I don't know what they were using to make their turn with or if they knew they had a disconnected control tab on the DC-8's right elevator in which sealed the fate of this aircraft.
National Airlines B747-400 Freighter (BCF) Down in Bagram, Afghanistan
- Thread starter Alchemy
- Start date
I don't know what they were using to make their turn with or if they knew they had a disconnected control tab on the DC-8's right elevator in which sealed the fate of this aircraft.
brent p h
Well-Known Member
SteveCostello
My member is well-known.
They'd be conducting tactical departures and approaches at Bagram. Check out Youtube for some footage... it's really fun to watch, as long as things don't go bad.
Polar742
All the responsibility none of the authority
Can you explain this to me?
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
Then please educate us - I'm interested in your insight.
Vector4Food
This job would be easier without all the airplanes
Im guessing he means something along the lines of steep climb outs and steep descents to mitigate the threat of SAM/MANPAD attack
SteveCostello
My member is well-known.
Precisely. This is a C-17, but same idea.
SteveCostello
My member is well-known.
Good to know. If they weren't doing tactical departures, that really underscores how soon they were in trouble.
Someone many posts ago asked about potential survival scenarios, depending on when the CG shift happens. Any one have thoughts on that? I get that once you get into the rotation that it's do or die, but... in that case, it was likely do AND die. Hard to say if putting it back down, dropping anchor, and riding it out would be any more survivable.
Someone many posts ago asked about potential survival scenarios, depending on when the CG shift happens. Any one have thoughts on that? I get that once you get into the rotation that it's do or die, but... in that case, it was likely do AND die. Hard to say if putting it back down, dropping anchor, and riding it out would be any more survivable.
TFaudree_ERAU
Mashin' dem buttons
Chances of survival are probably much higher with sliding it off the end of the runway. Air France in Toronto. American in Mo Bay. Kalitta in Brussels. Just to name a few...
SteveCostello
My member is well-known.
I would think so, especially in that neck of the woods. Hell... might take out a few insurgents in the process. This is assuming, of course, that if in fact this is a CG shift, that the load broke free at or around rotation.
It just really depends. If you've rotated, the chances of getting back down on the remaining runway is pretty slim, and you're going to somehow want to get the aircraft stopped on a surface that's not very forgiving.
I don't mean to prejudge the event ahead of the findings of the investigation, but they were dealt an unwinnable hand if the cargo shifted, especially that low.
I don't mean to prejudge the event ahead of the findings of the investigation, but they were dealt an unwinnable hand if the cargo shifted, especially that low.
SRA_kbad
Scooter Trash!!!
The 74's out of Bagram don't necessarily make what I would call, "tactical" departures. A steeper climb for the first thousand feet? Sure, but nothing like the C-17 in that video. Heck, the C-17's at BAF don't even do that.
As far as the checking of the cargo is concerned, the US cargo companies that fly in and out of Afghanistan have loadmasters. Well, that's what the loadmasters that I work with tell me anyways. Even UPS and FedEx have LM's for their Afghan flights. Don't know if its a DOD requirement or what. Maybe someone here can correct me if I'm wrong on that.
As far as the checking of the cargo is concerned, the US cargo companies that fly in and out of Afghanistan have loadmasters. Well, that's what the loadmasters that I work with tell me anyways. Even UPS and FedEx have LM's for their Afghan flights. Don't know if its a DOD requirement or what. Maybe someone here can correct me if I'm wrong on that.
Cptnchia
Dissatisfied Customer
When I was at Gemini, that's what the LMs did.
fholbert
Mod's - Please don't edit my posts!
Others have said the same but it's not necessarily true. My Bellanca has full aileron authority in a stall, even when held in a stall. Can't believe it's the only model of aircraft that does that.
moxiepilot
Well-Known Member
There are various procedures for departure to avoid SAFIRE and MANPAD. While operator's procedure (non-military) may not be true tactical departures (due to limitations and capabilities) rest assured we are climbing at Vx for a time to get away from the ground before the fence line.
While we have other means to fend off imminent attack, one of the best is to get off the ground and get high ASAP.
Every night though I do get to watch Tornadoes, Hornets and others perform actual tactical departures and it is very cool. They're at 10,000 agl before the end of the fence line.
///AMG
Well-Known Member
To dog hump on my other comment on this subject, trying to put it back down after takeoff in the remaining runway distance is just not something you do in jets. Even if it is an 11,800' rwy. That is how you die for sure, compared to maybe (or probably in this case) dying by taking it airborne with whatever hand you were dealt.
