I wanna drive a jungle jet!

Brandon

Brandon

New Member
Sitting in recurrent chatting with another pilot whose department is getting a legacy and going on about it. Holy crap...that's a whole lot of airplane for a decent price. Myself and my chief pilot were intrigued so we hopped in the 145 sim - what a beautiful cockpit! The layout is awesome and there is tons of room...maybe even bigger than a challenger? I was always pro-CRJ from a passenger standpoint...but I gotta say the pointy end has got bombardier beat...not sure about the ramshorns, but what can you do? Is the legacy cockpit identical?

Anyways, that was the highlight of my day...it all went downhill from there culminating with a 600 RVR V1 cut...at max gross and 30 C...in an airplane that has barely any second segment climb on a good day...and to top it all off the gear wouldn't retract
banghead.gif
I think I used most of my 2 hour session just to make it to 1500 agl!
 
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Anyways, that was the highlight of my day...it all went downhill from there culminating with a 600 RVR V1 cut...at max gross and 30 C...in an airplane that has barely any second segment climb on a good day...

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Easy. Chop the throttles, pop the drag chute, and drop the hook.
 
Sweet...that's what we need. A drag chute and hook...not sure what the hook will grab on to...but we're sure to stop once it grabs the airport fence or picks up an 18 wheeler from the highway off the end of the runway. Something tells me we may have trouble getting it past transport canada...since they are still scratching their heads over GPS approaches and such.
 
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Sweet...that's what we need. A drag chute and hook...not sure what the hook will grab on to..

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Runway arresting gear maybe? You know, the ones marked with the sign that has the yellow circle, and painted yellow circles across the width of the runway?

http://www.esco-usa.com/mil/bak14.html

Check AIM 2-3-14. Additionally, drag chutes are no kidding. You won't overrun with a drag chute if aborting in a timely manner, they slow you down very quick.

Even without any of these, you might be lucky to be taking off from a runway with 61QSII/BAK-15.
 
Well we don't fly out of many military use airfields...so not much opportunity for arresting gear. Actually previous incarnations of the aircraft I fly did have a drag chute. Great to use in an abort, but I'm told that if you used it on landing it was usually just a block of ice on a string
 
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Well we don't fly out of many military use airfields...so not much opportunity for arresting gear. Great to use in an abort, but I'm told that if you used it on landing it was usually just a block of ice on a string

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That's because the chutes need to be exercised more, then there wouldn't be that problem. Old Lears and such, they left the chute packed with only the required inspections being done, and when it came time to use it, well.....

Chutes really need to be exercised more often, not only for the chute itself, but it's mechanisms back there too.

Many civvie fields have arresting gear too, both joint-use, as well as civilian only that are LRA fields.
 
OK - you need to do the following IMMEDIATELY - sit down, take a deeeep breath, and then have someone smack you back to reality!!! CRJ is the only way to go!
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Seriously, the ERJ is a good airplane and it has some things that I wish Canadair had but there is no way it's bigger - look up the physical dimensions and you'll see that it's physically impossible for the ERJ to be bigger. Also, considering the performance issues, I'm amazed that EMB managed to sell any of them as corporate airplanes unless they're really, really, really cheap.

I will admit that Canadair is getting their a$$ handed to them on a platter with the larger RJ's - EMB has them beat big time with the ERJ170/190 line.

Jason
 
From my experience sitting in the flight decks of the ERJ and the CRJ-900 during towing, the ERJ is WAY more comfortable size wise. I didn't hit my knee on the pedastal every time I climbed into the left seat. I think they're the same as far as width goes, I just think the ERJ has a smaller center console.
 
I think the 5 year warranty the legacy's come with is a big selling point. I am sure that Bombardier falls all over themselves to fix a problem that any of their airline customers have...but from what I've heard the biz jet customers don't get the greatest service sometimes. The are about 3-4 mil cheaper than a 604...narrower cabin, but longer...most baggage space out of any corporate jet I've seen (BBJ etc. not included). From a passenger standpoint the CRJs are much bigger and much more comfortable...but I still think the ERJ cockpit is bigger...and the way the seats slide outwards so you don't have to step over the pedestal is a nice touch.

The legacy's performance on paper seems decent. It will take 8 pax with full fuel, balanced field of 5500 loaded up, climb direct to 390, go 3200nm at .74, or just under 3000 at .80 with NBAA reserves. And I've heard it's cheaper per hour to operate than a hawker. Seems pretty good to me...I'll take two!
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OK - you need to do the following IMMEDIATELY - sit down, take a deeeep breath, and then have someone smack you back to reality!!! CRJ is the only way to go!
grin.gif


Seriously, the ERJ is a good airplane and it has some things that I wish Canadair had but there is no way it's bigger - look up the physical dimensions and you'll see that it's physically impossible for the ERJ to be bigger. Also, considering the performance issues, I'm amazed that EMB managed to sell any of them as corporate airplanes unless they're really, really, really cheap.

I will admit that Canadair is getting their a$$ handed to them on a platter with the larger RJ's - EMB has them beat big time with the ERJ170/190 line.

Jason

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Dude Put the pipe down.....
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Well, the Legacy does have the same Engines as the 145XR (Allison 3007-A1E) on the airframe of a 135.

The performance of the original 145ER's was and still is pretty bad (they upgraded the engines a bit on the originals), but the LR's and XR's are decent. 1000 FPM or better up to 370 is not a problem in an LR/XR, even pretty heavy (well, at least in winter, haven't flown it in summer yet). Just today we climbed straight to 370 in an LR with 10,000 lbs of fuel and a full load.

Still, it's nothing to write home about compared to a boeing, McD, or pure bred bizjet. The downside is that they're designed to be cheap....almost disposable, so our 7-8 year old 145ER's are kinda falling apart on the interior and have performance issues (usually weight restricted to the point where only 42-45 out of 50 seats can be used). Also, the Flight Director system leaves somethiung to be desired. It has problems holding the localizer with a strong x-wind or tailwind and has a tendency to do "clearing turns" when you go to direct to a fix. That and the constant barrage of "DING"s are my biggest complaints.

Otherwise, "good airplane", JMHO.
 
The E and the C are just variations of the same thing. Some of our guys have flown (and been typed in) both, and will give the nod to the C, but not by much. Neither one was ever designed to be used 6-10 hours each day, which is why they're both falling apart after 4 years.

If you hit your knee on the center console of the CRJ, try moving the seat back. I've never hit my knee on anything in that cockpit. Nor has anyone else I know, and I've been in the thing for 4+ years.
 
The Legacy cockpit is identical, and yes as somebody mentioned earlier it has the -A1E RollsRoyce/Allisons that the 145XR has as well as the winglets.

Up front the ERJ is a great plane, it's a very comfortable cockpit with a great layout. It seems a much simpler cockpit then the CRJ (no I don't want a dumb CRJ vs ERJ thread). I think it's a nice looking plane too, long and lean, the CRJ to me looks like a lawn dart that needs another foot long section added to the gear to get the wings out of the weeds on taxi.

Honestly I never even noticed the switch to ramhorns, it's the same thing...

The 145LR/XR and 135's can all handle a full load ie pax/fuel and do fine. The -ER is a dog, luckily at XJT we only have a few of them.
 
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Neither one was ever designed to be used 6-10 hours each day, which is why they're both falling apart after 4 years.


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How do you figure? They're airliners. Are you saying Canadair and Embraer both designed an airliner that's not supposed to fly 6 hours a day? I'm not saying I don't believe you, it just dosen't make sense and I'm trying to figure out where you got that information.

Oh yeah, I like the ram's head. Makes me feel all corcord-ey.
 
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How do you figure? They're airliners. Are you saying Canadair and Embraer both designed an airliner that's not supposed to fly 6 hours a day? I'm not saying I don't believe you, it just dosen't make sense and I'm trying to figure out where you got that information.

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This comes from pilots, instructors, mechanics, and yes even Bombardier reps. When Bombardier created the CRJ-100, it was not much more than a stretched Challeger. Very few bizjets were designed with the notion of flying 6-10 hours each day. A quick read through a maintenance log shows how they're not holding up compared to what a Boeing or Airbus can do.
 
They're probably a lot like the L1011's we had. When they were used for long-haul international flying, they were fantastic. But once they started getting used on ATL-Florida flights, they'd break down all the time.

I guess a good way of thinking about it would be to compare the brake conditions on a 10 year old Greyhound bus to a 10 year old city bus.
 
Ok. I'll take you guy's words for it, considering the sources. It still dosen't really make sense though.

On the other hand, considering all the APUs that have been MEL'd lately, maybe it's not so far fetched after all... start/stop cycles and whatnot.
 
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considering all the APUs that have been MEL'd lately, .

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What IS the deal with this? Even the rampers are starting to comment about it.
 
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