FADEC making it too easy.

[BEEF SUPREME]

I also wanted to add that with the addition of any new system comes the possibility of a new set of malfunctions. A CRJ-200 had a fuel control unit failure where it metered 2,000PPH (instead of 400PPH) into one of the engines during a start. Had the crew member noticed this (I know I would NOT have, not armchair quarterbacking - it was a wakeup call for me), they might have aborted the start before the tailpipe fire.

Checking the fuel flow was part of my start scan for PT6 variants. Now I practically sleep durning starts due to FADEC. I'm quite serious when I say thanks for the reminder and there by the grace of god go I.

 

[Bandit_Driver]

Checking the fuel flow was part of my start scan for PT6 variants. Now I practically sleep durning starts due to FADEC. I'm quite serious when I say thanks for the reminder and there by the grace of god go I.

Fuel Flow is one of the first indications that a start is going south and must to watch on both engines. I was trained to still watch FF on start even on FADEC because you can stop bad start before the FADEC does and lock a fault into EICAS for an overtemp or fire. It pays to know your plan whether it is computerized or not. A trained eye can sometimes spot a malfuntion before the computer does because you can see it coming where as the computer has to wait until a limit is exceeding. This might be the difference in getting a second start attempt at an out station or spending the night.

 

[derg]

You know on the MD-88, the initial "thump" the engines made as fuel was introduced usually told me that we were going to get a flashing EGT and a hot start. It's weird and indicative that I flew that aircraft for far too long.

 

[Polar742]

I always thought that the more complex aircraft I fly, that the engine start and operating procedures would be more complicated. Is it me, or does FADEC make it too easy? I feel stupid after flying the Citation Encore because it really does not require much brain function to operate these advanced aircraft. It's much harder to start a piston Aztec than the Encore. I guess these push button aircraft are a thing of the future. Sometimes I wish I could have lived in the era when 727's were king and pilot's had to work to start the aircraft and be on their game to stay within limitations. I guess it's nice when you are tired and don't want to have to work too hard, but it kind of takes the fun out of it.

Look at it like transitioning to flying a jet. That stuff all sounds cool. And it is cool. For about 6 months. Then it's back to "how can I operate as safely and simply as possible. Also, old tech planes tend not to cool off as nicely as new tech ones (pack control systems?), older derivative motors have far less margin than the newer derivatives (nothing like having a 3000' or greater stop margin after a reject than a 500' or less stop margin) blah, blah blah....

I'll take my CF6 with magic control over the RR Dart with fuel trim. Now that was a motor that made the jt9 look like a fully automated engine.

Then again, I never understood how starting the APU on a 747-200 or 727 was fully automated process,but the engines weren't...

YMMV

 

[flyer8]

Then again, I never understood how starting the APU on a 747-200 or 727 was fully automated process,but the engines weren't...

Yeah, I always wondered the same thing!

 

[derg]

Then again, I never understood how starting the APU on a 747-200 or 727 was fully automated process,but the engines weren't...

YMMV

True!

But then, I've had to do a number of manual starts, battery starts and "Lewinski"/Huffer starts back in the 727 days.

I liked the −232's because we had that paddle on the starter switch so when skipper was on a mission to find every last bump in the taxiway, my hand wouldn't spring off the switch and we'd have to start all over again.

 

[Bandit_Driver]

Then again, I never understood how starting the APU on a 747-200 or 727 was fully automated process,but the engines weren't...

YMMV

A limited number of 727 have somewhat of an auto start. They have rotary ign/start switches and holding relays that hold them in start until the engine is approximatley 18% n2. The pilot still has to manually introduce the fuel and monitor the start.

The APU start also has to be monitored closely as I have seen a few hang, go hot, or the APU CRANK light doesn't go out.