Hot: Air France Jet Missing (AF 447)

Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Looking at the top right, isn't that the chart for tonight?

Yup. Still a large area covered by pretty frequent heavy activity and probably not easily ignored by any dispatcher?
I mean holy cow - I guess you go poke your way through stuff like this?

DarrenF - I think they "assumed" lightning strike based on the electrical failure messages received. Wonder what ALT was selected for this?
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Hmm I can't get any closer than 8 hours after the last communication.... 0414 UTC... but I guess it gives a good idea of what it was like...
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Yup. Still a large area covered by pretty frequent heavy activity and probably not easily ignored by any dispatcher?

Darren F - I think they "assumed" lightning strike based on the electrical failure messages received. Wonder what ALT was selected for this?



fixed it.... ;)
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

I cant find it on the news anywhere! Its all about the GM bk. WTF! I hope they made it somehow. Godbless them
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

It was on at the top of the hour. they will cover it again soon, i am sure.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

I believe the xxx means the bases are indetermined.... or perhaps they don't show since the chart "starts at FL260. In any case... embedded T-Storms that are 22,000 feet tall at least.... phew.... don't know if I would have liked flying through there...
On the High/Mid it's from FL260 to FL420 but it may be below 260, that's just where the chart is. But let's be honest, embedded TS tend to start well below the alt any of us would be flying across the pond at.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

I suppose it's silly at this point to hope everyone is ok, but still hoping.

As far as lightning having something to do with an accident, I can conjure up a few worse case scenarios, but most of that kinda stuff it thought out in the design phse. It has happened, in the past, that transients (lightning) will arc across a bus and start a fire. Anyway, long story short, it's a tough sell lightning brought it down.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Sur l'océanique il n'y a pas de radar,ils ont surement perdus contact radio....d'aprés un forum,a prendre avec modération ces informations,"c'est un A330 F-GZCP,et le pilote a demander a un autre pilote portugais si c'est normal d'étre a court de carburant en millieu du vols"!!


PARIS (Reuters) - Un Airbus d'Air France qui effectuait la liaison Rio de Janeiro-Paris a disparu dans la nuit de dimanche à lundi avec 228 personnes à son bord.

Une panne de circuit électrique a été signalée à bord de l'avion lors d'un orage et Air France n'exclut pas que l'appareil, un Airbus A330-200, a pu être foudroyé.

Le vol AF447 a disparu des écrans radar après avoir émis un message automatique signalant une panne de circuit électrique.

"L'appareil a traversé une zone orageuse avec fortes turbulences à deux heures du matin (heure universelle), soit 04h00 heure de Paris. Un message automatique a été reçu à 02h14 (04h14 heure de Paris) indiquant une panne de circuit électrique", a indiqué la compagnie dans un communiqué.

Deux cent seize passagers étaient à bord - 126 hommes, 82 femmes, sept enfants et un bébé -, ainsi que douze membres d'équipage.

"L'hypothèse la plus tragique doit être sérieusement envisagée", a déclaré sur France Info Jean-Louis Borloo, ministre de tutelle des Transports.

"A l'heure où je vous parle, l'avion n'est certainement plus en vol, il n'a plus de réserve de pétrole", a renchéri Pierre-Henri Gourgeon, le directeur général d'Air France, lors d'une conférence de presse.

"La dernière zone de contact est très éloignée des côtes", a-t-il indiqué.

L'appareil avait quitté Rio dimanche à 19h00 heure locale (22h00 GMT) et devait arriver à 11h15 (09h15 GMT) au terminal 2E de l'aéroport Paris-Charles de Gaulle.

L'armée de l'air brésilienne a dit avoir entamé des recherches au-dessus de l'océan Atlantique. Des avions ont décollé de l'île de Fernando de Noronha, au nord-est des côtes brésiliennes, pour tenter de localiser l'appareil.

RECHERCHES EN MER

L'aviation brésilienne a perdu la trace du vol AF447 à 01h33 GMT (03h30 heure française), soit trois heures et demi après le décollage, a fait savoir l'armée de l'air brésilienne.

L'appareil venait de dépasser les îles Fernando de Noronha, à 350 km de la côte brésilienne, au moment du dernier contact radar. Les tentatives effectuées pour reprendre le contact une heure plus tard sont restées vaines, a-t-elle précisé.

La France a de son côté dépêché sur zone un appareil qui a décollé du Sénégal, a déclaré l'ambassadeur de France à Dakar.

Le vol Air France AF447, avec 228 personnes à bord, avait quitté Rio dimanche à 19h00, heure locale (22h00 GMT) et devait arriver à 11h15 (09h15 GMT) au terminal 2E de l'aéroport Paris-Charles de Gaulle.

A l'aéroport de Roissy Charles de Gaulle, les proches des passagers ont été reçus dans un lieu spécialement réservé à l'aérogare et une cellule de crise a été mise en place.

Le président Nicolas Sarkozy est attendu à Roissy dans l'après-midi (à 16h45 heure de Paris), a fait savoir l'Elysée. Le chef de l'Etat "a exprimé sa très vive inquiétude".

Le chef de l'Etat a "demandé au gouvernement et aux administrations concernées de tout mettre en oeuvre pour retrouver la trace de l'avion et faire au plus vite la lumière sur les circonstances de sa disparition", a précisé l'Elysée.

Jean-Baptiste Vey, Gérard Bon et Clément Guillou





this is the planes registration number A330 F-GZCP
what caught my attention in this quote is that the AF pilot asked another portuguese pilot (probably same AC) if it was normal to be short of Fuel in the middle of the flight .
the lightning strike theory came after the plane emmited electrical problems messages at 0414 Z
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

WTF!! I've got rust too. Are you telling me there was a thunderstorm that stretched all the way across the south atlantic:confused: If so, why would they try and fly through it, they can't go around it.
 

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Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

It says "occasional embedded", I'm not sure what the levels are but it wouldn't be solid.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

WTF!! I've got rust too. Are you telling me there was a thunderstorm that stretched all the way across the south atlantic:confused: If so, why would they try and fly through it, they can't go around it.

I thought I read occasional embedded CB in that area.

So you are flying in the goo and bam, TS. I am sure they were trying to pick their way through it, but maybe they have to penetrate some weather at some point. No idea what happened, but if you had a lightening induced electrical problem, in heavy turbulence, I would fear for some sort of upset. But who knows?.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

WTF!! I've got rust too. Are you telling me there was a thunderstorm that stretched all the way across the south atlantic:confused: If so, why would they try and fly through it, they can't go around it.

Nope, just a cloudband, unstable conditions and activity that stretched that far with embedded cells inside. To me this sounds more and more like a inflight breakup caused by flying through this stuff. There was probably no other way than to penetrate anyways? I don't know if the big guys go poke around trying to find the best way as we do on occasion but I still don't get why a lightning strike (unless it actually penetrates and burns a hole or causes an inflight fire) would bring such a large Tylenol down. Maybe some sort of turbulence and heavy windshears as it looks like they had quite some 90 knots from the side?
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

It says "occasional embedded", I'm not sure what the levels are but it wouldn't be solid.

Whenever it says embedded - that's a red flag.... you won't be able to see the T-Storm you're flying into (even at night).... and your radar return of such a storm may be lying to you since there is potentially a lot of rain in the return in front of it.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

I don't speak french but if there is a quote about fuel it does make one wonder. Wasn't the Air Transat an A330 or was it a A300?

However I am starting to think that they may have had an electircal emergency, lost their primarys while in IMC and heavy turbulence and got into an unusual attitude/upset situation.

All speculation of course. God bless all the souls presumed lost.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Don't the black boxes send out signals? I guess I'm just a little surprised at the absolute lack of anything.... though I suppose the ocean IS big and there's a lot of square acreage to cover to find anything.

I've been out most of the morning, and haven't had the chance to catch up on the most recent news with this.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Don't the black boxes send out signals? I guess I'm just a little surprised at the absolute lack of anything.... though I suppose the ocean IS big and there's a lot of square acreage to cover to find anything.

I've been out most of the morning, and haven't had the chance to catch up on the most recent news with this.
I think the new ones have "pingers" that can be used to find them if they are ever submerged in water.
 
Re: Hot: Air France Jet Missing

Don't the black boxes send out signals? I guess I'm just a little surprised at the absolute lack of anything.... though I suppose the ocean IS big and there's a lot of square acreage to cover to find anything.

I've been out most of the morning, and haven't had the chance to catch up on the most recent news with this.


They did send something. This is from MSNBC. RIP to all aboard. What a terrible accident.


Signal indicated electrical problems
About a half-hour after that, the plane sent an automatic signal indicating electrical problems while going through strong turbulence, Air France said.
The plane "crossed through a thunderous zone with strong turbulence" at 10 p.m. EDT Sunday and an automatic message was received fourteen minutes later reporting electrical failure and a loss of cabin pressure.
 
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