I hate NDBs

taseal said:
for the arc, clearance was
(were at 335 outbound)
Intercept tack 360 outbound to 15 DME, then arc W to 270 (this was what he means)
what he said was ( i stil have he paper that I wrote the cleanrace on)
Intercept and track 180 heading (i'm not sure if he said heading, but I have 180 out) outbound, at 15 DME, arc North
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It's hard to tell whether it's an instructor issue or not. Intercepting the 180 outbound makes some sense from your initial location, if the arc he wanted you to track was on the south side of the VOR.

Is this a published arc or one he's making up?
 
tgrayson said:
It's hard to tell whether it's an instructor issue or not. Intercepting the 180 outbound makes some sense from your initial location, if the arc he wanted you to track was on the south side of the VOR.

Is this a published arc or one he's making up?
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no, it wouldn't have been 180 (south of VOR) radial.... we don't train south of the miami airport... apparently I was going the right way too he said, because he was like 'dude you forgot to arc, you passed right by your 15 DME mark'

no, we just make them up
 
taseal said:
no, it wouldn't have been 180 (south of VOR) radial.... we don't train south of the miami airport... apparently I was going the right way too he said, because he was like 'dude you forgot to arc, you passed right by your 15 DME mark'

no, we just make them up
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Well, you're in a difficult position. You might consider calling up approach control on the telephone and ask them how they would phrase such instructions. That way you could just say to your instructor "Approach said this....".
 
tgrayson said:
Well, you're in a difficult position. You might consider calling up approach control on the telephone and ask them how they would phrase such instructions. That way you could just say to your instructor "Approach said this....".
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thats a real good idea....

any idea where I can get Miami (or FLL's) approach control's phone number? airnav doesn't have it
 
taseal said:
thats a real good idea....

any idea where I can get Miami (or FLL's) approach control's phone number?
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I have a book at home with all the numbers, but in the meantime, you should be able to get it from the Flight Service Station.

I would wait until an off-peak time to call. As long as they're not busy, controllers are usually happy to answer questions. Be prepared with specific scenarios and write down what they say.
 
tgrayson said:
I have a book at home with all the numbers, but in the meantime, you should be able to get it from the Flight Service Station.

I would wait until an off-peak time to call. As long as they're not busy, controllers are usually happy to answer questions. Be prepared with specific scenarios and write down what they say.
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sounds good... I'll call them later on tonight when they aren't so busy. when you get home, would you mind PMing me the number?
 
taseal said:
sounds good... I'll call them later on tonight when they aren't so busy. when you get home, would you mind PMing me the number?
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No problem. (The book is 6-7 years old and I know that MEM has changed phone numbers in the meantime, so I can't guarantee they're still current.)
 
I've done two NDB approaches in actual conditions... in 121 flying. What airport? Chicago Midway. The localizer was down, so they reverted to the only approach a /A aircraft could fly. The NDB approach. My first 121 checkride consisted of an NDB approach to a missed, followed by an NDB hold. So yeah, NDB usage is still alive and well, even in the passenger airlines.

I've talked about NDBs with a few FOs out on the line, and I was surprised how many have never flown an NDB approach. Not a major problem, because we don't fly NDB approaches, but we do have many approaches that are followed by an NDB hold. We also have some departure procedures that require flying an NDB track (such as Quebec).

I highly recommend becoming familiar with them at some point in your training.
 
Even though we don't do NDB approaches, we do have some examiners that like to give upgrade candidates a missed approach involving tracking to and holding at an NDB on their type ride. I've heard of people busting on that.....
 
Easy way to remember VOR radial intercept tracking:

FROM TOP
TO BOTTOM

If you are dealing with an HSI...place the head on the approach course, or:

LIKE HEADING, LIKE SETTING
 
SoCalAprch said:
Also is Good Ol FV still wearing his dirty leisure/jogging suits everyday at VGT???
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every day....he gave a lecture to a guy from PA, "oh yeah, and you might want to borrow some money and look a little more professional tomorrow when you fail you check ride" FV is the worst thing to happen to ATP...he makes students hate flying, and makes them fear failure, and guarantees it by doing so...a**hole
 
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