Flying Magazine

WacoFan

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Flying Magazine has been through some turmoil recently going through two Editors in Chief (Mac McClellan and Michael Maya Charles) since August or so. The new EIC is Robert Goyer. The only things I like about Flying currently (Post Bax and Len Morgan) are Peter Garrison, Les Abend (usually), occassionally Lane Wallace, but mostly Martha Lunken - who I enjoy immensely. Anyway, I usually find Flying pretty boring because with the exception of Lunken and Wallace they primarily ejaculate about the latest glass panel gizmo's, business jets or plastic tricycles. Not exactly my wheelhouse.

Anyway, I will occassionally go to Flying's website because they usually put Martha's columns up and that way I can save having to buy the magazine. So, a day or so ago I wander over, see Martha's new column and see the latest blog post from Robert Goyer (who is the primary ejaculator for gizmos). He wrote a post advocating how wonderful this technology is, how it absolutely makes flying safer, etc, etc. There were some comments below his post, including one that was incredibly well written by an engineer saying that accidents statistics didn't necessarily support what Goyer wrote, how technology was a poor substitute for stick and rudder skills, and how technology couldn't confer good judgement. The comment was respectful but clearly disagreed with the premise of the blog posting. It was good so I returned back later to see what comments would be written about the response and the response was gone - vanished - and the writer of the comment had written another one - basically "Why did you delete my post? I thought I asked good questions in a respectful way". I wrote a comment saying "Liked your post. Would have loved to read the debate around it." I returned a couple hours later and my post was gone, plus the post saying "where'd my post go". The only comments left were comments in support of the original premise of the blog entry.

Now, Flying can certainly dictate editorial and user content on their own website - just like Doug does here. Two points though: 1) Flying, if you ever had doubt, is currently nothing more than a product placement type of publication. Basically a catalog that features a couple of interesting columns wedged between commercials. 2) Be thankful for Doug - he allows contrary opinions and active debate when he could be selling out to advertisers or industry interests to become a shill.

So, Doug - if it comes down to it and you need to generate more revenue for the website - both to keep it going as well as perhaps compensate you for your time - I would be more in favor of keeping the current "open" discussions and paying a user fee as opposed to tightly controlled content or even advertisements at the level that APC now has them. Thanks for what you do.
 
how technology was a poor substitute for stick and rudder skills, and how technology couldn't confer good judgement.

Not to derail the discussion on Flying, but it is sad that this is anywhere near a controversial statement. It should be the first line of the Ten Commandments of Aviation.
 
WHAT! Total BS. I don't think I'll renew my subscription. I had been tossing and turning because like you, I read it for Martha, "I learned about flying from that," occosainally Les and Lane. This may be our chance Jim. Lets get the torches!

Edit to add: I just ventured over the the site, and he seems kinda irritated about what happened the other day. He actually wrote a little piece on it. He's calling you stupid Waco!

http://www.flyingmag.com/blogs/going-direct/half-million-stupid-pilots
 
WHAT! Total BS. I don't think I'll renew my subscription. I had been tossing and turning because like you, I read it for Martha, "I learned about flying from that," occosainally Les and Lane. This may be our chance Jim. Lets get the torches!

Agreed.

I think that there would be a niche with a magazine that featured Martha, someone like Bax, someone like Len Morgan, a discussion of an accident (similar to Aftermath - our own MikeD would write that one), a pirep of a "cool" airplane (something I'd like), and a pirep of something that someone could afford - like a refurbed older 172 or 310 or Seneca 1 and tips for lower-time pilots building time or weekend warriors. Cirri and Columbia/Lancair/Cessna 400's cost more than $500k. I think there is a large segment of the population not being served. Now, could it make money - probably not. But still, it would be cool.
 
I agree with you. He keeps touting how glass= safer. I hope he read the article where they proved that wrong. The Nall report came out showing those facts. It makes you a more "efficient" pilot, yes. Safer, no. People are finding new and exciting ways to kill themselves in glass. Too bad he's all about the bling and not up for a discussion about it.
 
I agree with you. He keeps touting how glass= safer. I hope he read the article where they proved that wrong. The Nall report came out showing those facts. It makes you a more "efficient" pilot, yes. Safer, no. People are finding new and exciting ways to kill themselves in glass. Too bad he's all about the bling and not up for a discussion about it.

Clearly he is a • (because of his lack of appetite for the debate - not his preference for Cirri). Mac McClellan would debate someone. Michael Maya Charles would debate an issue just to create learning - he's into that. Goyer is apparently an ego hound that is afraid of debate - probably because he can't go toe-to-toe with someone and is simply shilling for the advertisers - which is probably why they got rid of Mac and then Charles in short order. Flying is excrement. We need to save Martha Lunken by getting her a job with a good magazine.
 
I can't get them to stop sending me the magazine. I never renew my subscription, but I keep getting it. Every 12 months I get the one with "RENEW NOW, THIS IS YOUR LAST ISSUE". I rip it off, read a few articles while I'm on the crapper, and then toss it.
 
I agree with you. He keeps touting how glass= safer. I hope he read the article where they proved that wrong. The Nall report came out showing those facts. It makes you a more "efficient" pilot, yes. Safer, no. People are finding new and exciting ways to kill themselves in glass. Too bad he's all about the bling and not up for a discussion about it.

I just skimmed through the 2009 report, but didn't notice anything indicating either way as to avionics and safety. I'm sure that when the fancy magical boxes fail the people the rely on them so heavily are suddenly in a place where they hardly know what to do anymore.
 
I agree with you. He keeps touting how glass= safer. I hope he read the article where they proved that wrong. The Nall report came out showing those facts. It makes you a more "efficient" pilot, yes. Safer, no. People are finding new and exciting ways to kill themselves in glass. Too bad he's all about the bling and not up for a discussion about it.

Not to mention he's using words like "stupid" and is quite nasty in a bit that he just wrote.


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Well, there is no substitute for stick and rudder skills. And there are plenty (most actually) phases of flight that employ them. That said, I do agree with the guys response. The accidents they prevent we will never see. Especially the CFIT's.
There! I agrees with both of you. I should be a politician.

It does suck that they removed the discussion that was brewing. All me and none of you makes for a bad stance.
 
WHAT! Total BS. I don't think I'll renew my subscription. I had been tossing and turning because like you, I read it for Martha, "I learned about flying from that," occosainally Les and Lane. This may be our chance Jim. Lets get the torches!

Take your throttle to idle for a moment partner. Look what happened the last time you broke out the torches.......
 
Yeah, that magazine is crap. Every month I go into a newstand to see if there is anything worth while in that magazine that would actually help me be a better pilot, but instead its like a bunch of advertisements.

Plane & Pilot is a little bit better. I really liked private pilot before they went out of business. I like gadgets and electronic gizmos as much as, maybe even more than, the next guy. But I'm a pilot, I can't afford them.
 
Agreed.

I think that there would be a niche with a magazine that featured Martha, someone like Bax, someone like Len Morgan, a discussion of an accident (similar to Aftermath - our own MikeD would write that one), a pirep of a "cool" airplane (something I'd like), and a pirep of something that someone could afford - like a refurbed older 172 or 310 or Seneca 1 and tips for lower-time pilots building time or weekend warriors. Cirri and Columbia/Lancair/Cessna 400's cost more than $500k. I think there is a large segment of the population not being served. Now, could it make money - probably not. But still, it would be cool.
I nominate Orange Anchor to do the "Cool" airplane PIREPs.
 
Yeah, that magazine is crap. Every month I go into a newstand to see if there is anything worth while in that magazine that would actually help me be a better pilot, but instead its like a bunch of advertisements.

Plane & Pilot is a little bit better. I really liked private pilot before they went out of business. I like gadgets and electronic gizmos as much as, maybe even more than, the next guy. But I'm a pilot, I can't afford them.

I loved the old Air Progress. My birthday present from Grandpa was always a subscription to that (and he got me a life membership to the AAA). I also loved Air Classics. Today I like Vintage magazine from the EAA/VAA, the AAA publications, the Waco Newsletter, AOPA and Ag Air Update.

Avweb USED to be cool when the columnists were Michael Maya Charles, Rick Durden, Kevin Garrison and my favorite - John Deakin. Every single day it seemed that Avweb used to have a quality article posted.
 

Not to start the usual rabble rabble rabble AOPA....but while they do have a great magazine and I can get behind that organization, I simply can't respect them. Between spending more money than I paid them in dues to ask me for MORE money, calling me at home during dinner, and what avweb posted about how much money their leadership makes, they'll never get another dime.

On the airline side I'd really like to see ALPA put some flying related info in their monthly waste of paper. Would be great to see some stuff I actually care about instead of pages and pages of guys in uniforms sitting in hotel conference rooms.
 
Not to start the usual rabble rabble rabble AOPA....but while they do have a great magazine and I can get behind that organization, I simply can't respect them. Between spending more money than I paid them in dues to ask me for MORE money, calling me at home during dinner, and what avweb posted about how much money their leadership makes, they'll never get another dime.

On the airline side I'd really like to see ALPA put some flying related info in their monthly waste of paper. Would be great to see some stuff I actually care about instead of pages and pages of guys in uniforms sitting in hotel conference rooms.

I sit on the fence about AOPA. My least favorite magazine of the ones I get, but I support the cause and particularly against users fees that Seggy and ATN would impose upon us. Those bastards.

Anyway, between EAA/VAA and AOPA I figure I am supporting the most active lobbying groups for GA. FAR prefer the EAA and VAA magazines though. Probably my favorite publication is Ag Air Update - it is very good.
 
That's why I haven't had a subscription to, or purchased a copy of Flying Magazine in over a year. If I wanted irrelevant drivel about how cool the latest glass panel is, or how I'll be a better pilot if I just broke down and started flying some plastic monstrosity I'd go straight to the source: Garmin's website, or the Diamond or Cirrus websites respectively. There's precious little about actual flying in those magazines anymore. Airplanes with shiny glass panels still mysteriously seem to crash into mountains, stall spin into fields next to airports, catch on fire, break apart in flight, and do all the same things that the older airplanes did. The only difference is that according to the Flying Magazine propagandists is that Plastic-Glass-Airplanes do it "with style." There are some cool articles occasionally, but the essence of flying for me has and always will be what happens down low and slow and when the poo hits the fan. I could care less about the time to climb for the newest Pilatus NG, not only will I probably never fly one, but the airplane costs something like $5 million, by the time I'd even get to fly the thing around, the airplane with its now clapped out interior, and ancient-ass now grossly underpowered engines will have been pressed into freight service in some hellhole in the upper midwest. Flying is about the challenge. Spend an entire year trying to show how taking the challenge out of flying is a good thing, and you'll find your readers (except those with SPS- Shiny Piston Syndrome) bored and uninterested.
 
Les Abend has one of the most baddest cop mustaches ever.
You mean cops make halfway decent imitation Les Abend staches.

Agreed on Flying, unfortunately. Plane&Pilot is miles ahead I think, especially since they always seem to have an article about how to fly for cheaper. I still like Flight Training, it just sucks that it looks so cheaply made now. It's like reading a High School newsletter.
 
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