Getting back into maneuvers after IR

WildcatPilot

Well-Known Member
Quick question for anyone who's run into this. I just finished my instrument rating and am working on my commercial. It seems that after not having done any real maneuvers since my initial private training back in '02/'03, I've lost whatever "edge" I had back then. I've become so accustomed to standard rate turns and 500 fpm climbs and descents that I'm having a hard time being aggressive enough with the airplane to properly do chandelles and lazy eights. So much of these maneuvers are based on outside references that I'm having trouble because I'm so focused on the ball and trying to stay coordinated at these low airspeeds. I did some stalls and slow flight with my instructor tonight to try to bring back that confidence. Has anyone experienced this before?
 
Just wait until you have done so many visual crap and you start to forget how to shoot an instrument approach.
 
It is a common thing for students and instructors to battle post instrument.
Congratulations, you are normal!

I sometimes solved by putting a big three ring binder, wedged between the yoke and the glare shield of the pipers. Stickies would work too.

The commercial maneuvers are very easy once you start looking outside and get a feel for them that way.

Cover them up!
 
Go up with your CFI with the panel covered so you're flying just by feel and outside references. Start basic with climbs at Vy and Vx, normal turns (work to feel coordination), climbing and descending turns...then work into some more aggressive stuff like steep turns, slow flight...and steep turns in slow flight. Really work the rudder and watch for yaw rolling in and out of turns, plus feel for coordination. One thing that helps with that is to make sure you're relaxed in your seat-it makes it easier to feel if you're sliding sideways (uncoordinated) in your seat and back.
 
Rent one solo, go out and do some yanking and backing, pushing and pulling, rolling and floating. Its a plane. Get dirty with it.
 
It is a common thing for students and instructors to battle post instrument.
Congratulations, you are normal!

I sometimes solved by putting a big three ring binder, wedged between the yoke and the glare shield of the pipers. Stickies would work too.

The commercial maneuvers are very easy once you start looking outside and get a feel for them that way.

Cover them up!

Ditto. Cover up the instruments with some stickies for a couple of the maneuvers, do a bunch of steep turns and go from there. Use that horizon and cowling as a reference. Always keep your head on a swivel!

Also, if you're being "aggressive" with a lazy eight, you're not doing it right ;)
 
They'll feel mechanical at first, but you'll get it. Also, forget about the instruments. Have your CFI demo the maneuver and just look outside and see and feel what's going on. A good trick for lazy eights is to imagine your shooting tracers from a machine gun on the cowl. The best way to get good at commercial maneuvers is to achieve PTS w/o looking at the instruments at all. If you CFI you'll get to the point where you know when the plane is doing what you want and what kind of performance you're getting with your eyes closed.
 
Ditto. Cover up the instruments with some stickies for a couple of the maneuvers, do a bunch of steep turns and go from there. Use that horizon and cowling as a reference. Always keep your head on a swivel!
Another ditto.

firebird, what you are experiencing is common. Sometimes I think the usually commercial is done after the instrument is just to force you to learn how to fly visually again. I remember one guy who came to me for a local airplane checkout. He just got in instrument ticket and couldn't find the interstate below him in CAVU conditions without tuning in a radial.
 
Thanks guys. I figured that was probably the case. I'll work on covering the screen up and looking outside. For some reason, I'm borderline obsessive about double checking my coordination on the TC at low airspeeds even though I know it's really not that big a deal if a spin does happen that high.
 
For some reason, I'm borderline obsessive about double checking my coordination on the TC at low airspeeds even though

Then I suggest getting rid of it and experiment on what makes you feel coordinated.
As said before by someone else, you will start to feel the slip/skid by the way your back fat is sliding in the chair as you turn in which ever direction. Then someday you will not need to reference the ball to find out if you are coordinated.


If you have glider around, I would suggest one. They are great at getting back to basics, like a coordinated turn.
 
You want an instrument? That big thing out of your window with trees and houses and big mountains under you with the blue/grey/white sky above (in optimal flight conditions) is your god given attitude indicator. That plus the airspeed indicator is about all you need to do anything you want with that airplane. In fact all basic aerobatics can be taught with looking at just the ASI and outside, you don't need the altimeter as long as you don't hit the ground you know your fine, and as for the other instruments have you ever made abrupt maneuvers and looked at them? Half the time they don't move, sometimes they move backwards, and other times they shoot through the actual condition to well beyond what is actually happening.

I suggest going out (brief with your instructor first on this) and doing aggressive climbs turns left and right with high climbing turns up to stall to do wing overs and really get you to see that the outside look is all you need (of course do the basics first). Above all listen to rodger, in IMC your eyes are all you fly with, in VMC use the rest of your senses with your eyes as they all provide crucial information. A couple/few lessons of doing stuff like this and you will be all set.

You don't need to cover your instruments, you need to NOT LOOK AT THEM! :) Good luck.
 
You want an instrument? That big thing out of your window with trees and houses and big mountains under you with the blue/grey/white sky above (in optimal flight conditions) is your god given attitude indicator. That plus the airspeed indicator is about all you need to do anything you want with that airplane.

You don't need to cover your instruments, you need to NOT LOOK AT THEM! :) Good luck.

:yup: Reminds me of my former employer at a banner towing operation. When I told him my altimeter was sticking between 300' and 800' he said "Jesus Christ! You're flying at 400'! What do you need an altimeter for!" Can't you judge 400'!"
 
:yup: Reminds me of my former employer at a banner towing operation. When I told him my altimeter was sticking between 300' and 800' he said "Jesus Christ! You're flying at 400'! What do you need an altimeter for!" Can't you judge 400'!"


HAHAHA hey if you don't hit the ground who needs an altimeter?
 
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