Mainline- Airline Pilot Demand

[Screaming_Emu]

How do we multi quote now? Am I missing something?



Because the guy who has 100 hours in a C172, 100 hours in a Katana, 100 hours in a Warrior and a 100 hours in a Cirrus, probably (in theory) has a better base of experience than the guy with 400 hours of 172 time. Resumes with total time don't show very much other than total time. Think of all the 10,000 hour idiot captains you've ever flown with who look really good on paper but are really terrible pilots (stick and rudder and thinking skills) in actuality.

Good point.

I understand listing time in each airplane you've flown. But breaking it down into actual, night, etc, by aircraft is also kind of a pain. One I'm willing to endure, but I will most definitely bitch about it.

I REALLY don't understand the 10,000 hour captains who are bad sticks. They certainly exist, but I really don't understand how you can do something for that long and still suck royally at it.

 

[derg]

This is SO true. Easiest way to screen out an application is get one that is filled out incorrectly. It's like spelling mistakes on a resume or cover letter.

I'm pretty good friends with the people that run AirlineApps and they tell me TIME AND TIME AGAIN, one of the screening techniques that every airline uses is spelling, grammar and punctuation.

Whenever I see Plato, the second sentence is usually something about people writing in text speak and not taking the time to carefully write and proofread responses.

 

[Screaming_Emu]

I made the mistake of moving over from just walking dogs at the Humane Society here to also taking lost and found reports. It is TOUGH talking to somebody on the phone who just lost their dog or cat and doesn't know if they will ever get them back again. Very rewarding work, but draining. It's nice to get back outside and just play with the dogs for a while afterwards.

I'm sure. Our program is a little more than playing with dogs, but that's a good chunk of it. Its called the good buddy program. You pick a dog that needs some manners in order to be adoptable. Take them places, teach them to walk on a leash, sit, etc. Its friggin awesome.

 

[Screaming_Emu]

I'm pretty good friends with the people that run AirlineApps and they tell me TIME AND TIME AGAIN, one of the screening techniques that every airline uses is spelling, grammar and punctuation.

Whenever I see Plato, the second sentence is usually something about people writing in text speak and not taking the time to carefully write and proofread responses.

Wait, so you're saying I should remove "YOLO" from my cover letter?

 

[derg]

Wait, so you're saying I should remove "YOLO" from my cover letter?

Ehh... I had "Leroyyyyyyyy JENKINNNNNNNNS!" on the last line of my resume so you may be ok with that.

 

[BobDDuck]

I'm sure. Our program is a little more than playing with dogs, but that's a good chunk of it. Its called the good buddy program. You pick a dog that needs some manners in order to be adoptable. Take them places, teach them to walk on a leash, sit, etc. Its friggin awesome.

That's part of the foster program here. They send dogs (and cats and rabbits and turtles and birds and things) home with people for a week or so if they need to gain a little weight, get better manners or just need a break from the shelter. We do some "enrichment" stuff when we walk them around on property, and they have volunteers trained in grooming, massage, reiki and chiropractic that do stuff for them as well.

 

[AA34]

Large university flight programs (not that I agree, but that's what I've been told by the folks that decide who comes in and who doesn't), military applicants and such.

Not questioning the messenger here, I just find this curious. I've got a four year degree from a state school and am working on my ratings at a local FBO a few years after graduation now.

I had heard "airlines won't care where you get your ratings from" a lot on this forum. I guess it's just the competitive nature of today's hiring environment.

 

[sorrygottarunway]

I found out after a year at this wonderful place, that I "got the call" mostly because my side-life as a professional musician piqued their interest. Back when I was earning $20/hr at Colgan on 1st year FO pay however, I just thought "I'd better get this symphony audition right if I want to make ends meet this year." So, Binghamton Philharmonic (and the musicians union), thanks for helping me get a job at a major!!!

Extra-curriculars: Do them!

 

[Dugie8]

It's not a numbers game. Don't get caught up in the algebra of who gets a call and who doesn't. Airlines look for "whole package" candidates and some airlines, for better or for worse, prefer "known quantity candidates" -- not numbers, but prefer certain "pedigrees" if you will.

Large university flight programs (not that I agree, but that's what I've been told by the folks that decide who comes in and who doesn't), military applicants and such.

Remember, it's a "preference".

Plus, volunteer work and other things that set you apart as an applicant is what they're looking for as all 10,000-plus applications meet all of the minimum requirements and 100% of them say "I'm a pilot, here's some numbers and stuff I flew". Get some stuff on your resume and application that reflect that you're not just a fleshy autopilot, but an actual blood, bone and guts human being.

Please don't take that as a "Oh whoisme" complaint. I was simply pointing out, it is all voodoo. After a certain point and it isn't necessarily hours in the seat, we are all the same in terms of experience/ability. We each may have our individual strengths and weaknesses but for the most part, the shiny side will stay up and the catering will be on time.

I don't think Delta is interested in a guy who coaches youth football, a certified Olympic lifting coach, accomplished Olympic lifter who happens to fly airplanes anyway. There is no where to put that info in airlineapps.

 

[derg]

Not questioning the messenger here, I just find this curious. I've got a four year degree from a state school and am working on my ratings at a local FBO a few years after graduation now.

I had heard "airlines won't care where you get your ratings from" a lot on this forum. I guess it's just the competitive nature of today's hiring environment.

And I agree with you, I'm passing on with what I was told during a "sit down" with the employment office a few years ago.

It helps, but I gather a well-rounded candidate at a state school wouldn't be out-trumped by a Riddle grad with a bunch of numbers on a resume and hardly anything else.

I know it helps, but I'm not exactly confident that the amount that it does help justifies the higher cost and loss of a traditional collegiate experience.

 

[derg]

Please don't take that as a "Oh whoisme" complaint. I was simply pointing out, it is all voodoo. After a certain point and it isn't necessarily hours in the seat, we are all the same in terms of experience/ability. We each may have our individual strengths and weaknesses but for the most part, the shiny side will stay up and the catering will be on time.

I don't think Delta is interested in a guy who coaches youth soccer, a certified Olympic lifting coach, accomplished Olympic lifter who happens to fly airplanes anyway. There is no where to put that info in airlineapps.

No problem. I know the hunt is frustrating as hell.

I can't speak for Delta nor do I even try, but volunteerism makes a candidate shine. If you do a lot of volunteer work and you can't find a n opportunity to reflect that your application, talk to your internal recommendation about talking about your efforts in his recommendation letter or letter of introduction that he's going to personally write.

The Airline Apps "letter of recommendation" request is a checkbox. The personal email to the Pilot Selection Department is where the real song and dance begins in your application process I have heard.

Again, not speaking for Delta or any other airline.

I have a friend that played for the Patriots and another one that played for the Oilers. You bet your patootie it got mentioned someplace in the application process.

 

[pete2800]

This thread has been rather informative.

I'm still annoyed that I missed this year's volunteer opportunity of choice due to injury.

 

[BobDDuck]

I'm still annoyed that I missed this year's volunteer opportunity of choice due to injury.

I may be misreading what you, but you are making that sound like a one and done opportunity.

Don't be the guy at the interview (I know... we are talking about GETTING an interview at this stage, but still...) who when asked about your volunteer or charity work says "well, I ran this 5k and I donated some clothes to Goodwill." Be the guy who talks about what you do WEEKLY (or at least monthly) and HOW it helps out the community.

 

[ComplexHiAv8r]

I may be misreading what you, but you are making that sound like a one and done opportunity. Don't be the guy at the interview (I know... we are talking about GETTING an interview at this stage, but still...) who when asked about your volunteer or charity work says "well, I ran this 5k and I donated some clothes to Goodwill." Be the guy who talks about what you do WEEKLY (or at least monthly) and HOW it helps out the community.

Are any an issue? Scouts? Foster Parenting? Etc?

 

[BobDDuck]

Are any an issue? Scouts? Foster Parenting? Etc?

I think they just want to see that you do more with your days off than sit in front of the TV and watch football. Granted, this is all probably used as a tie breaker.

The matrix probably looks something like this

-Did you fill out the application correctly and completly
-Do you meet the min quals
-Do you meet the competitive quals (including whatever DUI/Incident/Accident/Education screening they use)
-Are you a member of any "special" groups (OBAP/WIA/Riddle etc) ~these MIGHT lesson either of the above screeners)
-Who do you know/who's vouching for you (again, these may lesson the strictness of the screener)

Congrats you've got an interview.

Once at the interview, pretty much everybody is on a level playing field, regardless of flight time and experience. It's all about how YOU sell that flight time and experience, as well as everything you do when you aren't flying, coupled with your personality while you are doing the selling, that will get you the job at that stage.

 

[pete2800]

I may be misreading what you, but you are making that sound like a one and done opportunity.

Don't be the guy at the interview (I know... we are talking about GETTING an interview at this stage, but still...) who when asked about your volunteer or charity work says "well, I ran this 5k and I donated some clothes to Goodwill." Be the guy who talks about what you do WEEKLY (or at least monthly) and HOW it helps out the community.

Oh, no... not at all. I work with one of the local motorcycle track-day providers. A corner worker or crash-truck driver who can't pick up a bike due to a herniated disc isn't much good. This year's riding season is pretty much over in this part of the country. Since I'll have a few more days off now, I'll probably go back to helping high-school kids play with old airplanes.

I'm mostly annoyed because I didn't get to ride much this year.

 

[SteveC]

I'm pretty good friends with the people that run AirlineApps and they tell me TIME AND TIME AGAIN, one of the screening techniques that every airline uses is spelling, grammar and punctuation.

Whenever I see Plato, the second sentence is usually something about people writing in text speak and not taking the time to carefully write and proofread responses.

Y'all are welcome!

 

[scooter2525]

It's one guy who is currently an FO at a regional who runs the site. Not sure how much help he has though from other sources. He is very intelligent and a numbers oriented gent. While the data sources may or may not be wholly accurate, his analysis of the data is pretty solid. Nice guy with no agenda but to inform the rest of us with the data available.

If you question his info, send him an email I'm sure he'd like better info.

Dude was my commercial instructor. Very nice guy.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk - now Free

 

[block30]

It's one guy who is currently an FO at a regional who runs the site. Not sure how much help he has though from other sources. He is very intelligent and a numbers oriented gent. While the data sources may or may not be wholly accurate, his analysis of the data is pretty solid. Nice guy with no agenda but to inform the rest of us with the data available.

If you question his info, send him an email I'm sure he'd like better info.

Yes, I believe I have seen him soliciting more data and corrections to his numbers on a different forum. I listened to his interview when it was posted on Avweb. Based on his data, he was politely and calmly refuting the pilot shortage hysteria back when that was making the rounds (on what must have been a slow news period.) He seems like a good guy.

 

[Kingairer]

If you have young kids, I can assure you there are No days off spent in front of the TV watching football all day.