Forward Canards on Fighters

Champcar

Champcar

Well-Known Member
The J-20 is another "advanced" fighter that utilizes forward canards. Seeing that many other newer fighters from Europe and Russia also utilize forward canards got me wondering why the US inventory is void of them. What is it about our design/tactical philosophies that points us in a different direction? I'm assuming we are not as concerned with maneuverability with our advanced radar/guidance/and missile technologies?
 
Champcar said:
The J-20 is another "advanced" fighter that utilizes forward canards. Seeing that many other newer fighters from Europe and Russia also utilize forward canards got me wondering why the US inventory is void of them. What is it about our design/tactical philosophies that points us in a different direction? I'm assuming we are not as concerned with maneuverability with our advanced radar/guidance/and missile technologies?
Click to expand...
Thrust vectoring?
 
Champcar said:
The J-20 is another "advanced" fighter that utilizes forward canards. Seeing that many other newer fighters from Europe and Russia also utilize forward canards got me wondering why the US inventory is void of them. What is it about our design/tactical philosophies that points us in a different direction? I'm assuming we are not as concerned with maneuverability with our advanced radar/guidance/and missile technologies?
Click to expand...

I'm digging WAY back here but I seem to recall that they can increase drag and increase fuel burn. One of the big pluses that came out of the F22 program was the ability to long range super cruise at near mach numbers without tanker support. Like you said, with better missile technology (both air to air and surface to air) I think ACM is a decreasing art form in the minds of the USAF and the ability to get into an intercept position quickly and from a longer ways away is more prized.
 
Hmmmm.....a "forward" canard....is there another kind?

ca·nard
kəˈnär(d)/
noun
noun: canard; plural noun: canards
  1. 1.
    an unfounded rumor or story.
    "the old canard that LA is a cultural wasteland"
  2. 2.
    a small winglike projection attached to an aircraft forward of the main wing to provide extra stability or control, sometimes replacing the tail.
 
Especially since the advent of thrust vectoring and relaxed static stability/fly-by-wire, configuration of pitch control surfaces is probably not the determining factor in maneuvering performance. A properly configured canard is "a" way to get to the pitch authority you need, but not "the" way.
 
Champcar said:
The J-20 is another "advanced" fighter that utilizes forward canards. Seeing that many other newer fighters from Europe and Russia also utilize forward canards got me wondering why the US inventory is void of them. What is it about our design/tactical philosophies that points us in a different direction? I'm assuming we are not as concerned with maneuverability with our advanced radar/guidance/and missile technologies?
Click to expand...
It's the American Way, Son! Why do something aerodynamically when you can do it by Goldberging your engineering and burning more petrol?! Maybe you need a refresher course. ;)
 
dustoff17 said:
Hmmmm.....a "forward" canard....is there another kind?

ca·nard
kəˈnär(d)/
noun
noun: canard; plural noun: canards
  1. 1.
    an unfounded rumor or story.
    "the old canard that LA is a cultural wasteland"
  2. 2.
    a small winglike projection attached to an aircraft forward of the main wing to provide extra stability or control, sometimes replacing the tail.
Click to expand...
That old canard about a canard being a Canadian duck.
 
Champcar said:
The J-20 is another "advanced" fighter that utilizes forward canards. Seeing that many other newer fighters from Europe and Russia also utilize forward canards got me wondering why the US inventory is void of them.
Click to expand...

I would guess that they provide an unnecessary radar surface for reflections, and thrust vectoring is more useful for controlling pitch anyway.
 
High_Alpha said:
Especially since the advent of thrust vectoring and relaxed static stability/fly-by-wire, configuration of pitch control surfaces is probably not the determining factor in maneuvering performance. A properly configured canard is "a" way to get to the pitch authority you need, but not "the" way.
Click to expand...

The people who wonder about this would probably also be surprised at the evolved understanding toward traditional speed brakes on newer aircraft.

Legacy F-18/F-15... hey here's a big barn door that just deploys if you need it. Raptor/Super Hornet/etc... our engineers programmed the flight control surfaces to manipulate themselves setting conditions for aerodynamic spoiling forward flat plate drag while simultaneously preserving flight envelope in all regimes and adjusting as the pilot makes control inputs....


Canards were/are similar to ideas like Swing Wings or forward swept wings. Yes it's an approach to an aerodynamic problem, but let's not call it the sole right way to do things.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
If you'll notice most aircraft with the canards have a delta wing. Delta wings are not known for their slow speed performance. Canards help remedy this. The F-22 and F-35 have clipped delta wings and stabilators.
 
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