainly not the first to bring it to my attention. With everything going on right now it would be impossible to ignore the appeal. I'm not at 1500 regardless so whatever move I make now certainly doesn't slam any doors shut. I just have some motivations, some more tangible than others, to give this a shot. I've also spent my entire career up until this point with one of the big bad pilot mills, I'm sure you know the one, and while my student experience was pretty great, working with them is something I couldn't recommend to anyone. I feel like going from there straight to a regional/ULCC then to a major is just missing so much along the way that I've never gotten to experience. Call me naive or romantic but I really think that's worth something.

 

[smack300]

Do you live near VNY or TEB? Just show up with your resume and start knocking. It is really getting at easy right now around VNY.

 

[MikeOH58]

I'm aware of the similarities, but you basically pointed out the appeal to me. A more interesting day to day mission but with the security of a 121 operation.

And believe me, I highly respect the folks cautioning against turning down the airlines, and y'all are certainly not the first to bring it to my attention. With everything going on right now it would be impossible to ignore the appeal. I'm not at 1500 regardless so whatever move I make now certainly doesn't slam any doors shut. I just have some motivations, some more tangible than others, to give this a shot. I've also spent my entire career up until this point with one of the big bad pilot mills, I'm sure you know the one, and while my student experience was pretty great, working with them is something I couldn't recommend to anyone. I feel like going from there straight to a regional/ULCC then to a major is just missing so much along the way that I've never gotten to experience. Call me naive or romantic but I really think that's worth something.

Romance doesn’t pay the bills. Dudes like Alex (CK) and JH have gone 121, THAT should tell you something. Never say never but I can just about guarantee you will not find a 91 job like mine and that is the only reason I haven’t personally gone to one of the big 3. That said, corporate will need it’s up and coming rock stars.

That, that, thaaaaat said you really should get on with a big 3, decide you hate it and than start your corporate career. I am very tempted to argue it is foolish to not go that path as a young person just starting his career.

 

[MikeOH58]

Let me just add one thing…

Right now with the state of the industry and the way the majors are hiring it’s like having the opportunity to play for the patriots, packers and cowboys and the 135 and even netjets equivalent is like opting to play in the Bulgarian American Football league because cities like Sofia and Plovdiv seem interesting

 

[swakid8]

I'm aware of the similarities, but you basically pointed out the appeal to me. A more interesting day to day mission but with the security of a 121 operation.

And believe me, I highly respect the folks cautioning against turning down the airlines, and y'all are certainly not the first to bring it to my attention. With everything going on right now it would be impossible to ignore the appeal. I'm not at 1500 regardless so whatever move I make now certainly doesn't slam any doors shut. I just have some motivations, some more tangible than others, to give this a shot. I've also spent my entire career up until this point with one of the big bad pilot mills, I'm sure you know the one, and while my student experience was pretty great, working with them is something I couldn't recommend to anyone. I feel like going from there straight to a regional/ULCC then to a major is just missing so much along the way that I've never gotten to experience. Call me naive or romantic but I really think that's worth something.

Look man, when you have multiple sources of folks trying to steer you a certain direction, I think it might be time to set the parking brake and reassess the situation. I would take another look at the big picture again to see what you are missing. You have guys who have been there, done it, and have been at places where you want to go suggesting you to make a certain career move. Think it about that.

Besides, there is a lot of variety that 121 flying can offer. However that requires seniority and order to get that you have to start somewhere.

Romance doesn’t pay the bills. Dudes like Alex (CK) and JH have gone 121, THAT should tell you something. Never say never but I can just about guarantee you will not find a 91 job like mine and that is the only reason I haven’t personally gone to one of the big 3. That said, corporate will need it’s up and coming rock stars.

That, that, thaaaaat said you really should get on with a big 3, decide you hate it and than start your corporate career. I am very tempted to argue it is foolish to not go that path as a young person just starting his career.

Sometimes folks just need to learn the hard way….

 

[schloopy]

Like I said, I’m not writing anything off at all. And frankly at this point I’m starting to be convinced. If I end up getting an offer from somewhere like PlaneSense, I would certainly take the job, and only flying a single engine that would put me in line for the regionals at 1500 while not qualifying for NJ with their multi hours requirement.

If this is just going to turn into a thread bashing anything that isn’t an airline then I’d say the conversation has run its course.

 

[seawolf42]

I understand your frustration from being outside trying to see the big picture, just consider the many decades of experience talking to you.
In the end it is your call.

 

[swakid8]

Like I said, I’m not writing anything off at all. And frankly at this point I’m starting to be convinced. If I end up getting an offer from somewhere like PlaneSense, I would certainly take the job, and only flying a single engine that would put me in line for the regionals at 1500 while not qualifying for NJ with their multi hours requirement.

If this is just going to turn into a thread bashing anything that isn’t an airline then I’d say the conversation has run its course.

We aren’t turning this into a bashing anything that isn’t an airline conversation. I am just highlighting the experience that is being laid out.

At the end of the day, it’s your call. Good Luck!

 

[MikeOH58]

Disregard, you seem to have this all figured out. Yeah, I think planesense is a super cool and exciting idea. Just think, maybe just maybe one day they will upgrade you to “the iet”. After that when you are ready for greener pastures I bet you will find a super awesome job flying a citation xls! That sounds really nice.

 

[GypsyPilot]

Romance doesn’t pay the bills. Dudes like Alex (CK) and JH have gone 121, THAT should tell you something. Never say never but I can just about guarantee you will not find a 91 job like mine and that is the only reason I haven’t personally gone to one of the big 3. That said, corporate will need it’s up and coming rock stars.

That, that, thaaaaat said you really should get on with a big 3, decide you hate it and than start your corporate career. I am very tempted to argue it is foolish to not go that path as a young person just starting his career.

Not sure why you aren’t including UPS and FedEx. We have folks from almost every airline in new hire classes every month. The “big 5” is where I’d be concentrating my efforts.

 

[Wardogg]

Disregard, you seem to have this all figured out. Yeah, I think planesense is a super cool and exciting idea. Just think, maybe just maybe one day they will upgrade you to “the iet”. After that when you are ready for greener pastures I bet you will find a super awesome job flying a citation xls! That sounds really nice.

I'm on like step 3 of this plan. So far so good.

Plus I heard only real pilots have been furloughed. So I already got that going for me. Which is nice.

 

[SrFnFly227]

Like I said, I’m not writing anything off at all. And frankly at this point I’m starting to be convinced. If I end up getting an offer from somewhere like PlaneSense, I would certainly take the job, and only flying a single engine that would put me in line for the regionals at 1500 while not qualifying for NJ with their multi hours requirement.

If this is just going to turn into a thread bashing anything that isn’t an airline then I’d say the conversation has run its course.

I'm going to say again, please stay in 91 if that is where your heart is. I will happily end my career having spent only 2008-12 flying 121. There are only a few of us on this site who aren't 121, but we all appear to be very happy. Personally, I'm at a Fortune 150 company that I hope to spend the next 26 years flying for. I know I will be giving up money, but it is worth it to me to live where I want, be home with my family more, and to enjoy what I do.

I will repeat this advice however. Do not try to make your career at a place where the airplane is being used to generate income. Get your time up and get on with a good 91 operator. Or even a 91/135 where the charter is in house (owner flying or owner's company flying 135 for tax reasons) or where, like my old bosses, the charter is "nice to have, not have to have."

At your experience, you need total time. Planesense would be a great way to do that. Eventually, you will need multi though so maybe somewhere else would be better? Ultimately, your path is up to you, but it will take 2500+ and some decent multi to get in to a career job. And unless you want to constantly complain about life while eating not all that great crew meals, no, Netjets is not a career job.