IFR Checkride in Actual?

K

KevinJH7

Well-Known Member
Hey guys,

This could be a stupid question but I've been searching around and haven't yet found an answer so I figured I'd ask.

I'm scheduled for my Instrument check ride on Wednesday and up here in New England the weather is not looking to promising.

Can you do an IFR check ride in actual IFR conditions? I think I had heard that you could not but I just wanted to make sure.

Thanks
 
Of course you can do an instrument checkride in actual IFR!!!! Assuming the examiner is current.
 
dc3flyer said:
Of course you can do an instrument checkride in actual IFR!!!! Assuming the examiner is current.
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:yeahthat: Yes you can, but I know more than one examiner that would not do it. For whatever reason they choose not to put their ticket on the line. Is it a valid concern? I guess that is up to the person to decide.
 
We have an examiner who only seems willing to do it if he's flown with the applicant before (like for a previous checkride). The last student I signed off had to file a flight plan for the checkride, but it cleared up really fast during the preflight/runup so they didn't get any actual.

But I'd gamble if you don't fly you will get some questions based on if you were (alternates required, mins, etc).
 
JEP said:
:yeahthat: Yes you can, but I know more than one examiner that would not do it. For whatever reason they choose not to put their ticket on the line. Is it a valid concern? I guess that is up to the person to decide.
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Put their ticket on the line? Why? I'm confused.
 
Because they would be PIC in the eyes of the FAA.

The examiner I used to use in Seattle, which also was the guy who gave me my first three rides in the 70's, was willing to fly IMC if the applicant was willing. He would warn you, though, that if he had to "take over" at any time, it was an automatic bust. As opposed to VMC, where he might feel okay about asking to see something again or give some leeway.
 
DE727UPS said:
Because they would be PIC in the eyes of the FAA.

The examiner I used to use in Seattle, which also was the guy who gave me my first three rides in the 70's, was willing to fly IMC if the applicant was willing. He would warn you, though, that if he had to "take over" at any time, it was an automatic bust. As opposed to VMC, where he might feel okay about asking to see something again or give some leeway.
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OK, that makes sense. More importantly, if they had to "take over" controls, it does make sense to bust you. . .something I would understand as an applicant.
 
dc3flyer said:
Of course you can do an instrument checkride in actual IFR!!!! Assuming the examiner is current.
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Actually does examiner have to be current?

I did my checkride in actual, he had me put my name on the flight plan, and told me once Im signed off by my instructor, Im qualified to file IFR with him.

Good thing I was the PIC, he got really disoriented during the flight when we got into actual, (I think it mightve been his first in a twin cause he got way behind just watching me) he started telling me that I was way off course, and that I needed to turn to a heading of 360, but I replied that ATC told us to fly this victor airway, he didnt believe me, so he queried ATC, and found out he was wrong. even then he still was lost, he gave up trying to figure it out and let me do my thing.
Later on in the single engine approach I busted my minimums by 50 feet. He said in the debrief that he forgave me of that mistake since he got disoriented during the first part of the flight.
 
Hey guys,

Thanks for all the responses! I only did the oral on Wednesday and that went well. I will be going for the flight part on Saturday.

Thanks,

Kevin
 
KevinJH7 said:
Hey guys,

Thanks for all the responses! I only did the oral on Wednesday and that went well. I will be going for the flight part on Saturday.

Thanks,

Kevin
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Good choice. I liked to do my checkrides in VMC. GJ on the oral!
 
Yep, I did my IR in actual. It was a great experience really. Fog rolled and lifted somewhat to about 400 feet. We had to do two ILS approaches to get down. I think it really takes away any questions if you can do it safely.
 
DE727UPS said:
Because they would be PIC in the eyes of the FAA.
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The DPE is not the PIC during a checkride.

§ 61.47 Status of an examiner who is authorized by the Administrator to conduct practical tests.

(a) An examiner represents the Administrator for the purpose of conducting practical tests for certificates and ratings issued under this part and to observe an applicant's ability to perform the areas of operation on the practical test.
(b) The examiner is not the pilot in command of the aircraft during the practical test unless the examiner agrees to act in that capacity for the flight or for a portion of the flight by prior arrangement with:
(1) The applicant; or
(2) A person who would otherwise act as pilot in command of the flight or for a portion of the flight.
 
I'd gamble the DPE wouldn't be able to entirely point the finger at the applicant if the DPE had agreed to do the checkride in actual and put his own name on the flight plan. And regardless of the regs, its clear many DPE's feel uncomfortable with the responsibility of being the in clouds with someone who may have 0 actual.
 
"(b) The examiner is not the pilot in command of the aircraft during the practical test unless the examiner agrees to act in that capacity for the flight or for a portion of the flight by prior arrangement with..."

I think what this is saying that if it's actual, the DPE does have to agree to be PIC. And they don't like doing that in IFR with a new instrument pilot. The DPE would have to agree to be PIC to conduct the flight. The applicat can't be PIC cause he's not rated. I defer to Midlife or TGrayson, but that's how I see it.
 
DE727UPS said:
"(b) The examiner is not the pilot in command of the aircraft during the practical test unless the examiner agrees to act in that capacity for the flight or for a portion of the flight by prior arrangement with..."

I think what this is saying that if it's actual, the DPE does have to agree to be PIC. And they don't like doing that in IFR with a new instrument pilot. The DPE would have to agree to be PIC to conduct the flight. The applicat can't be PIC cause he's not rated. I defer to Midlife or TGrayson, but that's how I see it.
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Why would the examiner have to agree to be PIC? What about the student pilot going for his private checkride? That flight is the first PIC flight for the student with a passenger. Same thing for the private pilot going for a checkride in IMC for his instrument rating. It is the private pilot's first flight as PIC in IFR and/or IMC.
 
BenWlson said:
What about the student pilot going for his private checkride? That flight is the first PIC flight for the student with a passenger.
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Read the rest of 61.47:
(c) "Notwithstanding the type of aircraft used during the practical test, the applicant and examiner are not subject to the requirements or limitations for the carriage of passengers that are specified in this chapter."

That is the paragraph which relieves the student pilot of the limitation of carrying passengers, which the DPE is; a passenger.

That does not releive the Private non-instrument rated applicant of having an instrument rating to file IFR. No matter what some DPE's do. It is still illegal.
 
BenWlson said:
Why would the examiner have to agree to be PIC? What about the student pilot going for his private checkride? That flight is the first PIC flight for the student with a passenger. Same thing for the private pilot going for a checkride in IMC for his instrument rating. It is the private pilot's first flight as PIC in IFR and/or IMC.
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From my understanding, because even if the regs say the PIC is at fault that doesn't protect the DPE from civil lawsuits, or even action from the FAA I'd assume. We had an examiner who made us endorse PMEL students "I find _____ competent to act as PIC of a PA-44 on the PMEL checkride" in order to give him another level of protection and someone else to point he finger at. Not to mention being in actual with a person they've never met before who isn't even rated to fly IMC adds a level of danger, and they have to give the person a checkride. And I could definately see how a jury would say "Why couldn't the DPE save the airplane? The other guy had no idea what he was doing, he'd never even been in the clouds before. What was he thinking?"

Anyways that's my understanding of the whole situation. It's more than just that the regs say the applicant is PIC. *edit* And nosehair made a great post while I was typing too :)
 
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