Mainline- Airline Pilot Demand

rocketman5150 said:
That said, I find your post interesting. Let's examine the bigger picture. Top end pay at your former company was just reduced to $86. This only affects those people who were already earning more than more than that. Anyone earning 86 or less "conceded" nothing, at least in terms of hourly pay. But as a result of their now lower average labor costs, they are more competitive to keep the flying they have, and to bid on opportunities for new flying. So job security at your former company is, if anything, enhanced. By the same token, job security at your major just got slighly worse because there is now more economic incentive shift flying to your former regional. Isn't economics wonderful?
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First off, everybody making more than the cut off limit kept their pay, so it actually doesn't effect them at all... It ONLY effects the guys under the cutoff. And, for somebody like me who still has 30 or so years left of a career, that financial difference works out to about $500,000. Also throw in the fact that the deal extended the contract by 5 years so any COLA and inflation protection that would come into play at the end of the contract are now pushed out 5 additional years. It's a HUGE difference.

And while yes it MAY provide some short term job security, the flying still isn't owned by the company, so if somebody agrees to a slightly higher paycut, all that flying could go away the next day (or at the end of the contract lift period).

And finally, to your last point... that's why we have scope at the majors.
 
jtrain609 said:
I'm beginning to think you are the reincarnation of Hobbes. That, or you've read The Leviathan a few too many times.

Probably the later since Hobbes didn't believe in reincarnation, as life is "nasty, brutish and short."
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I prefer to think of myself as the reincarnation of Calvin... :-)
 
rocketman5150 said:
Don't misunderstand. I was not criticizing your choice to go to a major. I was reminding everyone else not to sacrifice their family for their career.
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Sorry bro, but trying to eek out a career in the regionals is not only sacrificing your family, you're also increasing your risk each year you stay.

Talk to a "I'm going to retire from CMR!" pilot. If any airline had the ability to be there for a 30 to 35 year career, it was CMR.

I'm stupefied that after seeing how they went from rags to riches to rags to stark naked, there are still people thinking that they'll be any different.

Walk with me, tell me your perspective on this.
 
Derg said:
Sorry bro, but trying to eek out a career in the regionals is not only sacrificing your family, you're also increasing your risk each year you stay. Talk to a "I'm going to retire from CMR!" pilot. If any airline had the ability to be there for a 30 to 35 year career, it was CMR. I'm stupefied that after seeing how they went from rags to riches to rags to stark naked, there are still people thinking that they'll be any different. Walk with me, tell me your perspective on this.
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Can we hold hands?

Only way Id walk with the Derg.
 
Derg said:
Sorry bro, but trying to eek out a career in the regionals is not only sacrificing your family, you're also increasing your risk each year you stay.

Talk to a "I'm going to retire from CMR!" pilot. If any airline had the ability to be there for a 30 to 35 year career, it was CMR.

I'm stupefied that after seeing how they went from rags to riches to rags to stark naked, there are still people thinking that they'll be any different.

Walk with me, tell me your perspective on this.
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At my last airline, the average Captain was earning in excess of 70K for working about 15 days per month. If that's "eeking" out a living, I'll take it.
 
rocketman5150 said:
At my last airline, the average Captain was earning in excess of 70K for working about 15 days per month. If that's "eeking" out a living, I'll take it.
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That's darned near new hire FO pay at some airlines and it moves up from significantly from there.

If you're satisfied with a career projection of only earning $70k as an airline captain, equivalent with some non-union senior mainline flight attendants, you are certainly a company negotiator's wet dream. Aww, skeet skeet.
 
Some of you make getting hired at a major / legacy gig sound so easy.

On the flip side, someone like myself, a WASP who didn't follow the usual college, then straight to a regional career path, but instead have some "interesting" things on their résumé (like a few bottom feeder 135 gigs) and less than stellar academic record, is wondering what the heck I'm doing at my quick upgrade regional. I mean, what good is that turbine PIC that tops out at 65K if I don't have the necessary pedigree to go somewhere else?
 
TallFlyer said:
Some of you make getting hired at a major / legacy gig sound so easy.

On the flip side, someone like myself, a WASP who didn't follow the usual college, then straight to a regional career path, but instead have some "interesting" things on their résumé (like a few bottom feeder 135 gigs) and less than stellar academic record, is wondering what the heck I'm doing at my quick upgrade regional. I mean, what good is that turbine PIC that tops out at 65K is if doesn't get me anywhere?
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It's a competitive environment, and it should be. Everything worth it, is.

Think about it this way. You think that 777 gig at FedEx is sweet? So does every Tom, Dick and Harry and they're applying, networking, shaking hands, doing what they have to do in order to make that critical connection and to be in the right place at the right time.

What have you done today toward your goal?

Ask yourself, how many people have you met (ahem) at carriers that are hiring, or that personally know many managers of pilot selection (double ahem) at many other airlines or flight operations and what you've done recently to walk across the divide and ask for help or guidance?

I've seen two tracks over the 15-ish years of running JC. People that position themselves for success succeed. People that mill about thinking it's a numbers game and they don't have a chance in the world for a variety of reasons do not. Put yourself in the right circles. Don't "hope" that someone is going to knock on your door and go "OMG look at that logbook! Come work for us!"
 
I am just getting back in to the 121 world at 38, after a 6 year "break" from my first regional. I am back at a regional, just before the new TA was voted in. More than half the class is in their 30's and 40's and all have diverse flying experience; c-130's, kc135's , king airs, Piaggios, Lears and full time cfi's. The class that just started behind mine has some, I think 2, cmr guys in it. At this point we all seem to think that the "New Deal" here will be a good thing. I hope my time is limited to a year or two at the most before I can move on up, and am actively taking advice and steps to position myself for it. We are all indeed technically qualifed for any job out there right now (well most of us), so I can certainly see why a part of someone's life outside the cockpit would be a part of the selction process; "how do you add value to our culture and community" kind of thing. How do they get to know that, definitely not on the form app form what I have seen so far...
 
rocketman5150 said:
At my last airline, the average Captain was earning in excess of 70K for working about 15 days per month. If that's "eeking" out a living, I'll take it.
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Not to be a pain, but I'll do that as a first year FO at a "major ACMI." I have no illusions that we're not quite up to DAL/UAL/FDX/UPS par, either. $70k in 121 post-regionals is okay cash.
 
dasleben said:
Not to be a pain, but I'll do that as a first year FO at a "major ACMI." I have no illusions that we're not quite up to DAL/UAL/FDX/UPS par, either. $70k in 121 post-regionals is okay cash.
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Why anyone would want to fly jets, for a career, for less than the heavy jet on front of you is paying each of their 15 flight attendants is beyond me.
 
Derg said:
Why anyone would want to fly jets, for a career, for less than the heavy jet on front of you is paying each of their 15 flight attendants is beyond me.
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Because "money isn't everything".

Except that in this business there is a high correlation between earnings and job security.
 
Derg said:
Sixty percent of the time, it works EVERY TIME.
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http://www.sex-panther.com/

It's only $35.00 a bottle

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