Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
Sure. But I'll be able to stand up all the way. That's...amazing.
I have to take back all the crap I talk about RJ pilots now...
- Thread starter Autothrust Blue
- Start date
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
SFO, ORD
ClarkGriswold
Non Nutritive Cereal Varnish Engineer
Don't trust VNAV. That's all I have. Congrats!
Lee D
Well-Known Member
Congratulations! After a time it is hard to ignore the pay difference between the Brasilia and the jets. We all made fun of the RJ's during our tenure on the Brasilia. I still haven't taken any of it back either and it has been three years since transition.
As for the comment regarding the 175 "not really being an RJ." Sorry, it's an RJ.
As for the comment regarding the 175 "not really being an RJ." Sorry, it's an RJ.
Nark
Macho Superpilot
Very valuable words. It works 98% of the time fantastically, and lulls you into a false sense of reliability. Then you do the FREDM or ANCHR arrival and you are screaming profanities why it isn't working correctly.
ZapBrannigan
If it ain’t a Boeing, I’m not going. No choice.
175 is not an RJ. I don't even know what an RJ is? It's a marketing term designed to entice airline pilots into flying an airplane for crap wages. The longer we classify airplanes into mainline/regional categories the longer we can expect the whipsaw to continue.
Do you actually use a wing-low method of some kind, or touchdown in a crab? At least in the swept wing jets I flew, you try the winglow method, you'll induce a huge descent rate or else possibly interrupt the clean airflow to the crab-direction wing via the fuselage. Don't know if large swept wing planes are the same way.
Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
You know that 10 (15?) year old Chelton VNAV works great.
B767
Well-Known Member
An ERJ-145 is not exactly a "large swept wing jet."
I've used wing low in the swept wings I've flown (granted it's all in RJs 145, CRJ 200/700) and it has worked fine without any introduction of a huge descent rate. Granted I don't kick the rudder and drop the wing until 100ft - sometimes lower. The actual large swept wings, no idea what they do.
And I don't believe any of the RJs are "approved" (again, of the ones I've flown) to land in a crab. Can do some good damage to the gear.
We will have to wait for @amorris311, @jtrain609, @ClarkGriswold, and soon @Autothrust Blue to chime in though. They fly the large swept wing jets
Last edited:
Lee D
Well-Known Member
In the Brasillia we would crab and then just before touch down kick the rudder and go wing low. The yoke design really never bothered me and I thought she handled the crosswinds like a champ.
As far as swept wing is concerned, I can only speak for the CRJ's. The 200's wing sits so low that you don't dip the wing much. Some guys just crab and then kick at about 10-20 feet. Personally I do go SLIGHTLY (less than 5 degrees) wing low in the last 10 feet or so. It's only for the final seconds and so I don't see any issue with the descent rate.
As far as swept wing is concerned, I can only speak for the CRJ's. The 200's wing sits so low that you don't dip the wing much. Some guys just crab and then kick at about 10-20 feet. Personally I do go SLIGHTLY (less than 5 degrees) wing low in the last 10 feet or so. It's only for the final seconds and so I don't see any issue with the descent rate.
An ERJ-145 is not exactly a "large swept wing jet."
I've used wing low in the swept wings I've flown (granted it's all in RJs 145, CRJ 200/700) and it has worked fine without any introduction of a huge descent rate. Granted I don't kick the rudder and drop the wing until 100ft - sometimes lower. The actual large swept wings, no idea what they do.
And I don't believe any of the RJs are "approved" (again, of the ones I've flown) to land in a crab. Can do some good damage to the gear.
Yeah, we had to land in a crab, then immediately correct alignment upon touchdown. One jet, the T-38, really had no wing; and the F-117, had a permanent 68 degree wing sweep. So again, not much wing for slow speed and/or cross controlling.
B767
Well-Known Member
Yea, that makes sense. As @Lee D said, the 200 is pretty low so we wait pretty late to actually kick it out and lower the wing no more than 5 degrees of bank (we've had some wing strike incidents in the past - incidentally that were caused by not lowering the wing and/or releasing the yoke upon touchdown and the "high" wing would then strike from improper crosswind corrections).
In the 700 I don't have a problem doing all that at 80-100ft depending on wind strength. We also bring the thrust back to idle later in the 700. People have different techniques, but I don't start the thrust reduction until 30 ft and am idle by 10ft. I fly the 200 more often so I have a feel on how much rudder to use. Whereas I always, ALWAYS, use too much or too little rudder in the 700. So I start earlier to make sure I actually get the thing going straight.
Last edited:
unclassified
Active Member
I've been using the wing low method for years in everything from a DC-9 to 727, 757, 767 and widebody Airbus.
Makes sense for those. Where's there's wing to work with. Good info.
unclassified
Active Member
A military jet might be different. You probably use the same method as for a DC-8..... crab till the very last moment then rudder it straight, while keeping the wings level. If you do it right, it's a thing of beauty. If you don't..........
Some jets could probably do it. The ones I flew, we had to actually touchdown in a crab as inducing yaw low speed just wasn't something the jet liked.
I could imagine greasing one on after doing the last second kick-out method, is a thing of beauty indeed! Like the icing on the cake for the flight.
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
All I know (other than mumblings about MAUs, SPDAs, ACEs, etc.) is that I have slats, autothrottles and a lav at my end of the cabin. Full details come November.
Nark
Macho Superpilot
If you can remember what all the acronyms are, your already half way there.
Are you doing it all in house, or at FSI in STL?
@Roger Roger
The VNAV works perfectly 100% of the time! it's the autopilot that has a mind of its own, whether it's going to be coupled to it.
Wing low in the crosswind works really well. I've pulled some surprisingly smooth touch downs with a stiff crosswind. When it's dead clam and 12,000', I tend to slam it on.
Are you doing it all in house, or at FSI in STL?
@Roger Roger
The VNAV works perfectly 100% of the time! it's the autopilot that has a mind of its own, whether it's going to be coupled to it.
Wing low in the crosswind works really well. I've pulled some surprisingly smooth touch downs with a stiff crosswind. When it's dead clam and 12,000', I tend to slam it on.
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
In theory October and later classes (November for me) are going to be Denver. I'm pretty sure that's actually coming to fruition.
Similar threads
