Logging Approaches as a CFI

surreal1221

surreal1221

Well-Known Member
Real quick:

Can a CFI log approaches that their instrument students perform if the student is under the hood and conditions are VMC?

I say no, two CFI's I work with say yes, and they do log them. They also log them, while not logging any instrument time for themselves (simulated or actual . . .)

Now, as I understand it CFI's can log instrument approaches so long as instrument conditions exists inside of the FAF.

But if your student is under the hood, and your eyes are inside and outside, you're really playing more of a safety pilot role. A safety pilot doesn't log the approaches that the pilot he is being a safety pilot for is flying, so how can a CFI log these approaches as well (once again, my take is that they can not).

We searched through the FAR's today and couldn't find a clear cut answer. Does anyone know if there is a letter of the law from a FSDO or FAA on this matter?

Thanks
 
61.57

(c) Instrument experience. Except as provided in paragraph (e) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command under IFR or in weather conditions less than the minimums prescribed for VFR, unless within the preceding 6 calendar months, that person has:
(1) For the purpose of obtaining instrument experience in an aircraft (other than a glider), performed and logged under actual or simulated instrument conditions, either in flight in the appropriate category of aircraft for the instrument privileges sought or in a flight simulator or flight training device that is representative of the aircraft category for the instrument privileges sought—
(i) At least six instrument approaches;
(ii) Holding procedures; and
(iii) Intercepting and tracking courses through the use of navigation systems.

I think this is what you are looking for.

For what it is worth, you can basically log anything you want, it is what you put that "logged" experience towards is where the regs come into play. If you friends want to log approaches while the student is under the hood in VMC conditions, there is nothing saying they can't. However, they cannot use those approaches to count as currency for acting as PIC under IFR.

Again, FWIW, my logbook is a represantaion of what I have done, it says X amount of approaches, I have flown those approaches. I find it much easier to log the stuff I do than to find all the loopholes that allow me to log this and that without actually having done it.
 
My opinion (based solely on what my CFI taught me) is that if I am in IMC at the FAF, I log the approach when my student flies it. I definitely wouldn't log an approach in VMC if I'm not personally under the hood.

I can't back that up with any reg though.

If you are worried about the legalities of using this towards you currency, you could always just sit in the frasca for 15 minutes with another II. Reposition .1 nm outside the FAF...fly the approach, pause, repo...repeat...takes 4 minutes to do a hold...

If you an active II proficiency probably isn't a real concern for you. So if you want just do the bare bones minimums and sleep well at night...that's always an option. I'm assuming that since if you were just concerned about proficiency you probably wouldn't be asking about logging approaches your student is actually flying :).
 
Thanks Dugie, 61.57 is what I referenced, but they attempted to explain it another way without being able to back it up.

But you're right, they can log whatever they want but they won't be able to legally count those approaches towards their currency.
 
Published segment of the approach, within reason, I log the approach when in actual.
 
If i have to say anything or touch the controls to maintain safety of flight and remain legal (ie "watch your altitude" as we plumet below MDA) I log it.

If the student can fly the approach perfectly without my help, i dont feel its right for me to log it.

Of course this only applies in actual IMC.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top