Inop alternator in Seneca

W

wayne09

Well-Known Member
Anyone familiar with the Seneca know if it's airworthy to fly with one alternator inop under Day VFR? what about both alternators.

The POH equipment list didn't say it's a Required item. I've looked up the Type Certificate sheet and don't find any mentioning of alternators. Have I miss any ADs? Thanks.
 
I think you're fine as long as you can run everything you need off the one alternator. I wouldnt have any problem flying a leg if it just broke, or if i was trying to get home.
 
thanks for the quick response. I am just trying to figure out from a legality perspective, is it legal to fly.
 
I just got this exact scenario popped on me in my ME-add on. My instructor and I had flown a seminole to the checkride airport with an inop alternator. The DPE asked me "in theory" if we had an inop alternator could we legally fly it. In my head i was thinking "of course, i just did it!" ... in reality, not true. He explained it as "Piper received its certification with a plane that had two engines, two props, 3 wheels, and TWO alternators. Anything less than that is deemed unsafe and illegal"... of course you can fly it on one alternator. But legal? Definitely not, unless it has a MEL.
 
dakrt23 said:
I just got this exact scenario popped on me in my ME-add on. My instructor and I had flown a seminole to the checkride airport with an inop alternator. The DPE asked me "in theory" if we had an inop alternator could we legally fly it. In my head i was thinking "of course, i just did it!" ... in reality, not true. He explained it as "Piper received its certification with a plane that had two engines, two props, 3 wheels, and TWO alternators. Anything less than that is deemed unsafe and illegal"... of course you can fly it on one alternator. But legal? Definitely not, unless it has a MEL.
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Me thinks your DPE doesn't know what he's talking about then.

FAR 91.213

If you have no MEL then you can operate with NO alternators unless they happen to be listed as required equipment on your equipment list. However, the alternator does need to be disconnected/de-activated, logged, and labelled INOP at the alternator switch/fuse.
 
rframe said:
Me thinks your DPE doesn't know what he's talking about then.

FAR 91.213

If you have no MEL then you can operate with NO alternators unless they happen to be listed as required equipment on your equipment list. However, the alternator does need to be disconnected/de-activated, logged, and labelled INOP at the alternator switch/fuse.
Click to expand...


There is an MMEL for the PA-34 and I cannot find where it says anything about an alternator. Even if it did you would need an LOA to use an MEL.
 
looks like the MMEL is only applicable for operations under FAR 121 125 129 135.
back to original question, since the alternator(s) is not required by 91.205 Day VFR, not mentioned in the Type certification data sheet, not indicated as required on the AFM/POH, not required by ADs, it seems like we don't need alternators at all to fly legally.

I think I was once told by a mechanic that the alternator is listed in the Type Certification data sheet, but I couldn't find it. Anyone familiar with the Seneca know where is it? Thanks in advance.
 
You are correct that it is not in the TCDS. You're sure that you have a current AFM as listed in the TCDS, and that it does not require an alternator for day VFR?
 
A little addition to this thread:
A friend of mine just told me a story from going to get a $100 hamburger this weekend. While he was eating, an FAA inspector poked around the outside of his airplane. The inspector peeked through the window and happened to notice several inoperative stickers on instruments on the panel. The inspector proceeded to hassle my friend, alleging that without an MEL he could not placard those instruments inoperative...rather, he had to remove or repair them. Fortunately, my friend has been a CFI for 5 years now and knows 91.213 backwards and forwards. He pulled it up on his iDevice and showed the inspector 91.213(d).

Pwned.
 
Roger Roger said:
He pulled it up on his iDevice and showed the inspector 91.213(d).

Pwned.
Click to expand...

THIS

It's all about the deferral provision...

The flow goes... 91.213(d), 91.205, Type Cert data sheet/equip list, STCs, ADs, and is my type of operating going to require deferred equipment? Yes-Can't fly, No-Go Fly...

What do you do with inop equipment? Get it Removed/deactivated, repaired, or placard it INOP. INOP placard is required to be next to the any control, switch or indicator associated with what ever is broken.

AC 91.67 has some good reading in it too...


What I have noticed with piston twins, when something like an alternator or pneumatic pump goes out you're usually restricted to Day VFR only.
 
TwoTwoLeft said:
What I have noticed with piston twins, when something like an alternator or pneumatic pump goes out you're usually restricted to Day VFR only.
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yeah, that's why I'm a bit surprised that a current version of the OP's POH doesn't have the the alternator listed as required, though his might be old enough that it doesn't actually have a KOEL.
 
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