Landing technique

F

future777captain

New Member
I have a question about landing that for some reason my instructor won't answer because he said I don't need to know it for VFR flying, but for a small airplane, like a Cessna 150, at what height above the runway do you begin the flare? Until now we've been doing it visual and my approach and all is good, but I've been flaring by visual technique, which makes for either a good or a bad landing.
I'm supposing 10 feet or so?
 
I'v never taught my students to look at the altimeter to see what altitude there flaring at. After alot of bouces you'll get the hang of it using your depth perception, so I kind of agree with your instructor. As a VFR pilot your eyes should for the most part be outside.:)
 
Forget the altimeter. Outside visuals only. With your airspeed under control, and a "normal" approach descent, maybe you transition to the flare 10ft off the ground in a C-152. The number of feet is not important. Look down the runway. This will help your peripheral vision too. You'll have a better judge of your sink rate and you can watch your nose with relation to the horizon which should start to draw a "landing" picture for you. Hours of stabilized approaches and you'll start to see that same picture and get a better feel for how much yoke to use and when. Some aircraft will use much more of your peripheral vision than forward vision. When I flare our Lanceair there is NO forward vision. This is the case with most tail-draggers I've flown as well. It all starts with good speed control though. Don't want to balloon, nor do you want to stall 20ft in the air. You'll find that sweet spot eventually. Until then, your CFI gets to earn his keep. :)
 
VFR or IFR I wouldn't want to flare using instruments.

Just look outside down the runway. The sight picture will become second nature for you with enough practice.
 
future777captain said:
I I'm supposing 10 feet or so?
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Depends on how rapidly you flare. You can flare quite high if you flare slowly; or you can wait until your nosewheel is just a couple of feet above the ground and pull back abruptly.

I'm not recommending either of those techniques as a goal, just describing what's possible. There is an optimal window of heights at which to begin, but you'll have to adjust your flare rate to compensate for the unavoidable variation in heights from one landing to another.
 
I don't think he's asking anything about the altimeter (although I can't for the life of me figure out his CFI's answer).

Mine is that I think of the "flare" as two separate events - the level off into ground effect and the transition to landing attitude. The level off into ground effect is usually done a bit lower, but you're pretty safe if you do it about a wingspan above the ground. My "approach" is explaned a bit more in my FAQ:

I'm having trouble with the flare. Any Advice?

It doesn't require numbers, just vision and a halfway decent ability to judge your height (which is why I land the way I do - I only have a quaterway decent ability to judge my height)
 
Find me a 150 with a radar altimeter and I will tell you the answer :)

That being said, I find that most pilots stugling with their landings aren't focusing their eye on the correct point during the actual flair. As you transition to the flair (from the round out as the FAA calls it) move your concentration from the aiming point to the far end of the runway. You will have a much better idea of how high you are.

That being said, the benefits of ground effect occur at approximately 1 wingspan, and increase at around 1/2 a wingspan.
 
It's a pretty common question. I get it all the time from engineer/software/highly analytical students. My artsy/creative/intuitive students don't seem too concerned with the exact height to start their round out and flare, although they do have their own set of quirks.

I teach my folks to look down the runway and start their flare as the runway edges appear to start widening out significantly in their peripheral vision. Seems to work most times and helps with their alignment as well.

A wing span or so to begin the round out is a good rule of thumb, as long as they don't finish the round out a wing span above the runway. A foot above it is better.

If folks are looking at the altimeter to judge when to flare, I cover it up.

The only instrument that really matters in the pattern is the airspeed indicator, and even then only until you get the sight pictures down because I'm going to cover it up anyway.

It's a great learning experience to cover all the flight instruments and just fly the pattern by sight pictures and power settings. You'd be surprised at how well you can do.

Also, if the round out and flare is high, they're probably looking too close in front of the nose.

And we don't count 'em if the the center line is outside the mains. :-)
 
Another thing to consider about when to start the flare is the size of the airplane. (Although this has been touched on by those who quote the "no earlier than 1 wingspan" technique). I used to fly KC-135's and you would bring the power to idle at 50' and round out at 30' AGL. Of course the radio altimeter would call these out in a little computerized voice, so that made it easier (although not exactly easy-- that airplane was a tough one to land well).

I now fly T-6's and C152's and C172's on occasion. If you start the flare in one of those at 50' LOOK OUT BELOW!

One technique that no one has yet mentioned is take a look out the windscreen as you taxi, and try to get a feel for how high you sit off the ground in each airplane, and start your flare with the goal of finishing it just a little bit before you get to that same height.
 
I'm a brand new CFI and have only taught two people to land so far, so what do I know, but the technique I have used has worked VERY WELL. What i've told my students is to disregard the word "flare". In my opinion a lot of student pilot end up ballooning or porpoising because they get confused by the word flare.

I simply explain that all we are accomplishing is a transition from a descent back to straight and level around 10 feet above the runway. Maintain pitch attitude and level flight and let the aircraft settle itself on its own down onto the runway. Just as the airplane is about to touch down, gently apply back pressure on the yolk to lift the nose wheel and BAM. Great landing!

Granted the two students I have taught landings to are pretty bright and seem to be above average, but after a couple touch n goes, they are pretty consistant with good landings.

just food for thought. Flare can be a decieving word.
 
just food for thought. Flare can be a decieving word.
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This is exactly right. I had a terrible time getting my landings down as a student pilot until I flew with a different instructor who got that point across. Instead of thinking of it as "flaring", think of it as a maneuver with a process just like all the others. Level off, power out, pitch back.

He was actually the head CFI and after our flight he met with my instructor and I, and the first thing he said was how upset he was that I used the "F word" in his office (meaning flare). She looked over at me with this horrified expression until he started laughing.
 
The best thing I find is that once the plane starts to settle you try to keep it from touching the ground. This allows for a smooth landing.
 
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