NMB ruling

pat84106 said:
don't you think its wrong that in this so-called free country that you are forced to join a union? Whatever happened to this thing called "free association"? In the soviet union people were forced to be a part of the communist party.
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It's a condition of employment. If you don't like it, well, you can work for a non-union carrier. Sorta like if you don't like wearing a hat and blazer, don't go to Delta. Kinda sad that in this so-called free country they tell you what to wear to work. In communist China they told people what to wear, too.
 
I'm going to dinner, but I look forward to your intelligent and thought out response..you see I see you are passionate and care deeply about OO, as do I. The only way to come to understanding is through respectful and honest conversation or debate.

I'll check in after a bit ;)
 
kellwolf said:
It's a condition of employment. If you don't like it, well, you can work for a non-union carrier. Sorta like if you don't like wearing a hat and blazer, don't go to Delta. Kinda sad that in this so-called free country they tell you what to wear to work. In communist China they told people what to wear, too.
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I do work at a non-union carrier and i plan on keeping it that way.
 
pat84106 said:
I do work at a non-union carrier and i plan on keeping it that way.
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Then the best you can do is vote to try to keep it that way. If 50%+1 of the voters vote to stay non-union, well, the pilot group has spoken. If it's the other way around, majority still rules. Those that don't vote don't care one way or the other. Sorry, but that's how 99% of voting issues work.
 
Wondering if someone can do a little clearing up for me?

I thought that you could go work for a company and not pay union dues but you only get the original contract and never anything new that is negotiated. This brought up when C5 was going ALPA. Don't understand the gist of it.
 
pat84106 said:
don't you think its wrong that in this so-called free country that you are forced to join a union? Whatever happened to this thing called "free association"? In the soviet union people were forced to be a part of the communist party.
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No one is forced to join a union. That's called a closed shop, and they're illegal in the United States (unfortunately, in my opinion). Agency shops don't require you to join, they merely require you to pay your fair share, and for good reason. You are benefiting from the gains achieved by the union through collective bargaining, safety programs, etc., plus you have union representation available to you, even if you don't join. You are just paying for what you get by virtue of being an employee at a union company. Do you think it would be right to be able to freeload and reap the benefits of other people's money?

pat84106 said:
Btw do you even work for skywest?
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Not only does he work for SkyWest, but he has worked to make it better by volunteering his time to help his fellow pilots. How much time have you spent to better the lives of your fellow pilots by volunteering for SAPA? What have you sacrificed for anyone other than yourself?
 
jhugz said:
I thought that you could go work for a company and not pay union dues but you only get the original contract and never anything new that is negotiated. This brought up when C5 was going ALPA. Don't understand the gist of it.
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No, that's not an option. Under the RLA, anyone that works at a company is part of that collective bargaining unit, even if they choose not to join the union, so they get the same benefits as the union members. That's why unions negotiate agency shop provisions. If everyone is going to benefit, everyone should pay.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
No one is forced to join a union. That's called a closed shop, and they're illegal in the United States (unfortunately, in my opinion). Agency shops don't require you to join, they merely require you to pay your fair share, and for good reason. You are benefiting from the gains achieved by the union through collective bargaining, safety programs, etc., plus you have union representation available to you, even if you don't join. You are just paying for what you get by virtue of being an employee at a union company. Do you think it would be right to be able to freeload and reap the benefits of other people's money?



Not only does he work for SkyWest, but he has worked to make it better by volunteering his time to help his fellow pilots. How much time have you spent to better the lives of your fellow pilots by volunteering for SAPA? What have you sacrificed for anyone other than yourself?
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This is a job for me a fun one but nothing more, you've obviously made it more.
 
Is it appropriate to use an "Oh, Mitch!" when the user in question is not actually named Mitch? :)
 
I think we've finally gotten to the meat of why Pat thinks like he does. The job is just craps and giggles to him. Just a fun way to pass the time, he doesnt need health care or any of those other "benefits", he's just havin fun!!
 
Must be nice.

If I don't fly, I don't make the mortgage.

Basically, he's not a professional pilot if it's all just for fun and giggles.

Time for him to resign and go fly Cessnas around the pattern so we can get a furloughed pilot back to work to feed his family.
 
pat84106 said:
no, its not the same, It would be like having a vote to have the constitution repealed. Voting for a president is something that will happen either way. Voting in a union is NOT the same.

Now everyone will be forced to vote to keep their jobs safe and that is wrong, If alpa was such a great organization and not the group of criminals every else sees them as they wouldn't need to do it the chicago way.
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Lol. Well, unfortunately, looking at presidential voting and local government voting shows an abundance of apathy out there. Why stack the deck against a union vote when you KNOW the apathetic ones out there will count against you?

If you feel voting a president, or any elected official is that much different, fine. In mine, and many other peoples opinion, a vote is a vote. If you care, vote if you don't, don't. Not all the people at Skywest threw in their application because it was a non-union airline. Some did, some didn't care, some got in and wanted to change things. Why do the people that don't care get to be tagged onto one side or the other?
 
This ruling isn't necessarily a bad thing. It just gets people to vote.

As far as the voting, is it still anonymous? I forget if that bill a year or so ago passed.
 
Maurus said:
This ruling isn't necessarily a bad thing. It just gets people to vote.

As far as the voting, is it still anonymous? I forget if that bill a year or so ago passed.
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Should be. AFAIK, the Colgan vote was call in with your info, and vote. Only thing people see are the final tallies, not how people voted. Same for our TA vote.
 
People should care enough about their job/career to participate in anything that effects that career. Period. If someone doesn't care enough to simply vote then they don't care enough to actually make their company better. This ruling is not out of line.

If your just in this for fun and giggles, then please get out of the way of the furloughed pilots and the rest of the guys that actually care.
 
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