FAA issues ATIS for MANPADS threat LA area

C

ComplexHiAv8r

Well-Known Member
http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?do=main.textpost&id=33ee9ffe-3ff4-4d69-9367-eff02ddf093d


FAA Issues ATIS Report Of Possible MANPADS Threat To Aircraft In LA Area
Pilot Reports of Worrisome ATIS Transmission Confirmed by FAA, Feds
After a tumultuous few days involving threats, real and potential, to events, transportation systems and a number of North American targets, it appears that aviation has not escaped the ire of erstwhile terrorists.


ANN has received and confirmed multiple reports late Wednesday about the content of at least one ATIS transmission reporting the potential of a MANPADS threat to aircraft in the LA (Los Angeles) area. MANPADS are otherwise known as man-portable air-defense systems and can take the form of portable, often shoulder-fired, surface-to-air missiles often used to target aircraft and associated airborne targets.

According to one ANN Reader report, the KTOA ATIS reported at 2247 Zulu, via Information Quebec, "...Attention all aircraft: reported MANPADS threat, exercise extreme caution for the LA area and surrounding airports, reported by the internal security at 1200 local time...." By the time that the ATIS had updated to Romeo, the alert had either been retracted or dismissed.

Conversations with FAA and FBI sources confirm that there has been a threat of unknown (anonymous) nature that local Law Enforcement became aware of and a number of agencies were alerted. The details are pretty thin (at least in terms of what they are willing to state at this point), but the concern was apparently strong enough for the info to be carried on at least one ATIS Alert that we are aware of.
 
Wow, at that point, wouldn't they just issue a ground stop for the affected area? Would bring the whole system to shudddering stop, but imagine if the crazies took down a 737...
 
ComplexHiAv8r said:
http://www.aero-news.net/index.cfm?do=main.textpost&id=33ee9ffe-3ff4-4d69-9367-eff02ddf093d


FAA Issues ATIS Report Of Possible MANPADS Threat To Aircraft In LA Area
Pilot Reports of Worrisome ATIS Transmission Confirmed by FAA, Feds
After a tumultuous few days involving threats, real and potential, to events, transportation systems and a number of North American targets, it appears that aviation has not escaped the ire of erstwhile terrorists.


ANN has received and confirmed multiple reports late Wednesday about the content of at least one ATIS transmission reporting the potential of a MANPADS threat to aircraft in the LA (Los Angeles) area. MANPADS are otherwise known as man-portable air-defense systems and can take the form of portable, often shoulder-fired, surface-to-air missiles often used to target aircraft and associated airborne targets.

According to one ANN Reader report, the KTOA ATIS reported at 2247 Zulu, via Information Quebec, "...Attention all aircraft: reported MANPADS threat, exercise extreme caution for the LA area and surrounding airports, reported by the internal security at 1200 local time...." By the time that the ATIS had updated to Romeo, the alert had either been retracted or dismissed.

Conversations with FAA and FBI sources confirm that there has been a threat of unknown (anonymous) nature that local Law Enforcement became aware of and a number of agencies were alerted. The details are pretty thin (at least in terms of what they are willing to state at this point), but the concern was apparently strong enough for the info to be carried on at least one ATIS Alert that we are aware of.
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That's my home airport!
 
ozziecat35 said:
Wow, at that point, wouldn't they just issue a ground stop for the affected area? Would bring the whole system to shudddering stop, but imagine if the crazies took down a 737...
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It doesn't even have to be a 737.

Yipe!


This post brought to you by Beta. Beta: Chicks dig it.
 
This can't be real. Anyone seen anything in a briefing? I haven't done one yet today.


Edit to add: I can't find anything but a few sources that have no real backing to their sources other than an old, expired ATIS.
 
I'm LAX based and I've heard nothing from my airline or received any FAA alerts via email. I hope this doesn't affect my commute tonight. :rolleyes:
 
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IIRC EL AL has counter measures similar to our LAIRCM. How long will it be until U.S. carriers will be mandated to carry such equipment?
 
I'm actually a little surprised that terrorists haven't shot down any airliners in the US yet. They have the missiles, and it's not like it would be hard to get them into this country.

Sent from LV-426.
 
How does the targeting on these work? Are they generally heat seeking or point and shoot? Was curious what the survivability of such an incident would be on something 73 or larger. I assume it would depend on point of impact/altitude.
 
Some work off infra red and other bands for tracking, and can have sophisticated targeting built in (they are used to countermeasures for e.g.) sometimes it is a point and shoot, which is obviously tough to counter (if you remember there were tanks at (the perimeter of) LHR at one point).

Alex.
 
Murdoughnut said:
How does the targeting on these work? Are they generally heat seeking or point and shoot? Was curious what the survivability of such an incident would be on something 73 or larger. I assume it would depend on point of impact/altitude.
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RPG, aim and shoot.
SMAW or Javelin, they can lock.


Source, I play too much MW3.
 
I would think you would need a golden bb type shot with an RPG to bring one down, but maybe some of you who've been shot at with them can provide some feedback.
 
This already happened folks....

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Just because it's a different country, doesn't make it any less real.
 
It's quite a process to stage the proper launch site and successfully hit an aircraft. The ease is the size but that only makes it easy to manipulate and transport. Beyond that, you need an area that will allow it to launch and arm itself and detonate before it runs out of energy. It would be quite an undertaking and even more so in the US because people here talk when they see military stuff. So, first you have to get one and somehow get it in the country (the easy part). Then, you have to choose your location. If you're a terrorist, a small GA airport would just not do so that leaves you with mostly larger, more metropolitan areas (much less used to seeing military equipment unless you have SWAT out) so you have to keep it hidden until the last moment. You need to find the right spot to give it a chance to meet its needs to get the target. And you need to electrically power the thing and I hear it takes a bit to cold start it. I suppose a bad guy could make it happen but it's a lot of planning ans risk for them for just one chance per pricey trigger pull.
 
Murdoughnut said:
How does the targeting on these work? Are they generally heat seeking or point and shoot? Was curious what the survivability of such an incident would be on something 73 or larger. I assume it would depend on point of impact/altitude.
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Most are infrared, some are LOS and are "driven" by the operator into the aircraft. Some are laser-guided where an operator keeps a laser on the target. Next generation missiles currently in development require only that you select a target and it will either be continuously lased and tracked by computer or its unique heat signature will be committed to memory of the missile.
 
falconvalley said:
It's quite a process to stage the proper launch site and successfully hit an aircraft. The ease is the size but that only makes it easy to manipulate and transport. Beyond that, you need an area that will allow it to launch and arm itself and detonate before it runs out of energy. It would be quite an undertaking and even more so in the US because people here talk when they see military stuff. So, first you have to get one and somehow get it in the country (the easy part). Then, you have to choose your location. If you're a terrorist, a small GA airport would just not do so that leaves you with mostly larger, more metropolitan areas (much less used to seeing military equipment unless you have SWAT out) so you have to keep it hidden until the last moment. You need to find the right spot to give it a chance to meet its needs to get the target. And you need to electrically power the thing and I hear it takes a bit to cold start it. I suppose a bad guy could make it happen but it's a lot of planning ans risk for them for just one chance per pricey trigger pull.
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Why would a small GA airport "just not do"? A terrorist could simply look up a small airport where a relatively large business jet was en-route on flightaware, and then take it out.

Are you telling me that shooting down a Gulfstream-V or Global Express flying into Podunk, South Carolina wouldn't have the intended effect?

Because I think it would.
 
Maybe to you and I, but we're not spending our time, money and efforts on this. There are a lot of ways terrorists can easily find to terrorize, but those who really want to make a point aim for big things. As for those that actually have access to manpads (RPGs won't cut it), what are the odds that one of them is going to successfully get one here and and pick the easier target? I'd say lower than the odds that you'll disagree with me :)
 
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