Most Important Things You've Learned

86BravoPapa

86BravoPapa

Well-Known Member
To the seasoned professionals on here; what are some of the most vital, eye-opening things you've learned throughout your careers? The 'ah ha' moments in the cockpit. Not about home life, flight attendants, or bidding, etc...

Things that made a difference in how you fly, make decisions, flight plan, evaluate weather, etc.?
 
Just because the guy/gal next to you is the Captain doesn’t make them great aviators. Too many let the title go to their heads.
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Unless you’re on fire or almost out of gas there is absolutely never a reason to hurry. Don’t even think about leaving unless you are 100% content with the situation.

Also, be wary of unnecessary changes. A good majority of my ASAPs have been when we had a plan and changed something at the last minute for convenience (like runway changes).

We all are going to screw up. The absolutely best thing you can do in a multi person airplane is to create an environment where the other person feels free to speak up.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
Unless you’re on fire or almost out of gas there is absolutely never a reason to hurry. Don’t even think about leaving unless you are 100% content with the situation.

Also, be wary of unnecessary changes. A good majority of my ASAPs have been when we had a plan and changed something at the last minute for convenience (like runway changes).

We all are going to screw up. The absolutely best thing you can do in a multi person airplane is to create an environment where the other person feels free to speak up.
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Working on the ramp during flight training I've definitely come to the realization that I need to slow down before taxi out. Watching a crew of two take their time in a Global, GV, E175, etc., made me realize there's absolutely no reason that I as a low time pilot flying by myself should be rushing at any point.
 
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Soul Brotha' said:
Just because the guy/gal next to you is the Captain doesn’t make them great aviators. Too many let the title go to their heads.
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That brings up a question I've had for awhile; as an FO, what do you do if the Captain does or is about to do something seriously wrong that would jeopardize the safety of the flight? In otherwords how do you prevent from riding the aircraft into the ground when you don't have final say?
 
86BravoPapa said:
That brings up a question I've had for awhile; as an FO, what do you do if the Captain does or is about to do something seriously wrong that would jeopardize the safety of the flight? In otherwords how do you prevent from riding the aircraft into the ground when you don't have final say?
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It never gets bad enough that the airplane is going to hit the ground, 121 aviation is the most mundane thing on earth. That said there will be times when you are going to have to put your big boy pants on and dissent from a massively stupid opinion from the left seat.
 
Soku39 said:
It never gets bad enough that the airplane is going to hit the ground, 121 aviation is the most mundane thing on earth. That said there will be times when you are going to have to put your big boy pants on and dissent from a massively stupid opinion from the left seat.
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What about the Asian airliner at SFO? Also, what about crew environments in 91 or 135? To be fair, actions that result in a crash was probably too specific of an example. I just mean how do you say 'No, we're not doing this.', to the senior pilot without putting a big black mark on your resume?
 
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86BravoPapa said:
What about the Asian airliner at SFO? Also, what about crew environments in 91 or 135? To be fair, actions that result in a crash was probably too specific of an example. I just mean how do you say 'No, we're not doing this.', to the senior pilot without putting a big black mark on your resume?
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What about Asiana at SFO?

If you’re right and can back that up, there won’t be any black marks on a resume. If it’s a safety of flight issue where the aircraft’s flight path is in question/jeopardy then absolutely speak up, and if necessary in cases like ground contact imminent, take over control and fix the situation. (Eg, UPS BHM, Asiana SFO, etc).
 
Soku39 said:
It never gets bad enough that the airplane is going to hit the ground, 121 aviation is the most mundane thing on earth. That said there will be times when you are going to have to put your big boy pants on and dissent from a massively stupid opinion from the left seat.
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I'd say the scarier thing about 121 is the legal consequences of things. I worry more about getting violated for something way more than I do about actually getting hurt, because realistically you should never be in a situation where that's a possibility.

I'd echo what @Screaming_Emu said. Be wary of short cuts or doing/not doing something for the sake of convenience. There's been a couple times where getting lazy/complacent has led me to stress or kick myself over something for days afterward where if I had just taken the extra 5 minutes I wouldn't have given it a second thought after.

The other thing I'd add is fight to not get complacent every chance you get. It's easy to do especially when everything is so regimented like it is in the airline world. Hell, I have every normal checklist we used memorized verbatim, but always force yourself to take the time and do things the correct way. If you get complacent you WILL miss something at some point, and it's painful flying with really senior people that seem "too cool to care" and slack off.

Another thing... breathe. This career can be stressful at times and it's easy to let your emotions or temper get the better of you, especially if you're dealing with what is sometimes downright incompetence. Anytime I get into a frustrating situation I try to take a breath, be firm but calm, and ask myself "Is this worth getting worked up over? Will I still care about this in a week?" 99% of the time the answer is no, and down the road it will keep you from becoming "that guy" that nobody wants to work with.
 
86BravoPapa said:
That brings up a question I've had for awhile; as an FO, what do you do if the Captain does or is about to do something seriously wrong that would jeopardize the safety of the flight? In otherwords how do you prevent from riding the aircraft into the ground when you don't have final say?
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Are you serious?

In that case, yell My Airplane!, push the priority takeover button on the side stick, TOGA power, pull up, and you’re now pilot flying. Deal with the CA later. Issue verbal commands so he backs you up.

This is just a re-enactment, but you get the idea:






Or, you can be like the FO in the worse A321 crash/loss, CFIT accident with multiple Terrain alerts and pull up warnings, and all he did was issue polite requests to the CA to turn the plane and pull up. The last words on the CVR were “Sir, we are going down.” And “Sir, we are going da...”

He never got the word “down” out of the mouth as that was when the 321 smashed into the mountains.



Your choice.
 
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Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Are you serious?

In that case, yell My Airplane!, push the priority takeover button on the side stick, TOGA power, pull up, and you’re now pilot flying. Deal with the CA later. Issue verbal commands so he backs you up.

This is just a re-enactment, but you get the idea:






Or, you can be like the FO in my home country with the worse A321 crash/loss, CFIT accident with multiple Terrain alerts and pull up warnings, and all he did was issue polite requests to the CA to turn the plane and pull up. The last words on the CVR were “Sir, we are going down.” And “Sir, we are going da...”

He never got the word “down” out of the mouth as that was when the 321 smashed into the mountains.



Your choice.
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Well there's my learning for the day...I didn't know the right seater also had a priority takeover button.

Good grief, that video was a mess.
 
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Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Are you serious?

In that case, yell My Airplane!, push the priority takeover button on the side stick, TOGA power, pull up, and you’re now pilot flying. Deal with the CA later. Issue verbal commands so he backs you up.

This is just a re-enactment, but you get the idea:






Or, you can be like the FO in my home country with the worse A321 crash/loss, CFIT accident with multiple Terrain alerts and pull up warnings, and all he did was issue polite requests to the CA to turn the plane and pull up. The last words on the CVR were “Sir, we are going down.” And “Sir, we are going da...”

He never got the word “down” out of the mouth as that was when the 321 smashed into the mountains.



Your choice.
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Which flight was that?
 
JordanD said:
I'd say the scarier thing about 121 is the legal consequences of things. I worry more about getting violated for something way more than I do about actually getting hurt, because realistically you should never be in a situation where that's a possibility.

I'd echo what @Screaming_Emu said. Be wary of short cuts or doing/not doing something for the sake of convenience. There's been a couple times where getting lazy/complacent has led me to stress or kick myself over something for days afterward where if I had just taken the extra 5 minutes I wouldn't have given it a second thought after.

The other thing I'd add is fight to not get complacent every chance you get. It's easy to do especially when everything is so regimented like it is in the airline world. Hell, I have every normal checklist we used memorized verbatim, but always force yourself to take the time and do things the correct way. If you get complacent you WILL miss something at some point, and it's painful flying with really senior people that seem "too cool to care" and slack off.

Another thing... breathe. This career can be stressful at times and it's easy to let your emotions or temper get the better of you, especially if you're dealing with what is sometimes downright incompetence. Anytime I get into a frustrating situation I try to take a breath, be firm but calm, and ask myself "Is this worth getting worked up over? Will I still care about this in a week?" 99% of the time the answer is no, and down the road it will keep you from becoming "that guy" that nobody wants to work with.
Click to expand...


One of my first instructors loved to remind me of our options at any point during a flight: We can sit fat, dumb, and happy or we can be planning for the next event, phase, etc. I work to keep that at the front of mind every time I fly.
 
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