Douglas
Old School KSUX
We are inspiring confidence and putting that "no Nexrad" worry to bed here.
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Flying IMC
- Thread starter badtransam97
- Start date
We are inspiring confidence and putting that "no Nexrad" worry to bed here.
Welcome Aboard!
///AMG
Well-Known Member
If you are new to IMC flying, then I would suggest trying to find a day with a decent low level overcast (obviously comfortably above mins....maybe 800 BR/OVC or better) and no convective sigmets or big radar returns. We have had plenty of those days as of late down in MS, normally early on in the day or immediately following passage of a big front. If you were somewhere else geographically, you'd probably have more options in terms of getting solid IMC experience without the threat of ugly storms (PNW comes to mind), but in the south, things seem to be a little bit more binary. Just keep your eye out on the prog charts and TAF lines and try to see what sounds comfortable to you. Another good tool to use is the visible moisture satellite feed on ADDS. We use that a lot when there aren't any PIREPs to help us figure out if the MOA is socked in. The picture will show you cloud development above 10k ft, and obviously coloring indicates just how high above that level the clouds are tending to reach. Clearly a high overcast will conceal the conditions at lower levels, but it is a decent baseline to look at when you don't think there are too many mixed layers out there. As a final note, experience is a valuable tool when trying to get an idea of what the weather is like (regardless of what some slowly or rapidly updated TAF is saying), and you may want to talk to a CFI or someone with more experience if you are having trouble determining what would be good safe training for you.
badtransam97
Well-Known Member
All great responses! I actually have a good friend that flies with me when we can work it out, who has been flying pt121 a good while, and he has been a huge help in my progress so far. I guess I have about 10 hrs or so actual, even a brief encounter with ice, I just want to be better informed for myself, because there are several days where he cannot fly with me and I'd like to go give it a try, but always find a reason to back out..lol! Like one of the previous posters mentioned, the real thing seems to be more overwhelming, at least if it's solid IMC the whole flight. Again thanks for the pointers, and if anyone would like to add, feel free!
///AMG
Well-Known Member
When I was first starting out instrument flying, I always enjoyed those days with ceilings a little above mins (maybe 4-500' OVC) with tops around 3-4K. This allowed me to get on top, enjoy the sun, and get organized and get ahead of the airplane without having to concentrate so hard on the gauges. Set up for the approach, start the descent and then just concentrate on shooting a good one. Great feeling breaking back out into a gloomy, rainy day, knowing that you were just in the sun, and that you flew a nice approach.
chuckles1225
Well-Known Member
Absolutely agree with you. Makes all of the work towards getting the rating feel worth it.
badtransam97
Well-Known Member
Yeah I think what I'm gonna plan on, is, next time its ovc and maybe lgt to mod rain, is do like you said. As far as rain, Ive always heard that it wasnt really a concern, unless of course its coming from thunderstorm..but then again, I dont know a whole lot about all this..lol!
cmill
Cold Ass Honky
the last thing i was told before going off for my first time to pick my way around thunderstorm was "aim for the bright spots". Amazingly, i've had some pretty smooth rides going through even heavy and extreme precip.
Lesson is, even if you do have nexrad, or wx radar, the colors arent always indicative of the type of ride you'll get, even if its spitting out lightning.
But then again, ive never regretted going around.
Lesson is, even if you do have nexrad, or wx radar, the colors arent always indicative of the type of ride you'll get, even if its spitting out lightning.
But then again, ive never regretted going around.
dasleben
That's just, like, your opinion, man
Dunno about the lightning thing, but more than a few times last summer I'd hear "XXXX it appears you're in an area of extreme precipitation. Say ride conditions."
"Pretty dang smooooth." *sips coffee*
Disclaimer: Do as I say, not as I do.
dasleben
That's just, like, your opinion, man
By the way, the above example shows the difference between heavy/extreme radar returns due to large water droplets in saturated rain clouds and heavy/extreme radar returns due to thunderstorms. There is a difference, but you shouldn't try to make that determination without PIREPs, local area knowledge, and knowledge of how to really read weather data. Convective Outlook and CCFP (Collaborative Convective Forecast Product) data on ADDS is great for a general overview, but realize that both products are designed to cover large areas. They won't show smaller areas of instability or areas where orthographic lifting may be a consideration. Lifted Index, K Index, and CAPE (Convective Activity Potential Energy) are all excellent resources as well, and can give you a better idea of how unstable the air is.
Finally, you can get really out of control and check out a Skew-T/Log-P chart for really raw upper air data. I personally use it to complement the CAPE, Lifted Index, and K Index contour plots. If you learn how to read it, it can give you a pretty good cross-section of the atmosphere and give you a better idea of what to expect.
http://weather.unisys.com for all of that data.
Finally, you can get really out of control and check out a Skew-T/Log-P chart for really raw upper air data. I personally use it to complement the CAPE, Lifted Index, and K Index contour plots. If you learn how to read it, it can give you a pretty good cross-section of the atmosphere and give you a better idea of what to expect.
http://weather.unisys.com for all of that data.
cmill
Cold Ass Honky
Very good stuff.
Local knowledge is very important, as well as the charts.
From what ive ascertained in my limited experience, storms along a front will always be rough. The faster the front moves, the rougher the ride. I've gotten much worse rides out of winter storm along a front than i ever have from summer time popcorn cells.
Wide-spread areas of moderate to heavy rain, from what ive seen are rarely rough. They dont seem to have quite the energy of their counter-parts. I've picked through two different hurricanes once they've made land fall, and they bar far didnt compare to a fast moving front. Pick through the bands and you're golden. Trying to land is a different story, though.
Long story short, avoid lines of wx if you can, if you cant, pick through it.
If you look at the radar and see a huge glob of yellow with a lil red, i wouldnt worry too much.
This may sound like common sense, but its things that no one ever bothered to tell me.
I'm not advocating flying through hazardous WX, but there are situations where its un-avoidable. These are tips that have worked for me, but as always YMMV.
ColoradoPilot
New Member
Agreed. One of the best training flights I've ever had was my IFR cross country. I decided (though it was quite expensive) to fly from Colorado to Florida in the summer with my instructor. I learned more then I ever thought I could in a single flight. You also get to interact with other controllers in different airspaces.
Just my 2 cents worth.
If its white...you are alright
If its gray...you are okay
If its black...turn your a$$ back
In all seriousness, I agree with some of the other posters. Definitely take someone with you the first few times you go. I tried to get as much actual during my training as I could, but it is much different when you are sitting there by yourself with nobody to rely on but yourself.
If its gray...you are okay
If its black...turn your a$$ back
In all seriousness, I agree with some of the other posters. Definitely take someone with you the first few times you go. I tried to get as much actual during my training as I could, but it is much different when you are sitting there by yourself with nobody to rely on but yourself.