Is it worth going to a CTI school?

Slugger

Well-Known Member
If I want to become a pilot, and if that doesn't work out maybe become a controller, is it worth major/minoring or double majoring in ATC and aviation management/flying? Do CTI schools give that much of an advantage over off the street hires?
 
If I want to become a pilot, and if that doesn't work out maybe become a controller, is it worth major/minoring or double majoring in ATC and aviation management/flying? Do CTI schools give that much of an advantage over off the street hires?
Depends on who you ask. At this point in time they playing field is about even. If you haven't applied to a PUBNAT yet then you might want to consider taking some ATC courses if you're certain this is something you really want to do. Make sure you're medically qualified before even thinking about it though. It will save you trouble and possibly heartbreak later in the process.

Do a search on here and read up a bit on it. You'll find more opinions from people who have actually been to CTI school. Since I was picked up OTS, I can't really give you any insight to that part of the question.

I will say this, however: There is a guy in my class who got picked up OTS and is now at the Academy who has a friend that applied to a CTI opening 5 months before him. His friend is still waiting on a class date. But that also has a lot to do with facility hiring levels and the like.
 
The advantage to CTI is more announcements to apply to and (possibly?) a faster hiring process. From my months of posting and lurking on this forum, that is the only advantage CTI has over OTS. An OTSer who scores WQ on the AT-SAT will get hired before a CTI who scored Q. Geoprefs seems to have more to do with selection than anything else past AT-SAT score.
 
Dude, If you can afford it, it's a no brainer: get a college degree. If you can't afford it, try to get a PUBNAT call. Thats just my $.02. This industry is nuts.
 
If your just starting college, I would do the double major or minor. Who knows what the industry will look like in 4 years. As stated above CTI has more announcements, and you get to bypass basics at the academy. If you can afford it or not, it's your decision if you want to be in much debt. Some schools are cheaper than others.
 
If your just starting college, I would do the double major or minor. Who knows what the industry will look like in 4 years. As stated above CTI has more announcements, and you get to bypass basics at the academy. If you can afford it or not, it's your decision if you want to be in much debt. Some schools are cheaper than others.

Its a personal thing really. Some people like me are very blessed in the sense that my entire education is payed for with scholarships/family. I wont have debt. Others cant afford it. Either way, you need to find something you enjoy doing and work hard at it. But dont let someone tell you you cant do it without a degree. Sure degrees are good, but if you cant afford it/dont want to go, its not going to stop you. I am doing it because I have the opportunity. I know not everyone does. Best of luck! :beer:
 
I am tired of this subject coming up but the best advice I can give you is to go to college for something else and apply to the PUBNATS. I had degrees in Business and Psychology and got selected, if you score high on the ATSAT you will have a good shot, the FAA will be hiring lots of people for the next 5 years or more. If you don't get selected for ATC you will have another degree to help you out........ so study something else in college and apply PUBNAT, if not your putting all your stones in one basket with CTI.
 
You're still not putting all your stones in one basket regardless. A bachelors degree is just that. Very few times will any employer really care WHAT you majored in. My friend majored in sports medicine and taught himself electrical engineering. now he is an assistant professor of electronic design @ texas tech. A degree is a degree. just make sure you like what you study so it is enjoyable!
 
You're still not putting all your stones in one basket regardless. A bachelors degree is just that. Very few times will any employer really care WHAT you majored in. My friend majored in sports medicine and taught himself electrical engineering. now he is an assistant professor of electronic design @ texas tech. A degree is a degree. just make sure you like what you study so it is enjoyable!
Yeah, I look at the aviation management degree as a business management degree. I would think if you have a business degree, you could get hired at basically any business. I also think that a degree in aviation management from Purdue is much better than an air traffic management degree from daniel webster.
 
If you want to get a degree, get it in something that has broader appeal.

I think CTI schools are a VERY bad value. There is no guarantee that you will be picked up, and there is no guarantee you will not wash out at the Academy or at your facility when you are. So, you get to spend a ton of money (unless you are lucky enough to live in a state that has a state run school with a CTI program) to get a degree that has zero relevance outside one specific career, and the only real benefit today is you get to skip basics in OKC.

I will also mention that here at the Academy, there is little to no difference between the performance of CTI students and OTS. Honestly, I think the FAA needs to re-evaluate the CTI program and either do away with it entirely (make ATC 100% OTS and re-evaluate the qualifications) or restructure it in some manner that cuts down on the expense to the students if the only advantage they will have is skipping basics.
 
If you want to get a degree, get it in something that has broader appeal.

I will also mention that here at the Academy, there is little to no difference between the performance of CTI students and OTS.

.... and your data source is? I do agree with you though that the FAA should re-evaluate the CTI program and restructure it.
 
.... and your data source is? I do agree with you though that the FAA should re-evaluate the CTI program and restructure it.

Id have to disagree that there is little difference. If you are OTS vs CTI there may be little difference at the academy. the diff. will hit you once you are in the facility. I have worked with a guy who got a 100 on his atsat (which needs to be re-evaluated) and could not get through CD in a lvl 6 facility. He was OTS.
 
.... and your data source is? I do agree with you though that the FAA should re-evaluate the CTI program and restructure it.

Personal observation here at the Academy. It seems to me that once everyone gets into their classes everyone is more or less on the same level, at least in enroute.

I think CTI vs OTS success rate at the facility probably has more to do with ones' level of desire and drive for the job. A CTI is more likely to be in the job because of a long standing desire to do the work opposed to someone straying across the job listing and thought it sounded neat.
 
Id have to disagree that there is little difference. If you are OTS vs CTI there may be little difference at the academy. the diff. will hit you once you are in the facility. I have worked with a guy who got a 100 on his atsat (which needs to be re-evaluated) and could not get through CD in a lvl 6 facility. He was OTS.

I don't know if this is true, but it seems like the opposite would be more likely. In CTI you learn lots of terms and basic ATC concepts, but your not running radar simulation problems, memorizing realistic maps, newer things like URET and more. So it seems like CTI should have and advantage early, but later in OKC and in facilities when both groups are introduced to all new concepts, it should even out.
 
Do CTI grads get hired much faster? That's what I heard at UND, but they're obviously biased.
 
Well, you can apply to CTI job announcements in addition to regular PUBNAT announcements, so you basically have a much better chance of getting hired. As for how long each road takes, there seems to be HUGE variability, mostly depending on how smoothly your clearances go and how badly your facility needs people.
 
I don't know if this is true, but it seems like the opposite would be more likely. In CTI you learn lots of terms and basic ATC concepts, but your not running radar simulation problems, memorizing realistic maps, newer things like URET and more. So it seems like CTI should have and advantage early, but later in OKC and in facilities when both groups are introduced to all new concepts, it should even out.

My CTI school had full suites of enroute and approach labs as well as a contract tower. I was enroute and you memorized your maps (D66 at academy center) then spent a year running problems. Half the year non radar half the year radar. My CTI PV was truthfully twice as hard as my FAA PV and unlike the FAA PV you got no second chance at a retake, you simply failed that semester.

You're right though about some of the support systems like URET and FDIO, they didn't have that and it probably would have been nice to have some experience with that. Although because of that they flat out refused us any automation. Tell ya what, after your 40th manual handoff of the session your brain would start to mix up Signs and Rinky.
 
I don't know if this is true, but it seems like the opposite would be more likely. In CTI you learn lots of terms and basic ATC concepts, but your not running radar simulation problems, memorizing realistic maps, newer things like URET and more. So it seems like CTI should have and advantage early, but later in OKC and in facilities when both groups are introduced to all new concepts, it should even out.


I don't know where you are getting your info that you don't run radar simulation at CTI schools, but that is not true. I can't speak for all, I can only speak for where I went, but for the terminal program at CCBC, we ran simulator problems all the time. There are actual classes called Approach I and Approach II, the airspace is Pittsburghs airspace, and we would run problems using that airspace. Some of the teachers are either current or former controllers at PIT, so they have plenty of experience knowing what the airspace is actually like, and the types of problems to give. The enroute program also spends most of their time in a radar lab running problems. Also, there is the best simulator of all for terminal, which is not a simulator at all, you get actual experience in the control tower that the school has the contract to run. I do have a CTO there.

Some may say that CTI is a waste of money, and just apply off the street. Well, I know some people that went to CCBC that are now working for Midwest, or Serco (I think that is how it is spelled) because they got sick of waiting for the FAA...how many people that are OTS can get a job working contract, none that I am aware of.

Both routes have their advantages and disadvantages, but you have to do what you think is best for you. I would be willing to bet that I am much more prepared than someone OTS once I get to my facility. I have worked traffic, I don't have mic fright (Is that how you spell fright lol?), I have dealt with other things that go with the job, like the interphones and stuff like that, so I would hope that I am much more prepared than someone OTS. Please don't interpret this as me being cocky, because that is not my intent, and I am aware that I am not guaranteed to succeed in the FAA, but I do feel like I do have an advatage once I get to my facility over an OTS person.
 
Both routes have their advantages and disadvantages, but you have to do what you think is best for you. I would be willing to bet that I am much more prepared than someone OTS once I get to my facility. I have worked traffic, I don't have mic fright (Is that how you spell fright lol?), I have dealt with other things that go with the job, like the interphones and stuff like that, so I would hope that I am much more prepared than someone OTS. Please don't interpret this as me being cocky, because that is not my intent, and I am aware that I am not guaranteed to succeed in the FAA, but I do feel like I do have an advatage once I get to my facility over an OTS person.
Agreed on some points, disagree on others.

I can't speak for CTI route myself, but some of the things you mention don't really hold up IMHO when it comes to Tower Cab training. The CTI grads in my class (one of whom went to Beaver) are about at the abilities of those who are OTS. The only people that have a real and obvious advantage are the RMC hires who have spent the last 10-20 years controlling military traffic.

You learn the basics of what you need to know to survive at your facility when you get to the MMAC and start going through the training. Operating an interphone, using FDIO, and changing the METAR observation from the ASOS are all things you learn to do here at the Academy. Whether you knew it before or not won't make a difference when you leave, because everyone has been given the same opportunity to learn it.

IMHO, someone off the street without a CTI degree could very well outdo someone with a CTI degree when push comes to shove. It's all about your desire to learn, try your hardest, and do everything in your power to become a good developmental.

Again, I'm not bashing CTI grads, they're all very knowledgable and I respect them for sticking through their respective programs, but to say they have an advantage over an OTS applicant is a bit biased.
 
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