Malfunction in rental
- Thread starter PGT
- Start date
scooter2525
Very well Member
Yes. Gear comes up after positive rate. So following the order of take off... "positive rate, gea..... awww crap"
PGT
Well-Known Member
It wasn't a good day. At rotation the huge amber MESSAGE light lit up on the dash, the 430 thought it was important to tell me that I was inside SUA during rotation, it got my attention. A few seconds later gear up but I couldn't feel the gear come up and the GEAR UNSAFE light stayed on. I tried cycling but nothing, it sounded like 1 wheel came up but the gear light stayed on so we did a low flyby before landing.
I don't know I'd agree with that. Abnormal? Sure. Possible emergency? Sure.
"Too dangerous to fly"? I just think I'd have chosen my words a little more carefully than that.
-mini
PGT
Well-Known Member
PA28R
I guess somebody else had this problem a few months back, MX couldn't duplicate the problem on the ground.
AviatorGator
Well-Known Member
PGT
Well-Known Member
So I should start testing the gear on the ground...if the squat switch is faulty then well I never got off the round right?
scooter2525
Very well Member
Yeh, too dangerous isn't the phrase I would use. Either way, not a fun situation to be in when starting out at training. Good learning experience though. Glad it worked out for the OP and he didn't bend metal. At least it wasn't a problem of gear not coming down.
They put it on jacks and swung it?
We had a problem in the citation with a squat switch. It would intermittently fail to the "weight on wheels" position (whether that's "open" or "closed" I don't know...probably "closed") and pop the Thrust Attenuators out behind the engines on final with the power coming to idle. Well...we took off one day and couldn't get the handle up. Same problem. Squat switch thought we were on the ground so was preventing retraction.
Not saying that's the problem, but that's a place I'd probably start.
We must have reported the problem 10 times before they finally figured it out.
-mini
AviatorGator
Well-Known Member
Yikes! Were you on board for any of those events? When do you guys close the throttles in the CJ, 50' agl?
haha yep. I was the only one that saw the annunciators lighting up. The boss man started screaming at me the first time because I reached down and flipped the switch into stow real quick...he didn't believe that they deployed.
I'll say this...when it happens and you're flying, if you're not completely fixated on the runway, it'll get your attention but it's definitely not like a thrust reverser (in the 500 series) popping open on its own. You just reach down and toss the switch into stow and land normally. NBD.
Somewhere around there. 50' is a good target. If I'm on a good glide path and on speed crossing the threshold, I suppose that's where I do it. That usually works out to be ~50'. I use the sophisticated "That looks about right" method.
-mini
akmountaineer
Well-Known Member
A respectable operation should let you off the hook for the bill. I've had this happen several times over the years with different operators, and was never charged.
AviatorGator
Well-Known Member
I would imagine it would get your attention. Clearly nothing like the buckets on the 500 series like you said. I'd prefer they stay stowed until all three wheels are happily on the ground.
I treat our 500's the same way you describe coming into the flare. If everything is perfect with no wind, 50'.
granlistillo
Well-Known Member
I always think the reasonable man theory show work here. If you are time building, and they new that, I would just pay for it. If I were going up on a xcountry with my family, I wouldn't pay. Any FBO that I was a customer with would understand, or I would go elsewhere.
Some people are pretty scumming in their dealings, always looking for something for nothing that is why prom dresses in Department stores are nonreturnable at some places. But on the other hand a customer deserves a fair product or service.
Some people are pretty scumming in their dealings, always looking for something for nothing that is why prom dresses in Department stores are nonreturnable at some places. But on the other hand a customer deserves a fair product or service.
jdlilfan
Well-Known Member
We had this problem a few times with one of ours that still had the working auto-extension. It was most likely caused by that. We found that ours would occasionally not retract below 105 unless the override is engaged. Same thing would happen, get gear unsafe but 3 green lights. Just cycle back down, speed the aircraft up, have a high throttle setting and try to retract again. Also try to retract the gear in the override position.
If that doesn't work then it may be a broken squat switch, the handful of micro switches, or an issue with the 5 (or 10 amp, can't remember?) CB.
CoffeeIcePapers
Well-Hung Member
I think this is fair.
Mark815
Well-Known Member
I'm still going with the, You shouldn't have to pay for it.
That to me doesn't sound like a win\win\win. Just because he was able to log a landing? When I read that the first thing I thought of was the classic aviation 'hey this guy is gonna let me fly him around in his airplane for free! I get flight time and the experience.' Win Win! Right? Nope
So yeah, he got to log a landing, great. He didn't get to do what he wanted for the flight, and like others have said, a respectable flight school would understand and eat the cost of .5 off the plane. When I had the opposite occur to me, landing gear wouldn't come down, I logged 4hrs of flight time and didn't pay for any of it. Yeah I got great experience in that situation and a great story to tell, but in the end the equipment malfunctioned due to mx, so i wasn't going to pay for it.
If my situation had occurred to him, landing gear wouldn't come down and he needed hours to troubleshoot, would you expect to pay the hundreds of dollars, just because you got to fly?
That to me doesn't sound like a win\win\win. Just because he was able to log a landing? When I read that the first thing I thought of was the classic aviation 'hey this guy is gonna let me fly him around in his airplane for free! I get flight time and the experience.' Win Win! Right? Nope
So yeah, he got to log a landing, great. He didn't get to do what he wanted for the flight, and like others have said, a respectable flight school would understand and eat the cost of .5 off the plane. When I had the opposite occur to me, landing gear wouldn't come down, I logged 4hrs of flight time and didn't pay for any of it. Yeah I got great experience in that situation and a great story to tell, but in the end the equipment malfunctioned due to mx, so i wasn't going to pay for it.
If my situation had occurred to him, landing gear wouldn't come down and he needed hours to troubleshoot, would you expect to pay the hundreds of dollars, just because you got to fly?