JaceTheAce
Well-Known Member
Alright, I want everyone's interpretation of when to log night time. I know what the FAR's say, and I have been sticking to that but I get ALL sorts of responses from experienced pilots.
Logging Night Time
- Thread starter JaceTheAce
- Start date
EatSleepFly
Well-Known Member
I can't remember what the regs say, but I don't log any night time until it's basically pitch black.
jrh
Well-Known Member
I go to http://www.wunderground.com, type in the airport identifier for where I'm at, and use the "Civil Twilight" time listed.
stuckingfk
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I can't remember what the regs say, but I don't log any night time until it's basically pitch black.
[/ QUOTE ]
I know you can log night from end of evening civil twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight, but I usually wait for at least an hour after sunset to log it. Everyone knows damn well it isn't night out only a half hour after sunset. At least not in ND.
I can't remember what the regs say, but I don't log any night time until it's basically pitch black.
[/ QUOTE ]
I know you can log night from end of evening civil twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight, but I usually wait for at least an hour after sunset to log it. Everyone knows damn well it isn't night out only a half hour after sunset. At least not in ND.
jrh
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I know you can log night from end of evening civil twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight, but I usually wait for at least an hour after sunset to log it. Everyone knows damn well it isn't night out only a half hour after sunset. At least not in ND.
[/ QUOTE ]
According to the FAA, it's night at civil twilight. Is it some how considered "cheating" to log night before it's pitch black? Does that make a person less of a pilot for logging time according to the definitions clearly spelled out in the regs?
I don't even know why it matters. Is night time somehow more valuable than day time?
I log night when the FAA says it's night. All I'm doing is recording the conditions of the flight, according to the FAA.
If the FAA wanted night time to mean absolutely pitch black, why didn't they write the regs that way? They wrote the regs for currency of carrying passengers at night to essentially mean pitch black, so why doesn't the logging reg say the same thing?
Heck, some might say that waiting until after evening civil twilight is breaking the regs because you're misrecording the time as day time when the FAA defines it as night. I don't think anybody actually cares, but I'm just saying...
I know you can log night from end of evening civil twilight to the beginning of morning civil twilight, but I usually wait for at least an hour after sunset to log it. Everyone knows damn well it isn't night out only a half hour after sunset. At least not in ND.
[/ QUOTE ]
According to the FAA, it's night at civil twilight. Is it some how considered "cheating" to log night before it's pitch black? Does that make a person less of a pilot for logging time according to the definitions clearly spelled out in the regs?
I don't even know why it matters. Is night time somehow more valuable than day time?
I log night when the FAA says it's night. All I'm doing is recording the conditions of the flight, according to the FAA.
If the FAA wanted night time to mean absolutely pitch black, why didn't they write the regs that way? They wrote the regs for currency of carrying passengers at night to essentially mean pitch black, so why doesn't the logging reg say the same thing?
Heck, some might say that waiting until after evening civil twilight is breaking the regs because you're misrecording the time as day time when the FAA defines it as night. I don't think anybody actually cares, but I'm just saying...
crashmbern
Well-Known Member
but don't night landing have to one hour before and after sunrise and sunset to count for night currency. that i think is where people get confused.
adam
adam
EatSleepFly
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Is it some how considered "cheating" to log night before it's pitch black?
[/ QUOTE ]
No, as long as it's legal- but then I don't have to log on to some silly website to figure out "civil twilight" (whatever that is) everytime I go to fill out my little log.
Is it some how considered "cheating" to log night before it's pitch black?
[/ QUOTE ]
No, as long as it's legal- but then I don't have to log on to some silly website to figure out "civil twilight" (whatever that is) everytime I go to fill out my little log.
jrh
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
I don't have to log on to some silly website to figure out "civil twilight" (whatever that is) everytime I go to fill out my little log.
[/ QUOTE ]
My original response was to the statement:
[ QUOTE ]
Everyone knows damn well it isn't night out only a half hour after sunset. At least not in ND.
[/ QUOTE ]
My point was that, yes, indeed, it is night, and loggable as night, according to the FAA. By the way I read the first quote, it seemed as though the poster didn't think it was legitimate to log night if there was any light left.
As far as the silly websites go, I use them all the time before I fly, like duats.com or adds.aviationweather.gov. It's just another resource. I don't see it as that big of a deal. Just check the time and move on. All I'm trying to do is keep an accurate log. I don't see anything wrong with waiting until it's totally dark, I just prefer what I consider to be a more precise method.
And FWIW, "civil twilight" is "the period beginning with sunset and ending when the center of the refracted Sun is more than six degrees below the horizon" according to Dictionary.com. I don't know exactly what that means. It sounds familiar, but I don't know where I've heard it before. I did a quick scan of the AIM and didn't see anything about it.
I don't have to log on to some silly website to figure out "civil twilight" (whatever that is) everytime I go to fill out my little log.
[/ QUOTE ]
My original response was to the statement:
[ QUOTE ]
Everyone knows damn well it isn't night out only a half hour after sunset. At least not in ND.
[/ QUOTE ]
My point was that, yes, indeed, it is night, and loggable as night, according to the FAA. By the way I read the first quote, it seemed as though the poster didn't think it was legitimate to log night if there was any light left.
As far as the silly websites go, I use them all the time before I fly, like duats.com or adds.aviationweather.gov. It's just another resource. I don't see it as that big of a deal. Just check the time and move on. All I'm trying to do is keep an accurate log. I don't see anything wrong with waiting until it's totally dark, I just prefer what I consider to be a more precise method.
And FWIW, "civil twilight" is "the period beginning with sunset and ending when the center of the refracted Sun is more than six degrees below the horizon" according to Dictionary.com. I don't know exactly what that means. It sounds familiar, but I don't know where I've heard it before. I did a quick scan of the AIM and didn't see anything about it.
MidlifeFlyer
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Alright, I want everyone's interpretation of when to log night time. I know what the FAR's say, and I have been sticking to that but I get ALL sorts of responses from experienced pilots.
[/ QUOTE ]If you know what the FARs =say=, why do you need a bunch of =opinions= about what it means?
Here's my FAQ that reviews what the FARs say in different situations. I just log what the FAR tell me I can.
http://www.midlifeflight.com/faq/faq.php?s=2#6.
Alright, I want everyone's interpretation of when to log night time. I know what the FAR's say, and I have been sticking to that but I get ALL sorts of responses from experienced pilots.
[/ QUOTE ]If you know what the FARs =say=, why do you need a bunch of =opinions= about what it means?
Here's my FAQ that reviews what the FARs say in different situations. I just log what the FAR tell me I can.
http://www.midlifeflight.com/faq/faq.php?s=2#6.
The way it works is: You may log night at the end of civil evening twilight, but for currency i.e. your 3 landings at night in 90 days it must be 1 hour after sunset to 1 hour before sunrise. The government just wants to make sure the 3 landings for currency were done when it was black outside.
Windchill
Well-Known Member
1. Sunset-Sunrise = Nav/Position Lights
2. End of evening civil twilight-beginning of morning civil twilight = logging hours for night **approx. half hour after sunset and a half hour prior to sunrise
3. One hour after sunset - one hour before sunrise = logging the takeoffs and landings (to a full stop) for currency to carry pax at night.
Since your question is concerning "logging night time" ... see #s 2 & 3.
2. End of evening civil twilight-beginning of morning civil twilight = logging hours for night **approx. half hour after sunset and a half hour prior to sunrise
3. One hour after sunset - one hour before sunrise = logging the takeoffs and landings (to a full stop) for currency to carry pax at night.
Since your question is concerning "logging night time" ... see #s 2 & 3.
stuckingfk
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
The government just wants to make sure the 3 landings for currency were done when it was black outside.
[/ QUOTE ]
Should be the same for logging night time also.
The government just wants to make sure the 3 landings for currency were done when it was black outside.
[/ QUOTE ]
Should be the same for logging night time also.
stuckingfk
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The government just wants to make sure the 3 landings for currency were done when it was black outside.
[/ QUOTE ]
Should be the same for logging night time also.
[/ QUOTE ]
But it's not.
[/ QUOTE ]
Really, didn't know that.
All we're talking about is a half hour or so, so I could care less. I don't need night time.
There's obviously many things in the FAR's that IMO should be changed, but I or anyone else I know can't really do anything about it.
For example
I'm legal to take passengers with just 3 landings logged in 90 days. I took a plane by myself on a trip last weekend and with two landings. Both sucked and would never want a passenger to see that. I don't land a single anymore, except for the Decathalon. Who would have thought that my crappy landings would come in a tricycle, but my tailwheel landings are great now.
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
The government just wants to make sure the 3 landings for currency were done when it was black outside.
[/ QUOTE ]
Should be the same for logging night time also.
[/ QUOTE ]
But it's not.
[/ QUOTE ]
Really, didn't know that.
All we're talking about is a half hour or so, so I could care less. I don't need night time.
There's obviously many things in the FAR's that IMO should be changed, but I or anyone else I know can't really do anything about it.
For example
I'm legal to take passengers with just 3 landings logged in 90 days. I took a plane by myself on a trip last weekend and with two landings. Both sucked and would never want a passenger to see that. I don't land a single anymore, except for the Decathalon. Who would have thought that my crappy landings would come in a tricycle, but my tailwheel landings are great now.
