Is it true?

poser765 said:
I thought the Controller Creed was "I am a Controller, and I WAS on the land line."
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True and true. I thought being on the landline was a PITA in the States, but after dealing with Kuwait/Tehran/Ankara/Amman for a few months I didn't realize how good I had it.
 
Autothrust Blue said:
It's usually not my place to do so, but I have taken aside some of our newer guys to talk about appearance, in a "hey, I don't care, but someone might, and I don't know if anyone told you" manner. Forehead-sunglasses and earbuds aren't going to fly unless you've stripped (or covered) the bling off your shirt. These are expressly prohibited at my airline.

As is...wait for it...

With respect to the backpack look: at my airline, it IS expressly prohibited, and it is consequently a dumb way to get gigged. (Nobody told me is not a defense, but I don't think we spend enough time on such things.)
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to be fair the "i dont care, but someone might" line is BS....you do care otherwise you wouldn't be saying anything (not you specifically, just saying for when that phrase is used)
 
Derg said:
It's there because of… US.

You, I and the rest of the cabal because the pilot profession substituted in-person mentorship with websites, social media and job fairs. I think we need to move toward a professional "guild" of sorts where we mentor people from soup to nuts. I think most of the people I've recommended or have gotten the job over the years fully understand that I will get in that ass if they're not holding up their end of the agreement.

The idea that there are people flying jets who can't come to work on time, don't understand that people are more than self-loading cargo and "Look, dick, if the boss-man says show up to work with your shoes shined, show up with your shoes shined — if they were shined during your interview, they better be shined at work."

I think it's Skywest's private personal business. Entertaining to read, yes. Creepy, for sure, but at the end of the day, all those things that the credo speaks about are things that all of us should be both practicing and preaching to the current and next generation of pilots through professionalism.

I am fully confident that the usual suspects will show up and say "I can be professional in board shorts and a greasy t-shirt" — that's cool, knock yourself out if your company and your clientele will allow for and tolerate that, but that isn't the case for a vast majority of us.

Once we can solve the easy things, like this, we can redouble our efforts toward the really important stuff in my opinion.

So, what do we do about it? I need ideas.
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I think we need to make our profession stand out as something unique in the world. I know most of us have seen it but ya'll remember Louie CK and his floating chair in the sky:



You make basically a huge building sized object fly through the sky. The physics of it are amazing. It isn't like an iPad. It isn't easy. It must be respected.

That includes all of us. I'm guessing Skywest mentions First Officers should be positive for a reason. Respect has to start somewhere and it begins with yourself.
 
BEEF SUPREME said:
I think we need to make our profession stand out as something unique in the world. I know most of us have seen it but ya'll remember Louie CK and his floating chair in the sky:

You make basically a huge building sized object fly through the sky. The physics of it are amazing. It isn't like an iPad. It isn't easy. It must be respected.

That includes all of us. I'm guessing Skywest mentions First Officers should be positive for a reason. Respect has to start somewhere and it begins with yourself.
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I taught a general chemistry lab to freshmen. Pretty ho-hum stuff, really, but the looks of wonder I got on demonstrating the black magic behind a siphon really made me wonder sometimes.

Richman
 
ian said:
to be fair the "i dont care, but someone might" line is BS....you do care otherwise you wouldn't be saying anything (not you specifically, just saying for when that phrase is used)
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Fair enough. You're right. I do care. Because when I'm arguing about how we're worth more, it helps if people do what @Derg says, and show up on time, properly attired, etc.

Again, it's a bloody stupid way to get gigged, and if they want to gig you for that, they will. I never understood hanging stuff out when you don't have to.
 
Autothrust Blue said:
Fair enough. You're right. I do care. Because when I'm arguing about how we're worth more, it helps if people do what @Derg says, and show up on time, properly attired, etc.

Again, it's a bloody stupid way to get gigged, and if they want to gig you for that, they will. I never understood hanging stuff out when you don't have to.
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I've never quite understood some people. This job can be complicated sometimes. You can put a full effort into doing everything right and still screw something up. I've never quite understood why some people were willing to phone it in on the easy stuff.

I knew a guy when I was doing the UAX flying that only updated charts for UAX stations, but kept track of all the others just in case he was sent to go do that flying. That sounds way way way harder than just doing your Jepp updates on a 2 hour leg with absolutely nothing better to do.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
I've never quite understood some people. This job can be complicated sometimes. You can put a full effort into doing everything right and still screw something up. I've never quite understood why some people were willing to phone it in on the easy stuff.

I knew a guy when I was doing the UAX flying that only updated charts for UAX stations, but kept track of all the others just in case he was sent to go do that flying. That sounds way way way harder than just doing your Jepp updates on a 2 hour leg with absolutely nothing better to do.
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Oh, for Christ's sake.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
I've never quite understood some people. This job can be complicated sometimes. You can put a full effort into doing everything right and still screw something up. I've never quite understood why some people were willing to phone it in on the easy stuff.

I knew a guy when I was doing the UAX flying that only updated charts for UAX stations, but kept track of all the others just in case he was sent to go do that flying. That sounds way way way harder than just doing your Jepp updates on a 2 hour leg with absolutely nothing better to do.
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Or the guy on our side who got caught by an FAA inspector pencil whipping his Jepp revisions. I never heard the final disposition but the FAA was discussing falsification of records, which usually turns out poorly.
 
ian said:
to be fair the "i dont care, but someone might" line is BS....you do care otherwise you wouldn't be saying anything (not you specifically, just saying for when that phrase is used)
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I gotta disagree with this.

And here's why.

I called for a checklist once and the copilot told me "hold on", kept texting and then opened up "Words with Friends". I was patient and observant to give him the benefit of the doubt for a number of minutes, however it seemed like grabassery.

I said, "We're going to push early and when I call for the checklist, that's our priority unless there's an extenuating circumstance. I'm going to rely on you to use good judgement, but the next guy may not. Trust me, there are a lot of guys in this base who may give you a poor new hire evaluation for that or just go straight to the chief pilot, but I'm not that guy, I'll just tell you like I'm telling you right now".
 
Derg said:
I gotta disagree with this.

And here's why.

I called for a checklist once and the copilot told me "hold on", kept texting and then opened up "Words with Friends". I was patient and observant to give him the benefit of the doubt for a number of minutes, however it seemed like grabassery.

I said, "We're going to push early and when I call for the checklist, that's our priority unless there's an extenuating circumstance. I'm going to rely on you to use good judgement, but the next guy may not. Trust me, there are a lot of guys in this base who may give you a poor new hire evaluation for that or just go straight to the chief pilot, but I'm not that guy, I'll just tell you like I'm telling you right now".
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And that's when they stopped letting @PeanuckleCRJ out of the sim.
 
Derg said:
I called for a checklist once and the copilot told me "hold on", kept texting and then opened up "Words with Friends". I was patient and observant to give him the benefit of the doubt for a number of minutes, however it seemed like grabassery.

I said, "We're going to push early and when I call for the checklist, that's our priority unless there's an extenuating circumstance. I'm going to rely on you to use good judgement, but the next guy may not. Trust me, there are a lot of guys in this base who may give you a poor new hire evaluation for that or just go straight to the chief pilot, but I'm not that guy, I'll just tell you like I'm telling you right now".
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Isn't there a thread on APC about a couple of Delta newhires/probies who were canned because of using their phones in the cockpit while on the ground instead of paying attention to their real job?
 
Derg said:
I gotta disagree with this.

And here's why.

I called for a checklist once and the copilot told me "hold on", kept texting and then opened up "Words with Friends". I was patient and observant to give him the benefit of the doubt for a number of minutes, however it seemed like grabassery.

I said, "We're going to push early and when I call for the checklist, that's our priority unless there's an extenuating circumstance. I'm going to rely on you to use good judgement, but the next guy may not. Trust me, there are a lot of guys in this base who may give you a poor new hire evaluation for that or just go straight to the chief pilot, but I'm not that guy, I'll just tell you like I'm telling you right now".
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Unfortunately at the regional level, at least, I think there are too few captains who will do even that. I'm all for CRM and creating an open environment, but that does not mean I disregard my duties as a captain and just let the FO do whatever he/she wants. I also prefer not to get CP's involved- in my years of doing this I've only written up three FO's. Two just could not fly and were dangerous (they both ended up being terminated years later when we transitioned to all jets as they could not make the move). The third was a wacko who, for lack of a better word, mutinied in the cockpit.
I don't make it a secret that I'm a stickler for uniforms, doing things by the book and being a professional. But I guess I do it in a way that does not chase too many pilots away as I still fly with very senior FO's and rarely see a reserve FO... so I guess I've failed at my objective of getting on every pilot's no-fly list. When that happens I don't have to work, right?
 
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Hacker15e said:
Isn't there a thread on APC about a couple of Delta newhires/probies who were canned because of using their phones in the cockpit while on the ground instead of paying attention to their real job?
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I have no clue, last time I went there was to engage Mr. "that guy is a jackwagon" and offer to buy him a beer.

There is no master of list of people who got fired and for whatever reason, so while heavily plausible, I suspect it's urban legend — at least as described on the internet.

Wait. I may have misread. Does the thread exist? I assume so. Did it actually happen? No clue.
 
Derg said:
I have no clue, last time I went there was to engage Mr. "that guy is a jackwagon" and offer to buy him a beer. There is no master of list of people who got fired and for whatever reason, so while heavily plausible, I suspect it's urban legend — at least as described on the internet. Wait. I may have misread. Does the thread exist? I assume so. Did it actually happen? No clue.
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What's APC?
 
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