ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
QFFT.
Seriously. I've come very near death in aero-machines, and have lost friends. Both are incredibly life changing experiences. Both suck. Both learn you not to be a dumbass. Alaska teaches this sort of thing fairly quickly.
Hired. Again.
- Thread starter GX
- Start date
QFFT.
Seriously. I've come very near death in aero-machines, and have lost friends. Both are incredibly life changing experiences. Both suck. Both learn you not to be a dumbass. Alaska teaches this sort of thing fairly quickly.
ShortField
No one of consequence
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
Coors Light? What are you? Some kind of hoity-toity aristocrat? ;-)
Nark
Macho Superpilot
GX,
There are some great Alaskan Aviators in this specific thread. I wouldn't hesitate to put my family on their birds.
Yours, no. You have less than 50 hours flying in the most austere environment this continent can offer, and you are being condescending to those who have 10-100 times that amount.
I've been in the sandbox, I've been shot at, I've also flown in large parts of that state. There are times flying that I was positive I was only 30 seconds from my death. I never got that feeling in Iraq.
Your previous life as a military bubba doesn't mean squat to Mother Nature. And she always bats last.
There are some great Alaskan Aviators in this specific thread. I wouldn't hesitate to put my family on their birds.
Yours, no. You have less than 50 hours flying in the most austere environment this continent can offer, and you are being condescending to those who have 10-100 times that amount.
I've been in the sandbox, I've been shot at, I've also flown in large parts of that state. There are times flying that I was positive I was only 30 seconds from my death. I never got that feeling in Iraq.
Your previous life as a military bubba doesn't mean squat to Mother Nature. And she always bats last.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
I'd like to add that it's probably a good lesson to honestly admit, reflect upon, recognize and realize that what you don't know is what will get you killed. It's not about what you do know or think you know. It's all the things that one has yet to learn or experience. That is true for all pilots flying any equipment anywhere. In AK IMO, it's just magnified. Very magnified.
"Common sense. It's not something you can teach. You need a certain amount of luck and you need a certain amount of experience. If you get away with something once, you have to be smart enough not to try to get away with it twice." - Terry Holliday
z987k
Well-Known Member
Oh boy is it ever. "We just do it."
Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
You know what's funny is that what is considered nuts in some parts of the state is daily operations in other parts. I, for example, think they guys out in Beth-hole flying without all the magic we have are nuts. On the other hand folks from some parts of the state think southeast is a death trap. I guess it's all in what you're used to.
The guys flying around with Phase I rigs in BET all have MX200s with traffic and all that, so the only magic they're really missing is the EFIS. Also, MUCH less to hit in BET until you get out to the coast or head north to the Yukon, or go up the Kusko to Aniak. You really can takeoff about of BET, climb to 500, go direct to about 75% of the destinations out there and not hit anything.
Hacker15e
Who am I? Where are my pants?
This is also a source of friction between different flying communities in the USAF; for example, some of what is considered everyday actions/decisions/airmanship in the fighter community is considered outrageous/rogue/reckless in the heavy community.
In fact, we have had such conflicts of opinion very close to that on this very board between military fighter/trainer guys (myself, MikeD, ///AMG, bunk22) and the 121 commuter/transport category types.
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
Give one of the guys on here a shout when you do it. They'll help you find a guide.
Or a crazy kind of person...sometimes I wonder about myself.
Everything in this paragraph is part of why I elected to go back to Alaska. I was bored and broke flying around down south - I didn't find much enjoyment or much challenge in my work - and as a result I started to get a might complacent. Up here, the second you get complacent, Mama Nature let's you know you're being an idiot and you mellow out again for awhile.
It is the most challenging flying that I can do that I know of, and the challenge extends beyond simply "flying" it extends to things like: knowing everybody's name in 5 villages, answering phones, loading airplanes, and generally being involved in "flight ops" from day to day. It requires knowing when flying exactly by the rules will get you killed and when you need to improvise to keep safe. Case in point, a Navajo pilot filled out an ASAP report for intentionally departing a field with a broken-but-safely-flyable airplane because if he would have stayed he would have frozen to death in the -45 weather on the two mile walk back to the village. You've got to know how to keep from banging up props in the spring on gravel, and when to land-or-go-around on glare-ice in the winter.
I love the people I meet here, the places and towns I see, and the great outdoors I get to live in. The only only drawback is that it is somewhat "self-limiting" in the long run. I'll probably never fly a "great-big-jet" unless I get lucky, or never fly from beach-house to beach-house for some millionaire. I'll probably never make the kind of money an airline pilot makes in the long term - but that's ok to me. I'll be home every night and be able to watch my son grow up directly instead of through Skype.
As an anecdote, I spent 3 years in the lower 48 bouncing around flying freight, I can think of one or two accidents I was "relatively close to" in terms of people I know, or geography. Since I've been back there are 4 or 5 that are fairly close to me in terms of either "friends of friends," "companies I worked for," or "happened going into places I go into."
Just looking at accident data for the year to date, it looks like there were about 180 people killed in aviation accidents in the US. 6.7% of those happened in Alaska. Looks like we're right on track for another average year.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
ppragman..........That was an interesting and thoughtful response. I am working like a dog (and not enjoying it right now -ugh) and when I have time on Sunday, and can actually think and put two coherent sentences together, I am going to write you back a response. Thank you for taking the time to do that. Be back at you soon.
Pat is the man, and I for one have envied his sucess over the years. There was a time back in the day when we used to work together that I thought he was the most annoying know it all 21 year old guy on the planet, but I've watched him mellow into a really mature aviator who's got some good things to say. If I ever made it back to AK, he's on a short list of guys I'd seriously listen to.
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
BajtheJino
I'm looking at you.
Pu-shaw...Come down to South Central. We don't need no stinking gizmos!
ASpilot2be
Qbicle seat warmer
I totally agree. If I ever have questions about flying in Alaska I go to him. I him more than one beer.
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
Just wait until we're done having kids - than fire at will - poor man's vasectomy will be all I'll be able to afford by then.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
@ppragman
Hey Pat....this little ramble is I guess as much about life as it is about flying.......as I have said many times in many threads, there are all types of flying. One kind is not necessarily better than another. It's simply different. Not every one can fly at a Major and why should everyone want to? It's not the end all be all of flying. There are wonderful careers to be had in a variety of aviation sectors.
Now for flying in AK, I can't imagine flying that is more or just as challenging on a daily basis than fling there, much like flying the choppers into war zones to pick up the wounded, the flying that is done in the Himalayans, the freight guys who fly the DC-3's in South America, the pilots who fly the Northern territories of Canada, bush pilots in Africa and Australia, etc.
There is an allure about Alaska for many people. First off it's the last real natural expanse of frontier left in this country. It strikes a chord with what is left in our pioneering spirit and heritage. Just living and surviving there is a challenge in itself. I don't know how anyone manges the damn Winters up there which are so severe in many areas and last for so many, many months. Yet they do. Men and women, trap fur, pan/dig for gold, fish, log, hunt for survival, raise small crops and some animals and many live off the grid, etc. It's been said that after one visit there, many move there or build a second home there or keep returning as the pull is just that strong. Some have lived there for generations now. Plus there is still a strong Inuit culture and history there to enjoy and experience. And while some of that culture has been lost or degraded, there are those working hard to preserve it. Then you have the complete remote, unspoiled, wildness and sheer beauty of the state. Not only the landscape itself, but all the animals and birds. It's beyond breathtaking and just so vast.
It's funny when I read some of the pilots who fly and live there almost sort of apologize (if that is the right word) but maybe almost show a slight discomfort on this forum from time to time, because their counterparts are so into flying the lower 48 and wanting to get ahead in larger aircraft and in shiny jets and many on to 121...blah blah bah.
Life is made of of choices. No one knows or makes all the right decisions. There is no road map or chart saying go here do this, don't do that. At some point, we all have to discover what is best for us, our families and what we need to be happy. It shouldn't and is not all about the money. While you need some money to live, you can live a much simpler and less complicated lifestyle that you think you need and be just as happy or in fact, even happier.The more complicated your life is and the more things that you have, the more time and money it takes to maintain all of that. In the end, none of it truly matters. What matters is your own happiness and satisfaction, your spouse, your children your friends, a warm, simple and cozy safe home and that you are inspired and happy in your work.
To fly in a place as beautiful as Alaska, to spend your life up there enjoying all that she has to offer and living a comfortable and simple, less stressful existence and being with your family on a regular basis is very enviable to me and to many others. There is some spark, some instinct, some feeling of longing that many men have back in their guts about being able to live that sort of life and in that sort of place.
Some of the earliest books that I read as a teen and read the bios of and adventures of were about pilots like Beryl Markham, (her book West With the Night is still one of my faves) Don Sheldon, Roy Dickson, Carl Eielson, Punch Dickins, Wop May, Robert Norman, and so many more.
So you see, you guys, are following in those footsteps of aviation history. The majority (not all of the pilots here - I am obviously excluding some military flying, fire fighting flying, border patrol flying, etc) of the rest of us are simply going to work to fly planes in a very safe environment. You guys have the adventure. You guys have the views. You guys have far more challenges. I always hope that the adventure for all of you can and hopefully will last a lifetime.
Meanwhile, I continue to search the Daily Photos and the Video Forum for more of your adventures and for the marvelous and breathtaking views that you have on a daily basis while bringing back a part of my childhood dreams and while a small part of me feels a stirring, an envy and an ache for something I will never experience to that extent and I sigh. Watch some spectacular glacier calving and catch a few salmon for me until I can get there. Gerry
Hey Pat....this little ramble is I guess as much about life as it is about flying.......as I have said many times in many threads, there are all types of flying. One kind is not necessarily better than another. It's simply different. Not every one can fly at a Major and why should everyone want to? It's not the end all be all of flying. There are wonderful careers to be had in a variety of aviation sectors.
Now for flying in AK, I can't imagine flying that is more or just as challenging on a daily basis than fling there, much like flying the choppers into war zones to pick up the wounded, the flying that is done in the Himalayans, the freight guys who fly the DC-3's in South America, the pilots who fly the Northern territories of Canada, bush pilots in Africa and Australia, etc.
There is an allure about Alaska for many people. First off it's the last real natural expanse of frontier left in this country. It strikes a chord with what is left in our pioneering spirit and heritage. Just living and surviving there is a challenge in itself. I don't know how anyone manges the damn Winters up there which are so severe in many areas and last for so many, many months. Yet they do. Men and women, trap fur, pan/dig for gold, fish, log, hunt for survival, raise small crops and some animals and many live off the grid, etc. It's been said that after one visit there, many move there or build a second home there or keep returning as the pull is just that strong. Some have lived there for generations now. Plus there is still a strong Inuit culture and history there to enjoy and experience. And while some of that culture has been lost or degraded, there are those working hard to preserve it. Then you have the complete remote, unspoiled, wildness and sheer beauty of the state. Not only the landscape itself, but all the animals and birds. It's beyond breathtaking and just so vast.
It's funny when I read some of the pilots who fly and live there almost sort of apologize (if that is the right word) but maybe almost show a slight discomfort on this forum from time to time, because their counterparts are so into flying the lower 48 and wanting to get ahead in larger aircraft and in shiny jets and many on to 121...blah blah bah.
Life is made of of choices. No one knows or makes all the right decisions. There is no road map or chart saying go here do this, don't do that. At some point, we all have to discover what is best for us, our families and what we need to be happy. It shouldn't and is not all about the money. While you need some money to live, you can live a much simpler and less complicated lifestyle that you think you need and be just as happy or in fact, even happier.The more complicated your life is and the more things that you have, the more time and money it takes to maintain all of that. In the end, none of it truly matters. What matters is your own happiness and satisfaction, your spouse, your children your friends, a warm, simple and cozy safe home and that you are inspired and happy in your work.
To fly in a place as beautiful as Alaska, to spend your life up there enjoying all that she has to offer and living a comfortable and simple, less stressful existence and being with your family on a regular basis is very enviable to me and to many others. There is some spark, some instinct, some feeling of longing that many men have back in their guts about being able to live that sort of life and in that sort of place.
Some of the earliest books that I read as a teen and read the bios of and adventures of were about pilots like Beryl Markham, (her book West With the Night is still one of my faves) Don Sheldon, Roy Dickson, Carl Eielson, Punch Dickins, Wop May, Robert Norman, and so many more.
So you see, you guys, are following in those footsteps of aviation history. The majority (not all of the pilots here - I am obviously excluding some military flying, fire fighting flying, border patrol flying, etc) of the rest of us are simply going to work to fly planes in a very safe environment. You guys have the adventure. You guys have the views. You guys have far more challenges. I always hope that the adventure for all of you can and hopefully will last a lifetime.
Meanwhile, I continue to search the Daily Photos and the Video Forum for more of your adventures and for the marvelous and breathtaking views that you have on a daily basis while bringing back a part of my childhood dreams and while a small part of me feels a stirring, an envy and an ache for something I will never experience to that extent and I sigh. Watch some spectacular glacier calving and catch a few salmon for me until I can get there. Gerry
Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
The bromance is strong with this one.
You can pry my Chelton from my cold, dead hands.