I hate NDBs

v1valarob said:
Actually we filed for the DME ARC into Paso Robles and then did the GPS into San Luis ( I think ) and then continued up to Half Moon Bay. So we shot 3 approaches in one trip. Approach was really cool about it.

And yes, Franky Varsolona still wears the jumpsuit every effin' day of the week. Look at my signature at the bottom. His wonderful words of advice to me.

-Rob
Click to expand...


Half Moon Bay has to be one of the best airports in the country. Amazing placement, awesome approach. One of the best memories I have of all my flying is there in a brand new PA-44 Seminole and parking next to a vintage straightback tail 172 that was a polished metal and blue trim. Then walking out the magical gate to the best seafood joint and eating a salmon burger on the beach. To top it off, taking off and flying over the golden gate then up towards Oakland for a bay tour. Amazing airport, gives me goose bumps and a tear in my eye (albeit a very happy one) when I think of it.
 
v1valarob said:
Funny, ATP pulled the ADF and NDBs out of the seminoles so when we do our checkride we dont do anything on them. We didnt even talk about them during training. So we have a bunch of instrument rated and MEIIs who dont know how an NDB works. :D

-Rob
Click to expand...

Hey!! Speak for yourself kojack!!!


SoCalAprch said:
Also is Good Ol FV still wearing his dirty leisure/jogging suits everyday at VGT???
Click to expand...

YUM YUM!!!
 
Desired course, head of the needle, intercept... Track a bearing TO the station.
Tail of the needle, desired course, intercept... Track a bearing FROM the station.

We have a published NDB approach at KGXY, though it's technically a LOM. The ADF truly is the most easy and smple instrument on the panel. It points TO the station. How much easier can it get? I agree with a previous comment that it's really being overthought. Perhaps it's not being explained clearly enough which tells me the person doing the explaining might not have a good grasp on it either.

When you fly across Kansas, and the VORs are spaced far apart, an NDB can give a good picture of where you are. If you're tracking a radial, and you set the ADF to receive an NDB, you know exactly where you are by using the relative bearing TO the station (typically as it's passing 90 degrees). Yes, you can use DME if your plane is equiped with it, but you still have to get out your plotter to find where that DME distance is.

I know they're going away. My instructor says that when ADFs go bad they aren't even being repaired, but replaced typically with a GPS unit. It's the way things are going. I find it sad, but the world marches on, and old technologies are retired for new ones.

Personally, I like them and they're simple.

Just my $0.02...

Jeff
 
aviatormar said:
Half Moon Bay has to be one of the best airports in the country. Amazing placement, awesome approach. One of the best memories I have of all my flying is there in a brand new PA-44 Seminole and parking next to a vintage straightback tail 172 that was a polished metal and blue trim. Then walking out the magical gate to the best seafood joint and eating a salmon burger on the beach. To top it off, taking off and flying over the golden gate then up towards Oakland for a bay tour. Amazing airport, gives me goose bumps and a tear in my eye (albeit a very happy one) when I think of it.
Click to expand...

Hey, I played golf there once. Beautiful area.
 
aviator1968 said:
Desired course, head of the needle, intercept... Track a bearing TO the station.
Tail of the needle, desired course, intercept... Track a bearing FROM the station.
Click to expand...

Personally, I never bought into all that technical crap. The best way I learned (and all other Radio Nav) is to picture it on a map, like you do for holding patterns.

You're on the 130 radial, so picture a dot with the 130' ray, and you on it. Then picture where the recip. of the 330 (150) radial is, and you know which way to turn (dependant on your heading). Makes it like playing risk or sorry or some other VERY simple game.

Take your head out of the cockpit, and it's a cinch.


aviator1968 said:
Personally, I like them and they're simple.
Click to expand...
:yeahthat:
 
I use them about every day, and there are plenty of times where I've had to shoot them in actual. I truely think it's one of the easiest approaches to do, once you get the hang of it.

If your company is approved for NDB approaches, you'll have to do one for a type ride at least.
 
v1valarob said:
Funny, ATP pulled the ADF and NDBs out of the seminoles so when we do our checkride we dont do anything on them. We didnt even talk about them during training. So we have a bunch of instrument rated and MEIIs who dont know how an NDB works. :D
Click to expand...

Are you guys proud of this? Unbelievable. There are plenty of companies that still are authorized to and do fly NDB approaches on a regular basis. My sim partner at Eagle--who trained at ATP--had never used an NDB in his life when he got there. It doesn't get much more embarassing than having to take the time to be taught the most basic type of instrument approach in a $20 million simulator.
 
zmiller4 said:
Are you guys proud of this? Unbelievable. There are plenty of companies that still are authorized to and do fly NDB approaches on a regular basis. My sim partner at Eagle--who trained at ATP--had never used an NDB in his life when he got there. It doesn't get much more embarassing than having to take the time to be taught the most basic type of instrument approach in a $20 million simulator.
Click to expand...

I agree they're dying, but they're not getting decomissioned that fast.

Not to mention it's in the Airplane Flying Handbook...which makes it fair game in the oral. I guess it doesn't matter when you train for the checkride though.
 
My airline flies NDB approaches - and for one city that we serve the NDB-A is the only way into the airport if it is IMC.

When you have an RMI it makes flying an NDB pretty easy - it's even easier if you have an FMS. None of the turn the knob to get the heading card matched up with your heading kind of thing that you had during your instrument training.

I talked with a Saab checkairman at Eagle and he said he cringed when the training airport they used went IFR and he told the newhire to tune in the NDB and go direct. The check airman ended up doing the approach himself.
 
the USA is the only country that is starting to decomission NDB's, they are still quite prevalent everywhere else in the world. get to know them, they are really easy. if you take the thinking out of it, and just draw a picture (until you can visualize in your head what you want to do) they are the easiest type of approaches to do.

i hate teaching CFII applicants who will be flying glass airplanes and teaching in glass airplanes but don't understand or have desire to learn the NDB/ADF. they just don't seem to understand that the RMI in the glass panel is the EXACT same thing.

argh!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top