Hot: Air France Jet Missing (AF 447)

Man that gave me chills thinking about what it was like to have an aircraft break up in flight and plumet to the earth from FL350!:panic: I hope they were all unconcious.:(
 
Cruise said:
I just attended an 'High Altitude Physiology' lecture and flight at the UND altitude chamber yesterday and OA is exactly right. TUC could be as low as 30 seconds at FL350....and the decline is not linear. At FL430 and above it could be as little as 9 seconds. Regardless, most people will be taking a snooze long before they hit the ground (water). Not to mention the extreme cold at higher altitudes.
Click to expand...

What were your symptoms?

Mine have remained constant over the decades... singleness of thought, slight euphoria, tingling in the fingers.
 
I would think a lot of the poor souls were unconscious fairly quickly - not from O2 issues, but from the sheer violence of a breakup. Some pretty serious acceleration forces were at work.
 
Orange Anchor said:
What were your symptoms?

Mine have remained constant over the decades... singleness of thought, slight euphoria, tingling in the fingers.
Click to expand...


My symptoms were similar.
Euphoria was the most notable, without question. Once I was becoming hypoxic, I had a difficult time not laughing (didn't help we were listening to an aviation speaker/ comedian on the ascent....so I was already in a 'good' mood. :laff:).
The other symptom was singleness of thought. I was chosen to perform a task w/ playing cards. I was instructed to look at a card once, show it to the others, properly place it in a container w/ 4 suited slots, then state what the card was. Well, lets just say the others were having a great time at my expense. I did well on the first few cards....and it all went downhill from there. Apparently, I became fixated on the 7 of spades. Because I said about 5 cards in a row were the 7 of spades. Those still on O2 were laughing at me. The good Doc running the chamber was talking to me and asking me if I was certain about my card. Duh....yeah, I am. That's what it was....I remember. ;)

Good times. What a great experience! I highly recommend anyone to do this if they have an opportunity. I learned a lot and had a good time doing it.
 
Most seem to think the training is only for guys/gals going above 18,000ft or so but even if you only go VFR at 9.5 or 10.5, it is a good lesson. It can and does sneak up on you no matter how good you think you are. Also, spend a day doing cross country at 9.5 and you will be one tired dog at the end of the day.
 
does these symptoms show up after a cross country on a trainer??at constant cruise of about FL 100?well, its really amazing how human brain behaves once it lacks the O2.
 
bravoalphakilo said:
does these symptoms show up after a cross country on a trainer??at constant cruise of about FL 100?well, its really amazing how human brain behaves once it lacks the O2.
Click to expand...

Go to Denver or ABQ and run around for a while. See what symptoms you have.

But yes. Most airliners/bizjets have a cabin around 7800ft (max alt) and crews wonder why they feel tired after a day at 7800ft (slightly hypoxic) drinking coffee (diuretic -- read dehydrated) and in a very dry atmosphere (read dehydrated) and after eating crummy meals. It's actually a wonder more events don't happen.

And yes, I have spent a few days wandering around in my Swift at higher altitudes and I recognized the fatigue as an effect of the duration at 10.5 and 11.5.
 
Cruise said:
The good Doc running the chamber was talking to me and asking me if I was certain about my card. Duh....yeah, I am. That's what it was....I remember. ;)

Good times. What a great experience! I highly recommend anyone to do this if they have an opportunity. I learned a lot and had a good time doing it.
Click to expand...


PLEASE tell me you had the ride with DOC JENSEN!! absolutely a man among men. great professor. smarter than i will ever be. really A+ upstanding guy.


as far as the altitude chamber ride goes.... i dunno, it wasnt so terribly eye opening to me, more like "this is exactly what i expected".

and im a smoker too... did just fine putting the round peg in round hole...
 
TXaviator said:
and im a smoker too... did just fine putting the round peg in round hole...
Click to expand...

I have read that as a smoker, you are frequently hypoxic and thus your body compensates by creating additional red blood cells. And thus, your symptoms may differ.

Just don't light up when near 100% oxy..:D
 
Last I heard the authorities officially said "We have no idea what happened, no clue at all". And they've asked for a truck load of funds to continue investigating.
 
By JOAN LOWY, Associated Press Writer – Thu Sep 3, 2:08 pm ET
WASHINGTON – U.S. officials on Thursday ordered the replacement of Airbus airspeed sensors of the type suspected of playing a role in the loss of Air France Flight 447 and all 228 people aboard in June.
The Federal Aviation Administration said in a notice published in the Federal Register that U.S. airlines operating Airbus A330s and A340s must replace on each plane within 120 days at least two of three sensors made by European electronics giant Thales Corp. The approved replacements are made by North Carolina-based Goodrich Corp.
The order affects 43 U.S. registered planes — 32 operated by Northwest Airlines, now part of Delta Air Lines, and 11 operated by US Airways. All are A330s; there are no A340s registered in the U.S.
FAA said the order was based on "numerous reports" that the sensors, called Pitot tubes, can become blocked at high altitudes in stormy weather. When that happens, it can lead to a loss of airspeed information or inaccurate information.
Northwest and US Airways had already replaced their older Thales Pitot tubes with newer model tubes. Since then, US Airways has installed Goodrich tubes to replace the Thales replacement, spokesman Morgan Durant said.
Delta spokeswoman Ashley Black said the airline is working with Airbus and Goodrich to make the replacements by FAA's deadline.
 
arkavgal said:
Isn't Air France responsible for maintaining the AOA probes, unless it was linked to a manufacturing defect?
Click to expand...

It froze due to the weather they flew in.

I don't agree with the lawsuit at all. I think you can really attribute it all to pilot error, up to and including the weather they initially flew into. They did effectively stall a perfectly good airplane into the water. Now, suing Air France for that and calling pilot training into question? I might be a bit more into that.

When I was instructing on the Airbus, our sim was the first sim in the country to be high altitude stall and upset certified, and it was a result of AF447. We built several scenarios to train this.
 
Inverted said:
It froze due to the weather they flew in.

I don't agree with the lawsuit at all. I think you can really attribute it all to pilot error, up to and including the weather they initially flew into. They did effectively stall a perfectly good airplane into the water. Now, suing Air France for that and calling pilot training into question? I might be a bit more into that.

When I was instructing on the Airbus, our sim was the first sim in the country to be high altitude stall and upset certified, and it was a result of AF447. We built several scenarios to train this.
Click to expand...
This is what I was thinking as well, it's good they train for it now, but it seems like basic airmanship to me.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top