It finally happened.

GypsyPilot said:
That sounds good in theory, but there are also several potential holes in this logic.

For example, when I used to fly ASE for SkyWest I’m sure we were a considerably riskier operation on your SMS program.

However, because of in house expertise, training, and consistent operations it was a low risk operation compared to the 91 operators that flew in there (on an approach with MUCH higher minimums as well). Just having “higher minimums” in no way equals a higher margin of safety.

Is your SMS program and/or SOPs backed up with an anonymous FOQA program? Do you have a dedicated team monitoring a rich stream of FOQA data that can integrate the results into a CQ program?

Can you put the brakes on your operation if you’re tired/fatigued knowing there will be ZERO consequences to your actions since there is another pilot widget that can be pulled in to do your flight?

You might be the unicorn part 91 department that somehow exceeds all of the above, but that would certainly be a rare occurrence.
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Most accidents that have happened in ASE have been by pilots/operators that disregarded their own SOP. Most operator SOP's don't even allow flights into there if the runway isn't in sight by the final approach fix. I'd wager that corporate flights exceed airline flying into ASE 20 or 30:1. Most operators require that their pilots get training for ASE annually. The big difference is the special approach used by the airline.

There are corporate operators that indeed do have FOQA.

Yes I can call in fatigued. I've even stopped mid trip because ATC delays would have caused an extended delay. We all got hotels and continued the trip the next day.
 
SteveC said:
Why is attempting to correct blanket mischaracterizations “crap”?
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That's not what I wa...you know what, fine. I give up. Corporate/Airline pilots are better/worse than Corporate/Airline pilots, just as Civilian/Military pilots are better/worse than Civilian/Military pilots and you infants are doing God's work by arguing about it on the internet for the rest of time. Some day, someone is going to Win this battle, and Evil will be vanquished.
 
Here’s the thing: there are a lot of good 121 jobs. For the vast majority of pilots, 121’s a great career. Most stories about 91 flying come from folks that have left 91 and gone 121, hopefully to better jobs. The folks with good 91 jobs don’t leave, and also mostly don’t talk much.

Are things that help airlines like FOQA helpful to 91? Not unless you greatly increase the dataset outside just a flight department. There are some solutions in work for that but I digress. It’s a very different operating environment and job than the airlines. Insurance is really the industry with useful data on 91 safety records and the underwriters don’t really share their datasets. I think it speaks well of our department that we fly light jets that don’t have great stats, horror stories abound about carriers dropping departments or premiums skyrocketing in our segment, and yet we have multiple underwriters every year bidding on our policy and competing for our business.

TL;dr the guys with 91 jobs that don’t suck aren’t the ones going 121 or whining about them.
 
pwttogfk said:
Here’s the thing: there are a lot of good 121 jobs. For the vast majority of pilots, 121’s a great career. Most stories about 91 flying come from folks that have left 91 and gone 121, hopefully to better jobs. The folks with good 91 jobs don’t leave, and also mostly don’t talk much.

Are things that help airlines like FOQA helpful to 91? Not unless you greatly increase the dataset outside just a flight department. There are some solutions in work for that but I digress. It’s a very different operating environment and job than the airlines. Insurance is really the industry with useful data on 91 safety records and the underwriters don’t really share their datasets. I think it speaks well of our department that we fly light jets that don’t have great stats, horror stories abound about carriers dropping departments or premiums skyrocketing in our segment, and yet we have multiple underwriters every year bidding on our policy and competing for our business.

TL;dr the guys with 91 jobs that don’t suck aren’t the ones going 121 or whining about them.
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It seems popular for 121 folks to look down on 91/135 folks. At the same time they're complaining about their 121 life. Neither are perfect, find a good spot and enjoy it. Every 91 or 135 is not a shady operator running junk out of Miami. You only live once, if you spend your time complaining about someone elses choices you've wasted that time. Pilots are weird.
 
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