Frequency change to ground after landing

[Cptnchia]

Turn off, stop then switch to ground.

Doesn't always work well at busy airports. Do that in ATL or JFK and you'll incur the wrath of ATC plus all the pilots stacking up behind you and the guy who just went around because the third guy in line behind you didn't clear the runway.

Case in point, cleared the inboard in ATL one day. GRD all fubared due to a regional crossing and stopping. We just kept rolling to our ramp without a word and just before entering the ramp ground said, "Good job XXXX, Thanks."

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Doesn't always work well at busy airports. Do that in ATL or JFK and you'll incur the wrath of ATC plus all the pilots stacking up behind you and the guy who just went around because the third guy in line behind you didn't clear the runway. Case in point, cleared the inboard in ATL one day. GRD all fubared due to a regional crossing and stopping. We just kept rolling to our ramp without a word and just before entering the ramp ground said, "Good job XXXX, Thanks."

Exactly. The AIM fetishists would have had an aneurism, though.

 

[RobertB]

To be fair I don't know any pilots ever violated for not knowing the 7110.65.

Also, if you've cleared the runway and crossed the hold bars while still on the local controllers frequency you are already in another controllers area of responsibility.

I'm not saying you'll get violated, I'm just saying you shouldn't switch frequencies until specifically being told to by ATC and I was just stating how ATC looks at it by citing a passage in the 7110.65. Depending on how positions are combined and decombined, a LC can also be working a portion of the ground control traffic. (Example: Aircraft landing 10/28 at ATL staying on 119.5 while taxing north to hold short of 9R/27L. Would you simply exit 10/28 and call the south ground control frequency (121.65) simply because you're off the runway and tower didn't tell you not to and you assume their too busy to remember you're there?)

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

I can tell you beyond any shadow of a doubt after many years being based in ATL that waiting for the controller to switch you when he's busy is not going to work, and is just going to piss them off. Keep moving and make the switch when it's appropriate if they're busy. Sometimes that means making it almost all the way to the ramp before saying a word to the ground controller, even. If they want you to stop, they'll tell you.

 

[tcco94]

The AIM isn't regulatory. That being said, it's highly advised that you follow the information listed in the AIM.

I agree with what you are saying initially, but for all practicality, I wouldn't wait on a taxiway to be transferred over to ground if tower is busy. It never hurts to even switch, say tower is busy and then state your intentions. I think under perfect circumstances we could all follow the AIM, but sometimes the AIM isn't practical for certain situations. I wouldn't tell a controller to read AIM anything because I'm pretty sure they wouldn't care. Just my thought.

 

[bike21]

Doesn't get any clearer than that. Thanks. If this happens again i'll just tell them to read AIM 4-3-14.

I'll be sure to tell O'hare controllers that next time I'm there

As @ATN_Pilot said sometimes we have to use common sense and judgement. 99.9999% of the time we all operate within the framework of the rules & regs but minor things like this need not complicate our daily lives and screw up the operation IMHO.

 

[MidlifeFlyer]

The bottom line about the AIM's recommended procedures where they are not based in regulations (like this one) is the consistency and expectations that come from standard operating practices. That everyone, whether it's a bunch of pilots (with radios) communicating their position and intentions coming into a nontowered airport or the guy in a 172 flying into KATL, waiting to hear "contact Ground" by a Tower controller complying with his duties under 2-1-17and other applicable provisions of the ATC Handbook, are on the same page.

I won't disagree there are times to switch to Ground yourself. I've done it. Heck, I've also taxied to parking without calling Ground at all.

But if a facility wants to do something non-standard regularly for its own efficient operation, it sure helps to let people know. There are 2 or 3 towered airports, for example, at which the pilot is not supposed to switch to Tower when ready to go at the departure end of the runway. How can pilots be expected to know that if they don't fly in there all the time? Maybe it's the "Special procedures in effect.Notify Ground when run-up complete and ready for departure" on the ATIS?

But I guess that's way too much work to add that to the automated computer-voice ATIS for an airport that can't find enough time to say "Contact ground point six." Actually, I suspect there is a good reason why they don't want to do that.

(BTW, out of curiosity, just spend some time listening to Live ATC for Atlanta. They don;t deem to be having too much trouble saying "Contact ground point niner" as part of the instructions for the traffic landing on the parallel runways 8L and 8R. There was one in which the Tower didn;t. In that one, the pilot, as part of the readback, said, Ground point niner. I like that "make sure we're on the same page" attitude.)

And, of course, the question wasn't being asked about airplane pilots flying into a hub. It was from an instructor asking what to teach his students.

 

[Jetfreq]

Please, when tower is busy, don't ask. I'm truly sorry if you've been yelled at before but 99 in 100 controllers gasping for air would prefer you just switch. If the controller doesn't switch you in a timely manner, it's on them anyway.

 

[queeno]

I disagree 100%, If ATC wants to run a non standard operation for what ever reason it should be published in as in this case in the green book on any taxi chart and broadcasted on the ATIS. Transient pilots souldnt have to guess what the local procedures are and if ATC gets there crown tilted when asked a question than tooooo friggen bad. If your unsure ask , assuming can get you killed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Oh, good grief, this is why AIM fetishists are so annoying. No one is going to get killed by switching over to ground when the frequency is busy. Put down the FAR/AIM and get laid.

 

[fholbert]

I can't stand it any longer!!!

 

[CaptBill]

Common sense should prevail here as others have said; however, NEVER switch to ground prior to crossing an active runway that has traffic in position or other aircraft on it. For example, you just land 22L in EWR and the tower tells you to cross 22R and contact ground. DO NOT switch to ground until you have crossed 22L. You never want to be on the same runway with another airplane on two different frequencies. I see it happen more than it should and it is a recipe for disaster. If you are unsure about anything when operating an aircraft, seek clarification. If they want to yell at you, so be it. If that's the worse thing that happens to you all day, you've had a pretty good day.

 

[ajmezz]

I agree with asking for clarification, but it really isn't that much more time consuming to say "contact ground/remain this frequency" at the end of the initial instruction.

 

[airplanerik]

You will never, ever, EVER get violated for switching to ground without being told to do so when exiting the runway.

 

[PositionAndHold]

Just make sure you clear the runway and are on the taxiway side of the hold short bars. Then figure out want you want to do. If you can get past the runaway hold bars and not block the taxiway, even better.

 

[JustinS]

If you have runways to cross along your taxi route, and tower hasn't specifically told you to switch to ground, then I wouldn't switch to ground as tower may be hanging onto until you've crossed their runways. I see this at a lot of busy airports I fly into. However, if you have no runways to cross after your exit, and it's too chatty to ask for ground, you better just switch to ground. There's been times where I got the picture that we didn't get the handoff (ok not a "handoff," but whatever you call it when tower hands you off to ground...) due to too much chatter, and I switch just in time to hear the last half of my callsign and my flight number and realize the taxi instructions are for me. Like @ATN_Pilot said, if they need you to stop, they'll tell you...

This is one of many grey areas where common sense must prevail, and each situation is heavily dependent on several factors: are there runways to cross on my taxi route? Is tower too busy for me to butt in to the conversation? If I stop, will I be causing issues for the guys behind me? If I contact ground, will they get mad I didn't get a positive instruction to switch to ground from tower? There is no one size fits all...