Meaningful time building

[Nark]

Instruct.

In the 121 world average stick and rudder skills are adequate. Obviously being better than average is ideal, but the stuff going on between your ears is what is going to make or break you, and that gets quite a workout instructing.

That’s kind of my point. Watching someone who doesn’t know how read the wind, blowing way past centerline turning base to final.

Flying 250 knots on downwind past the threshold.
Doing a proper crosswind landing. As in the nose wheel touches down on the centerline. Doesn’t make much difference in Ohare, but BF nowhere in Honduras (or N Dakota) with the runway only so wide, it does.

And on and on and on...

A lot of “techniques” that demonstrate their experience.

Are we going to crash: probably not.

 

[CFI A&P]

Can’t you get a R-ATP with 200xc?

Yes. There are a few exemptions to 61.159, and specifically 61.160 (e) & (f) address the airman having less than 500 hours cross country.

1,500 hours and...... 61.159 (unless R-ATP which can vary depending on your exemptions).

 

[Mountain Man]

If you can get into it, being a ferry pilot and instructor worked great for me. All the XC you need along with night. Great experience for all around pilot skill.

 

[Low&Slow]

I talked with a Regional Airline Training Manager I ran into last year about this topic while I was waiting for a flight.
He said they prefer to hire CFIs because they usually pass initial training and non-CFIs usually have an abysmal pass rate. He gave me specific statistics of CFI vs non-CFI applicant's success rates but I don't remember them well enough to post it here.
There was a very significant difference in the rates of success/failure though.

 

[jspeed87]

Regionals = IFR, glass, automation, Class B and Class C airspace, crew coordination.

Paying out of pocket? Find a DA40 or C172 with G1000 and find a reliable time builder. File IFR and land at only Class C, D, and B airports. If you got deep pockets do it in a Multi.

Someone else paying you as a commercial pilot entry level job? 250-1200: Aerial Survey, CFI/CFII in a busy complex airspace like Florida or Texas Pilot training mills. Avoid part 61 FBO instructing if you can. 1200 - 1500: Part 135 Single Pilot IFR for FedEx or UPS feeders, second in command in a Part 135 Multi engine turbine.

That should be a good path for the airlines once you get to 1500.

 

[srn121]

Any of those options can be good ones. I'd say try less to focus on what kind of flying you want to do and rather what company you want to fly for. If you're ready to move for your next job then I'd do your homework and find some places with good reputations as nothing is worse than moving for a company that treats you poorly.

There are some scheduled 135 operators flying regional jets who are able to hire FOs at less than 1500 hours if you want to go to the airlines as I believe that time counts for the upgrade requirement.

There are a few smaller survey companies which might be a good fit flying 206s and other aircraft, however I'd be wary of flying for any where you only do 400 hours a year. Some can be great if that's all you fly and you're off half to a third of the time, but if your goal is the regionals you might want to go somewhere you can build time faster.

There are a handful of cargo companies that can use FOs and you could upgrade to captain relatively quickly, but I'd be careful as cargo isn't for everyone.

Dropzone.com used to have a really good classified section. At 7 or 800 hours some dropzones will hire for single engine turbine, but maybe it'd be a lot of fun to do 6 months down south somewhere warm even flying 182s. My only concern would be maintenance.

 

[Rosstafari]

Thanks everyone for the input, this is a huge help. It’s not always easy to get this kind of info here at the pilot mill.

...but I'd be careful as cargo isn't for everyone.

Avoid part 61 FBO instructing if you can.

Huh. Go on. Why is this (for both)?

 

[srn121]

Huh. Go on. Why is this (for both)?

It's a tough life with not the best of sleep and time off for holidays. ACC flies the Shorts on cargo routes. They have captains and FOs and one of their planes went down in Charleston due to pilot error and it seemed like the captain and FO didn't get along the best. I don't think I'd be particularly worried about flying for them and cargo's one of the fastest ways to get twin turbine PIC. On demand cargo is a bit tougher as your schedule is unpredictable and duty days can be pretty tough, but you can build time quickly.

If you don't mind being on call you might be able to get on with Berry who have some FO positions if you get your multi. One's on demand cargo, the other is flying out to some naval islands off of San Diego.

 

[jspeed87]

Thanks everyone for the input, this is a huge help. It’s not always easy to get this kind of info here at the pilot mill.




Huh. Go on. Why is this (for both)?

It can be slow instructing at a local part 61 FBO. If you to the Pilot Mills like ATP, Aviator College etc.. you will usually do 100 hours a month and in busy complex airspace. I went the survey route and I'm now doing Single Pilot IFR. In my opinion just avoid jobs like banner towing or that keep you VFR in the pattern. Of course it's not a hard rule.

 

[Maximilian_Jenius]

Exactly this. The people that struggle the most are the people that don't get much instrument experience, and never really leave the pattern.

I talked with a Regional Airline Training Manager I ran into last year about this topic while I was waiting for a flight.
He said they prefer to hire CFIs because they usually pass initial training and non-CFIs usually have an abysmal pass rate. He gave me specific statistics of CFI vs non-CFI applicant's success rates but I don't remember them well enough to post it here.
There was a very significant difference in the rates of success/failure though.

At my future airline during the kool-aid session. They said the number one reason why people have been washing out of training was that they were not IFR current. They said their ideal candidate will have strong IFR skill, proficiency and knowledge. They're there to teach you how to fly the CRJ700/900 or the ERJ-175. Not to reteach you your IR rating. They prefer CFI's, but they at least lately seem to be having the most trouble transitioning to 121 ops due to lack of IR currency. Hell right now even my CFI-I isn't IFR current. He plans to do an IPC sometime close to getting his 1500 hrs and transitioning to 121.

My future airline isn't opposed to CFI's, but has said that their latest crop of 121 success stories have come from places like Air Choice One. And they even have a bridge program with Mokulele airlines.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

At my future airline during the kool-aid session. They said the number one reason why people have been washing out of training was that they were not IFR current. They said their ideal candidate will have strong IFR skill, proficiency and knowledge. They're there to teach you how to fly the CRJ700/900 or the ERJ-175. Not to reteach you your IR rating. They prefer CFI's, but they at least lately seem to be having the most trouble transitioning to 121 ops due to lack of IR currency. Hell right now even my CFI-I isn't IFR current. He plans to do an IPC sometime close to getting his 1500 hrs and transitioning to 121.

My future airline isn't opposed to CFI's, but has said that their latest crop of 121 success stories have come from places like Air Choice One. And they even have a bridge program with Mokulele airlines.

Y’all get a lot of instrument approaches in doing touch and goes, right?

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I talked with a Regional Airline Training Manager I ran into last year about this topic while I was waiting for a flight.
He said they prefer to hire CFIs because they usually pass initial training and non-CFIs usually have an abysmal pass rate. He gave me specific statistics of CFI vs non-CFI applicant's success rates but I don't remember them well enough to post it here.
There was a very significant difference in the rates of success/failure though.

All well and good, but you are downright hazardous to everything in the air* if you aren’t a proficient instrument pilot.

* Birds too