Great Job Delta!

Cptnchia said:
Delta owns the gate. Qatar publicly stated that the only reason they were going to fly to Atlanta was to rub salt into Delta's wounds, even if they lose money to do it. Delta told them to go pound sand. Just because what you read in the paper may have sounded coy, don't assume that was the language actually used.
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If that didn't happen that way, then Delta should have had a more strongly worded statement to them, and refused from day one to open up those gates. The airport asked them for use of the gate and Delta said that they would work with them, but then conveniently couldn't find a way to shuffle their planes months out. I would have liked it more if Delta had played the same card that Qatar did with that comment. Even better, up the ante with a big pile of salt? ;) I don't know, I am not good at pranks, but I am sure that someone has a good idea out there. I am not saying that Delta was wrong for not allowing that, just that they were wrong in how they went about it by playing the "we can't move our plane."
 
ClarkGriswold said:
You would think that it's ok. What are your thoughts on our own government awarding a a DOD contract to JB for a city they can't even fly to? You better care because they aren't far behind NAI and they have the money to do it because they still operate whether they make money or not, in some cases just to prove a point/poke the bear.
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Not sure of all the details, but it sounded like jetBlue was awarded a contract for which they would then use codeshare services. As long as it's still an American company awarded a contract. It's not like they gave it specifically to the ME3. It's outsourcing from the jetBlue perspective via codesharing.

Cptnchia said:
They may increase the airlines bottom dollar, but that doesn't necessarily mean that any of the employees will see any of that bottom dollar. Maybe if those airlines had good scope, then, if management wanted to gain that incremental bottom dollar, they would do so using their own pilots, and then the employees would benefit more.
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True, but a strong bottom dollar means a healthy company and leads to better economic conditions when it comes time to negotiate a contract. When the going is good, contracts are great (Delta C2000). When the times are bad and the airline is hemorrhaging money, the contracts then suck (32.5 loss ~2005).
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
To play Devils advocate, and only to play, how about pilots at LCCs like Virgin, JetBlue, and Alaska?

These 3 don't do any international Europe/Africa/Asia. The business model is such that that kind of flying is not likely either. No widebodies. So if carriers like these codeshare with ME3, they are increasing profits and bring in in revenue which they otherwise would not have brought in themselves. A guy going from Dubai to Spokane GEG would fly Emirates to SEA, then connect Alaska to GEG. And Alaska makes money on it.

Again, Devils advocate only. If I'm at AA/DL/UA then yes they are a huge competition because we do international widebodies and fly to the similar places they fly. But as a major LCC, with no wide body, can't it be argued the ME3 actually help the airline's bottom dollar?
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Cptnchia said:
They may increase the airlines bottom dollar, but that doesn't necessarily mean that any of the employees will see any of that bottom dollar. Maybe if those airlines had good scope, then, if management wanted to gain that incremental bottom dollar, they would do so using their own pilots, and then the employees would benefit more.
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@Cherokee_Cruiser to add to what @Cptnchia said, there are other options to increase revenue for the airlines such as Alaska in the international market. Look what happened with the Alaska code share with Delta. Alaska was going to use that to increase revenue internationally, but it fell apart as Alaska decided to increase their partnership with Emirates. Another option would be to join the STAR or Sky Team Alliance.

The bottom line is there are options outside of teaming up with the ME3.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Not sure of all the details, but it sounded like jetBlue was awarded a contract for which they would then use codeshare services. As long as it's still an American company awarded a contract. It's not like they gave it specifically to the ME3. It's outsourcing from the jetBlue perspective via codesharing.



True, but a strong bottom dollar means a healthy company and leads to better economic conditions when it comes time to negotiate a contract. When the going is good, contracts are great (Delta C2000). When the times are bad and the airline is hemorrhaging money, the contracts then suck (32.5 loss ~2005).
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Make no mistake, C2K was not all it was cracked up to be. Huge work rules and QoL was given up for pay, pay which management had no intention of ever continuing to pay since they were already planning to bankrupt the company and take it back through concessions.

The focus of the pilot group should be that the corporation should make money, AS LONG AS some of that money flows to the employees doing the work. By code sharing, the company, and management, makes money, but the employees are marginalized. If you're a cog, that might be OK. For others, not so much.
 
Avgirl said:
If that didn't happen that way, then Delta should have had a more strongly worded statement to them, and refused from day one to open up those gates. The airport asked them for use of the gate and Delta said that they would work with them, but then conveniently couldn't find a way to shuffle their planes months out. I would have liked it more if Delta had played the same card that Qatar did with that comment. Even better, up the ante with a big pile of salt? ;) I don't know, I am not good at pranks, but I am sure that someone has a good idea out there. I am not saying that Delta was wrong for not allowing that, just that they were wrong in how they went about it by playing the "we can't move our plane."
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They did refuse from day one. The airport and Qatar thought they could still work a deal. Personally, if I was the CEO, I would have parked a 717 or 88 in the gate. Doesn't really matter though, this was just a one off. The A380 was for the inaugural flight. Going forward, Qatar is going to use a 777, so no gate issue. They can use an airport gate.
 
Cptnchia said:
They did refuse from day one. The airport and Qatar thought they could still work a deal. Personally, if I was the CEO, I would have parked a 717 or 88 in the gate. Doesn't really matter though, this was just a one off. The A380 was for the inaugural flight. Going forward, Qatar is going to use a 777, so no gate issue. They can use an airport gate.
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My point exactly...the A380 wasn't going to be used more than just the event yesterday, which is why I asked how many flights there would be with the A380 and didn't get answers. So, Delta either giving up that gate for a couple hours or standing their ground rather than releasing this statement would have made more sense: “Despite limited time to solve for the request, Delta offered solutions to allow Qatar to use the gates while ensuring our own schedule remained accommodated during a heavy traffic period at the international terminal,” Delta said in a written statement."

Oddly enough, Qatar is receiving a lot of coverage by the AJC today, even announcing crew member recruiting starting in July here in Atlanta on the front page of the website.
 
Avgirl said:
I think if Delta had a mother, it would be getting a stern talking to about how it isn't nice not to share. At some point, even they have to grow up and stop acting like a spoiled child.
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Let's see, you've got an A-320 that's owned by the airline that built the terminal that the gate is connected to that's surely offloading 140+ pax and likely also booked full on the way out, and an inbound aircraft that has [rumored] well less than 100 people on board.

Politics aside, why would you not send the empty one out to the hardstand?

Qatar has a mere six A-380s flying in their fleet and chose to send one of those six to ATL with a sub-20% load factor in an attempt at a publicity stunt.

Wanna make your inaugural flight an aircraft type that's not the type you are actually going to operate on the route after publicly trashing an airline that's been operating for seven decades longer than your propped up Middle East passenger sort facility, (right around the same time a press release is put out that airplanes crash though light poles "all the time" during takeoff, while behind the scenes, firing the flight crew) . . . well, go figure out a place to park your jet.
 
Hacker15e said:
Beluga whale with Down's Syndrome.
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I think that's rather mean to people who have Down's Syndrome, TBQHWY ;) :D

Cptnchia said:
They did refuse from day one. The airport and Qatar thought they could still work a deal. Personally, if I was the CEO, I would have parked a 717 or 88 in the gate. Doesn't really matter though, this was just a one off. The A380 was for the inaugural flight. Going forward, Qatar is going to use a 777, so no gate issue. They can use an airport gate.
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Try a DCI CRJ-200 for full effect. :D
 
Derg said:
But seriously, these things happen all the damned time and it's cool to see a US carrier on the other end of it for once. Try to, as a US carrier, fly to some of those countries, you've got to glad hand, dance, pay off, have the right political connections, kiss the proper butts and then you MAY be granted access. Conversely, the US is darned near "come one come ALL! Our voters want low air fares at all costs!".
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Funny that. This is the exact description of the problems we have in securing our southern border and dealing with Mexico, but no one cares about that. Nationalism in that way, somehow equates to racism as some seem to see it here in the USA. However nationalism in this way when it comes to airline stuff, is just business.

Interesting. :)
 
Serious question - did QR pull the "Oh, our demand for this flight is super duper high, we need the 380" card, so they decide LAST MINUTE to swap-out a 777 from nowhere-land and make this happen? With a subfleet of 6 Whales and just over 40 777s, the lines get awful weird - logistically.

Second serious Q - does KE* still fly the 380 to ATL? Or did they ever. I think it was a 77W for a time.
 
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Burrito said:
Serious question - did QR pull the "Oh, our demand for this flight is super duper high, we need the 380" card, so they decide LAST MINUTE to swap-out a 777 from nowhere-land and make this happen? With a subfleet of 6 Whales and just over 40 777s, the lines get awful weird - logistically.

Second serious Q - does KL still fly the 380 to ATL? Or did they ever. I think it was a 77W for a time.
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They brought out the 380 just for the celebration of the first flight yesterday, apparently to rub salt in Delta's wound. It won't be back according to Qatar, but if it irks Delta enough, maybe that will change. KE is the only 380 out of Atlanta now.
 
Burrito said:
Serious question - did QR pull the "Oh, our demand for this flight is super duper high, we need the 380" card, so they decide LAST MINUTE to swap-out a 777 from nowhere-land and make this happen? With a subfleet of 6 Whales and just over 40 777s, the lines get awful weird - logistically.

Second serious Q - does KE* still fly the 380 to ATL? Or did they ever. I think it was a 77W for a time.
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Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa. There's only one airplane that can be called the whale and the A380 isn't it.
 
Avgirl said:
They brought out the 380 just for the celebration of the first flight yesterday, apparently to rub salt in Delta's wound. It won't be back according to Qatar, but if it irks Delta enough, maybe that will change. KE is the only 380 out of Atlanta now.
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I'm pretty sure they won't be sending an A380 again. Unless of course they want to keep parking it on the hard stand.
 
ClarkGriswold said:
Whoa whoa whoa whoa whoa. There's only one airplane that can be called the whale and the A380 isn't it.
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That would be the Douglas A-3 Skywarrior.

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