Jet transition/type rating

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Pilotman83

Well-Known Member
Before I ask my question, here is my background. I am working on building time for my commercial certificate. I have 210 TT, and I have my instrument rating. I plan on getting CFI, CFII, and MEI, and all that, but what would the regionals/airlines find appealing on a resume? I have been researching this a lot lately, and I want some feedback. I have been wondering if a regional jet transition course, such as the one offered by ATP would be worth it. Or, would a type rating be more beneficial? I have heard many opinions, mostly saying they aren't worth it, but other than monetary considerations, would either option be worth it?
 
Total time and an undergraduate degree will get you a lot further than a jet transition course or a type rating for an aircraft you don't have any flight time in.
 
The only way to put yourself ahead of the game with purchasing a type, would be to purchase 300-500 on the airframe as well.

The only other purpose would be to do an ATP ride at the same time.

I'd find the crappiest school out there, with the greasiest owner and just give $5000, and have him slap you across the face. Thatll be about how it feels once your done.
 
The market is such that once your total time is above 500 and multi at 100 (maybe even lower for the multi) you should be able to get a job at one of the regionals, provided you have a clean criminal/driving record and minimal checkride failures. Does a transition course look good, yes, but it certainly is not required. A type looks just as good if not better than a transition course, but is not going to get you a job in that aircraft unless you have the time in it or know someone. I am looking at getting a 737 type, only because I need an ATP, and the type with my G.I. benefits is only going to cost me 3000. But I am under no illusion that it will make me a good candidate for Southwest Airlines.
 
IMO Jet Transition courses and type are waste of money, especially for low time pilots. The only way I would justify it would be to get your ATP with the type or a high time pilot filling a reuirement to apply for a job he/she really wants and is competative for.
 
jtrain609 said:
Total time and an undergraduate degree will get you a lot further than a jet transition course or a type rating for an aircraft you don't have any flight time in.
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Agreed. You are VERY low time, and basically need to concentrating on tripling your flight time at the very least. To be honest, somebody with very low time (like less than 1,000 TT) and some kind of hokie "jet transition" course looks weird on paper anyway. Want to stand out in an interview? Be organized, prepared, and qualified. Believe it or not, most people are not those things when it comes to regional airline interviews. Good luck.
 
Well this is always one of those questions with no real right answer. Will a Jet Transition Course help you? Probably. Do you need it? Probably not.

It does nothing for your logbook. It does nothing for you time. It does nothing for your type rating. But what is does do is get you familiar with the CRJ. You get to know what all of those switches and buttons do and when to use them. You will learn the systems and all about the CRJ. That will help you when you get into the real sim at the airline.

Are they going to teach you the same things at the airline that you learn in the CRJ transition course? Absolutely. That is why many people say you do not need the transition course. And there is some truth to that. But the airline is going to teach you much faster and you are going to need to be at the top of your game to process that knowledge at the speed they are throwing it at you.

Personally, I tend to do better with more exposure and studying in this business. The CRJ course helped me first understand and break down how a jet aircraft operates. I will tell you it is very overwhelming to sit in a jet cockpit for the first time and figure you will be flying this thing pretty soon. The CRJ course breaks it down so that you have a basic understanding of what is going on and that can only help you. Right now ATP has a transition course for $2499 and, in my opinion, that's not a bad deal for what you get. Others will disagree.

Joe
 
Great responses thus far, but I wanted to focus on this statement:

Pilotman83 said:
but what would the regionals/airlines find appealing on a resume?
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I would encourage you to possibly reframe your motivation to "what would make me a better crew member in the long run, regardless of what I end up flying?" At 210TT, the best thing you can do is dig deep in the books (TERPS, AIM, FARs), fly by those books, and get as much time making decisions according to those books (and common sense) as possible. Approach every airplane you currently fly like it requires a type rating (systems, limitations, emergency procedures, etc.) and an RJ will be "just another airplane." As you gain experience and near the hiring requirements of the regionals, read "Professional Pilot," "Flying the Wing," "The Turbine Pilot's Flight Manual," and anything else you can get your hands on.

As a former instructor at a regional, I found that most new-hires lacked "general airplane" experience. Those that went through a transition course had a heads-up on the plane, but it certainly didn't matter when I gave them a crossing restriction that they should have never accepted (they knew how to throw it in "the box" but didn't immediately do some quick-and-dirty math to realize how unreasonable the clearance was). They were in too much of a hurry to get to the next level that they missed some key lessons in their rearing as a neophyte.

Good luck - these forums are a great place for advice!

-J
 
Having experienced regional training myself first hand... most regionals are preferring applicants that have a transition program under they're belt... because it gives them an intro to flying a transport category aircraft. What do I think about it? Well it doesn't really matter what I think... But just remember, there are no guarantees and these course are expensive. The biggest issue I've always had is the pay... you pay your way though school and your ratings... then you pay for a jet transition course, then for this and that next thing you know your $100,000 in and your top job prospects won't get you more than 35K/yr for at least 3-4 years...

My roomate is doing his Pay For Job externship at the hospital down here and he finishes in a few months... Once he gets his diploma he'll be weighted down in debt but with his degrees and diploma in internal medicine and surgury he's good for a starting pay of 70K up to 300K or more in 15 to 20 years... So it balances out.

Almost anything can be worth it if there is a light at the end of the tunnel... the problem is that in aviation the tunnel is getting long and the light is getting dimmer.
 
You could take almost $3000 and go fly a computer to learn an airplane you might never fly, or you can take that money and actually go FLYING and get some real world experience. I mean seriously, you have 200 hours! I feel like an old man telling a teenager to enjoy his youth! Enjoy the time that you have! We have all been there, and while you may think it sucks, it's probably the most fun you'll have! You can go fly an airplane for fun, with friends and family and gain valuable experience. That's worth more than some transition course.
 
Knock out the rest of your ratings. Then reevaluate. By the time you've got that done who knows if you'll need anything more to get hired? The way things are going I think once you get those certificates done you'll be hirable.

If not I think the transition course would provide more value than a type, if you're looking to do the airline thing. It'll give you multi crew experience in a regional plane, flying like the regionals train you. It gives you good practice for what's in store.

Whether it's worth the cost, only you can decide.
 
When did this whole RJ transition course thing start? I feel like an old man, and I'm 27. Back in my day we didn't need no stinkin' RJ course! :)
 
dasleben said:
When did this whole RJ transition course thing start? I feel like an old man, and I'm 27. Back in my day we didn't need no stinkin' RJ course! :)
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Except that your alma mater likely made you take something like 727 or DC-9 systems eh?

Mine had a 737 sim, and I think an RJ sim now.
 
jtrain609 said:
Except that your alma mater likely made you take something like 727 or DC-9 systems eh?

Mine had a 737 sim, and I think an RJ sim now.
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RJ with classes about RJ, 767, 747, and now 727 systems since theres one parked out there.

I'd be lying if I said I didn't appreciate the systems classes though. Made ground school at the airline a breeze.
 
dasleben said:
When did this whole RJ transition course thing start? I feel like an old man, and I'm 27. Back in my day we didn't need no stinkin' RJ course! :)
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Wow 27 and flying the 757 thats pretty good. Your actually a year younger than me... I graduated and took the RJ course in UND in 2007 because it was required, it was definitely a good course though it would have been better if it was a Level D Sim with full motion that gave us all a type rating... I started UND in 2003 and they had the program so I'm not sure when it actually began. The previous generations of civilian pilots that I correspond with personally and professionally before us often went from twin Cessnas and Barrons straight into 727s and 737s without any transition program and it made it work. The big difference maker however, is that to get hired by an airline 20 years ago you needed 2500TT and 1000 ME with 135 experience (but no RJ program required) to get into a 150,000+ lb piece of equipment. Now its a fast track with 300TT and 50ME and an RJ course into a 50,000 lb piece of equipment (1/3 the size as before). Times change I suppose...
 
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bronco21016 said:
RJ with classes about RJ, 767, 747, and now 727 systems since theres one parked out there.

I'd be lying if I said I didn't appreciate the systems classes though. Made ground school at the airline a breeze.
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I guess it depends who you had for systems class. I only learned about Guam and Flight Check in mine.
 
Adler said:
I guess it depends who you had for systems class. I only learned about Guam and Flight Check in mine.
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Adler, I remember when I went through advanced systems they told us the 727 APU is exhausted through the number two engine.... Complete BS. I am glad to see that FedEx will be giving all the teachers and mechs a yearly class on the aircraft.
 
Go build your total time, who ever hires you is gonna want you to go through their course anyway... their sim, their school, their way... better off just having fun building time. Now if you find yourself needing some multi time down the road... gimmie a call
 
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