Horizon pilot union goes to court over bonus

Just one of the many, blatant violations the company has made against our CBA. Thankfully this lawsuit is happening...maybe QX will return to the table and actually try to make a fix.
 
SurferLucas said:
Just one of the many, blatant violations the company has made against our CBA. Thankfully this lawsuit is happening...maybe QX will return to the table and actually try to make a fix.
Click to expand...

So the lawsuit is about taking the bonus away, or improper implementation of it. I'm a little confused.
 
CoffeeIcePapers said:
Doesn't the bonus ultimately benefit the pilot group, as it gets fresh butts in the seats to allow for movement? Seems shortsighted to me.
Click to expand...

The only people who care about getting fresh blood are the very junior people who have been sitting on the bottom of the seniority list for 1 or more years. But nobody cares about their opinions. The rest of the pilots think that since new pilots are something the company needs, it should be willing to cough up to get them, and everyone should benefit from that instead of just the newest new hires.

Unrelated fact: reserve line holders at Horizon cannot pick up trips, even on their days off. Definitely no dropping reserve days to pick up trips like you can at other places.
 
CoffeeIcePapers said:
Doesn't the bonus ultimately benefit the pilot group, as it gets fresh butts in the seats to allow for movement? Seems shortsighted to me.
Click to expand...

Two issues.

First, all pay negotiations, under the RLA must take place between the company and the union. Arguably (and case law elsewhere shows this to be true) bonuses are pay and as such should be negotiated with the union. The argument companies tend to make in this case is that a new hire isn't actually a part of the union (and subject to the bargaining rules) until they pass sim or IOE or something like that. That point is normally defined in the contract. If a company makes that argument, generally then the bonus needs to be paid prior to then, which most places don't want to do.

The second issue is that is isn't in a pilot group's (as a whole) interest to have a company spend money on new hire bonuses. IF a company is a desirable place to work at (due to their pay and work rules) then people will go there. Bonuses are simply a band aid on a problem that do nothing to solve ongoing issues.



thevideographer said:
The only people who care about getting fresh blood are the very junior people who have been sitting on the bottom of the seniority list for 1 or more years. But nobody cares about their opinions. The rest of the pilots think that since new pilots are something the company needs, it should be willing to cough up to get them, and everyone should benefit from that instead of just the newest new hires.

Unrelated fact: reserve line holders at Horizon cannot pick up trips, even on their days off. Definitely no dropping reserve days to pick up trips like you can at other places.
Click to expand...

Lots of people care about their opinions. It's just that often times there opinions are very short sighted and do little to further the career prospects (including their own) of the pilots at that airline.

And not that many places allow you to pick up open time on days off unless they are super short on those days and fat on your actual reserve days.
 
BobDDuck said:
And not that many places allow you to pick up open time on days off unless they are super short on those days and fat on your actual reserve days.
Click to expand...

I have worked at three regionals and they all allow reserves to pick up open time on their days off. Horizon is the first one I have heard of that doesn't allow it.
 
flyinggreasemnky said:
I have worked at three regionals and they all allow reserves to pick up open time on their days off. Horizon is the first one I have heard of that doesn't allow it.
Click to expand...

So what happens if you make yourself illegal for a reserve call on your scheduled reserve days? Do they just drop them?
 
The article said:
“Any adjustment to work rules or pay that is not negotiated, and is implemented unilaterally is considered a status quo violation,” said Captain Jeff Cox, a pilot with Horizon Air.
Click to expand...

The Teamsters seem to have this weird hard-on for calling everything a status-quo violation. It hasn't worked for them yet. To me, the court is just going to refer them to the NMB.
 
Yes, thank
thevideographer said:
The only people who care about getting fresh blood are the very junior people who have been sitting on the bottom of the seniority list for 1 or more years. But nobody cares about their opinions. The rest of the pilots think that since new pilots are something the company needs, it should be willing to cough up to get them, and everyone should benefit from that instead of just the newest new hires.

Unrelated fact: reserve line holders at Horizon cannot pick up trips, even on their days off. Definitely no dropping reserve days to pick up trips like you can at other places.
Click to expand...

Yet another reason why the stratified pay scale hurts the regionals; pilots and the airline alike.
 
CoffeeIcePapers said:
Doesn't the bonus ultimately benefit the pilot group, as it gets fresh butts in the seats to allow for movement? Seems shortsighted to me.
Click to expand...

This is America, and we're a nation of laws. The law says that matters of pay are a mandatory area of bargaining. If the company attempts to change pay without negotiating, either up or down, they're violating the law. Unions and company's are required to follow the law, and don't get to choose which ones they follow.
 
jtrain609 said:
This is America, and we're a nation of laws. The law says that matters of pay are a mandatory area of bargaining. If the company attempts to change pay without negotiating, either up or down, they're violating the law. Unions and company's are required to follow the law, and don't get to choose which ones they follow.
Click to expand...

So why are the other unions OK with other places like Envoy, Endeavor, PSA, Republic, etc, all paying bonuses? That's what I don't understand. There seems to be actual movement at these places.
 
SurferLucas said:
Just one of the many, blatant violations the company has made against our CBA. Thankfully this lawsuit is happening...maybe QX will return to the table and actually try to make a fix.
Click to expand...
What do Horizon guys think of AAG acquiring Virgin America?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top