Fair pay for adding a type

jrh

Well-Known Member
I could use some collective wisdom on the best angle to take in a situation...

I'm currently qualified on one aircraft type, a light jet, for a charter company. I might have the opportunity to get typed in a midsize jet for the same operation. So I'd be current and actively flying two types rather than one.

Schedule, seniority, destinations, clientele, etc are all basically the same. My day to day life wouldn't change much. Some trips I'd get in a light jet and other trips I'd get in a midsize, compared to always getting in a light jet which is what I'm doing now.

I like my job fine. No promises to stay forever but no reason to leave anytime soon either. If I were to leave, it would most likely be to go to a quality Part 91 flight department for better pay/schedule.

With all this in mind, what's the best angle to negotiate fair compensation for getting a second type? Is the company doing me a favor, or am I doing them a favor? They're getting a good pilot who will probably stick around a while, and I'm getting a type rating that may or may not help with career advancement. How would you negotiate if you were in my shoes?
 

GypsyPilot

Well-Known Member
Any reason you can’t request the NBAA average percentile (at a minimum) for your location on the new jet?
 

Pilot Fighter

Well-Known Member
I could use some collective wisdom on the best angle to take in a situation...

I'm currently qualified on one aircraft type, a light jet, for a charter company. I might have the opportunity to get typed in a midsize jet for the same operation. So I'd be current and actively flying two types rather than one.

Schedule, seniority, destinations, clientele, etc are all basically the same. My day to day life wouldn't change much. Some trips I'd get in a light jet and other trips I'd get in a midsize, compared to always getting in a light jet which is what I'm doing now.

I like my job fine. No promises to stay forever but no reason to leave anytime soon either. If I were to leave, it would most likely be to go to a quality Part 91 flight department for better pay/schedule.

With all this in mind, what's the best angle to negotiate fair compensation for getting a second type? Is the company doing me a favor, or am I doing them a favor? They're getting a good pilot who will probably stick around a while, and I'm getting a type rating that may or may not help with career advancement. How would you negotiate if you were in my shoes?
If your 91 operation is small and flies two types, you want two types. If your 91 operation needs to let somebody go, the guy with one type might be the first to go. If your 91 operation eventually drops your type, the training option may no longer be on the table.

There are so many dynamics that aren't revealed in your post. Is the operation big enough that they just need one utility fielder with both types and there's pretty good job security for everybody regardless? Given past utilization, is it possible the smaller aircraft might be dumped in the future?

For me, I didn't think I needed more money to hold a second type as long as I was well compensated for training and the extra time to maintain the second type. We eventually dumped our second type, the Hawker 4000 (withhold laughter), and it didn't impact me at all. We let the guy with just a 4000 type go.

It's a tough call, do you have the equity to get what you want? Holding an extra type might not hold additional value for you or your employer now. It might in the future. Hard to predict the future.

An extra type gives you and your employer more options. I'd softly push for more money but I'd pursue the second type if it didn't represent more work for less pay, and training IS work.
 

KLB

Well-Known Member
I'd ask for the average pay of the midsized type IF it'dms higher than your current salary. If you are on the high end if your current airframes salary and higher than the average salary on the midsized, I'd likely not ask for a raise.
 

Pilot Fighter

Well-Known Member
I'd ask for the average pay of the midsized type IF it'dms higher than your current salary. If you are on the high end if your current airframes salary and higher than the average salary on the midsized, I'd likely not ask for a raise.
Seems like a reasonable and safe approach. There's so many dynamics that are unknown.

Might be as simple as they are having a two-for-one sale down at the pilot outlet store or it might be a critical element of the operation's future plans.
 
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EIR

Beer Drinker
You'd be doing your company a favor. They've already invested in you and know your ability, rather than bringing in a new hire and taking a gamble.

In regards to pay, you'd use the midsize salary numbers (assuming they're higher than what you're at now). What's the MGTOW for the midsize?
 

Cessnaflyer

Wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Following along I may be in the same situation as well. Where do you find the acceptable pay for the position? I’ve been told the ones from the professional pilot survey are low.
 

Pilot Fighter

Well-Known Member
You'd be doing your company a favor. They've already invested in you and know your ability, rather than bringing in a new hire and taking a gamble.
The company would certainly benefit from having a guy with two types. However, the alternative may not be bringing in a new hire.

Once again, there's a lot we don't know about this situation. Has the offer been extended to anybody else in the company? Has the offer been extended to an existing mid-size guy? Has the deal been offered to the low man on the totem pole that wants to increase his value with uncertain times ahead?
 

Crockrocket94

Well-Known Member
I look at it as twice the work in a sense. You have to be trained in both, so you have to know both. Thats putting your ticket on the line each year (91 is easy I know, but from a 135 standpoint)In presumable alternating training types. You should be compensated to the higher paying type no doubt. I flew 2 types for an operator and while at the time underpaid, I was compensated based on the largest airframe.

I didn't mind doing it, as it makes you more marketable should something happen, just make sure you are compensated. Don't fly a Global for Citation rates :)
 
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Inverted25

Well-Known Member
If you worked at my place your new base would be the midsize jet which would be a step up from the light jet pay and if you stayed dual typed you would receive a dual type increase on top of that new higher base.


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KLB

Well-Known Member
Shoot, this isn’t 2018 pilot shortage anymore. Just be glad if they don’t make you pay for the type rating.



Only half joking.
My gig (which is a great management company) currently has 27 openings. There are so many new aircrafts owners that are purchasing aircraft and the company is extremely selective. The Eutopia of the pilot shortage has worn off, but it still isn't too bad out there though.
 

Richman

That's "Lord Garth" to you
The company would certainly benefit from having a guy with two types. However, the alternative may not be bringing in a new hire.
Depends. If the "new hire" is the idiot nephew of one of the principals, or their buddies, then you're doomed anyway.
 

TUCKnTRUCK

That guy
If the increased duties and responsibilities merit an increase, then by all means, ask for one. Dual typed means you can get called in on more trips.

Pay based off size is kind of silly TBH. While we fly a midsize jet, we pay our pilots based off expectations and equipment that their experience justifies. I’m not paying a reliable, highly experienced responsible pilot who has good rapport with the principals “hawker” pay. If I did I’d be looking for new pilots all the time.


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Flyinthrew

Well-Known Member
My gig (which is a great management company) currently has 27 openings. There are so many new aircrafts owners that are purchasing aircraft and the company is extremely selective. The Eutopia of the pilot shortage has worn off, but it still isn't too bad out there though.
*Desire to know more intensifies.*

I got the part about the confluence of not flying with COVID peasants and the impending end of tax awesomeness for HNWIs. Got that. Let's talk about the jobs. I'll send a PM.
 
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