Everything I need to know for Naval Aviation and my odds

[Vincent Rustico]

Well, I've wanted to be a pilot since I was young, maybe 9 or so? I'm 16 now. Always was a Navy brat and always will be. I have good knowledge with planes and aviation, which helps as a background, but the good stuff is coming up. Currently a Sophomore, well ending my Sophomore year this week, will be a Junior in September. I have a 4.0 GPA, All honors courses (with the exception of one, but not a big deal), Mock Trial club, Soccer and Swimming, AFJROTC with my school, United States Naval Sea Cadet Corps outside of school (looks super good for anything), part of National Honors Society, and I come from a good family, who I believe have raised me right, or so I have been told. I speak with my guidance counselor pretty often, with questions I have, but she can't give me the answers I need for the specific route I wish to follow. I've spoken to a Navy recruiter, but he didn't really help me much; it seemed like he was reading off of a script with every question I asked, go figure, he's a recruiter, what did I expect? I also spoke with an Army recruiter, who was really personable and honest, but he was Army, and couldn't help me regarding the Navy route, but he still made some good points of advice, person to person, not recruiter to potential recruit. My plans are to continue on the path I am on with everything, and hopefully get the NROTC scholarship. I hope to attend Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Daytona Beach and get a BS in Aeronautical Science. I recently visited the campus and fell in love with it in its entirety. The only issue is that for the first 2 years, tuition would be around $75k, and $60k for the third year, which is quite expensive. I want to be a Naval Aviator in the long run, get my multi-engine hours with the Navy, then eventually retire from the Navy and go into the commercial world as an airline pilot. I just need to know what I should do from this point on, the end of my Sophomore year, all the way up to getting into Naval Aviation. Is paying all that money for Embry-Riddle, the ivy league of flight schools, worth it, or should I get a degree in something else, where it is cheaper? Oh, one more thing. My mom works for Rutgers University, and since she does, I would be able to go there without paying a dime in tuition. Just food for thought. I am kind of overwhelmed with options and I would like some of you who have experience in this field to give me tips of advice and guidance of where to go from here. Anything is appreciated. Thank you so much guys.

 

[Pilot Fighter]

My mom works for Rutgers University, and since she does, I would be able to go there without paying a dime in tuition.

Go to Rutgers, study engineering, study hard, make good grades, don't drink and drive, don't get arrested, don't get any girls pregnant, graduate near the top of your class.

Live at home, learn to fly, fly.

You'll have a pretty good shot at a military career, possibly in aviation. If your dream changes, you'll have something other than an aviation degree and you are debt free.

 

[kaudbron]

Alright dude... That was a metric ton of questions, which is good.... So I will ask some back... Why Navy? Is the need to fly off a boat overpowering you won't consider something else? Are you ok with dropping something besides a F-18 out of pilot training? For instance Helos, P-8, COD, etc....

A small percentage of peeps drop Fighter/Attack out of Navy ROTC compared to other services. (Other service dudes correct me if I am wrong)....

In conclusion if you drop the service requirement what do you want to do?

Fly a fighter? Fly attack and support bubbas on the ground? See the world by flying cargo/pax all over the place, or land tip of the spear dudes on a 3,000 dirt strip in bad guy places...
The world is your oyster you have a •-ton of options at this point....
Don't limit yourself to a certain branch... That being said I think at this point you are going to be looking at Navy or Air Force... Not Army, unless you want to fly Helos.

 

[Beefy McGee]

I used to teach Navy flight screening. Get an engineering degree or other math/science degree if you can handle it and still get good grades. At least half my students had engineering degrees. The Navy likes that. My engineering students seemed to have less trouble with academics during Navy flight ground school later. That degree will be much more useful in the regular world than aviation science if things don't go right.

Also, about half the students I had were Annapolis grads. Maybe another 40% were Navy/Marine ROTC programs at other colleges/ universities. A few were from the Merchant Marine Academy. The rest were almost all prior enlisted miltary with degrees who had been picked up while serving already.

Most of my students had played some sort of athletics too, whether NCAA football, baseball, softball, swimming, soccer, track, lacrosse, wrestling, volleyball - male and female alike. Not talking intramural sports, I mean actual NCAA team sports. I am not exaggerating - I taught 4 Navy football players, 1 Texas A&M, and 1 Virgina football player in just a few weeks. Lots of running sport types. The Navy likes fit, athletic go-getter types as pilot candidates. I think the leadership development of some sports may be a factor too.

If I was you, my first goal if I wanted a pilot slot based on what I saw would be to attend the Naval Academy, second choice would be a major D1 NCAA school with a ROTC program where you could get involved in a sport. Third would be an Ivy League school or one known for amazing academics (say Stanford, MIT, Missouri S&T, Cal Tech etc) if you can't do sports.

 

[Beefy McGee]

Also, probably 50% of the Navy students got assigned to helicopters, the rest fixed wing. With fixed wing spread across P-3/P-8 (probably a couple other platforms too but I can't think of any at the moment) land based, or tailhook fighters/E-2 ship based. The Marines, even more got helos vs fixed wing. Are you cool with helos if you can't get fixed wing?

 

[Beefy McGee]

Another thing- the Navy and Marines combined were running about 1200 pilot candidates a year through the IFS program at the contracted civilian flight schools near NAS Pensacola as of 2013-2014. So you are competing for one of those 1200 or so slots, with 500-600 or more possibly going to Annapolis grads. There were some pilot candidates who had a private license who graduated college and went straight to Navy ground school, skipping the IFS stage, but not too many. It might be worth getting a PPL between now and college graduation, maybe not. You should probably research that.

 

[Mano]

I'm a former Navy instructor, so let me echo or enhance what has already been mentioned. For your best odds:

1. Get a technical degree (math or hard science).
2. Your commissioning options are the Academy, ROTC and OCS. Since you didn't mention interest in the Academy, find a school with an ROTC program because there aren't a lot of guys getting flight school slots out of OCS anymore.
3. Going to Embry-Riddle is great if that's what you want to do, but it won't make any difference in the Navy's eyes. I'd be all about getting a free degree from Rutgers if I were you.
4. Do some extra curriculars. Volunteer with a non-profit or church regularly, join a social organization, assist on a research project with a prof in your academic field, run for office in student gov't, etc. Aside from your GPA, these things will be weighed the heaviest on your applications.
5. Participate in some sort of sports. The previous recommendation of being a D1 athlete is a fairly ridiculous standard - hey, if you can play football for Ohio St, definitely pursue it (yeah, no kidding) - but there are a lot of options. The Navy is big on endurance athletes lately, so compete in something like half-marathons, triathlons, swimming, etc. (Any swimming is good because it'll help down the road in API).
6. Do well in school and keep a clean criminal record. Which school you go to doesn't really matter as long as it's accredited and you have good grades. The idea that your 3rd best option is to go to an Ivy League school if you're not a D1 athlete or going to the Academy is silly. As I previously mentioned, I'd be taking a free degree from Rutgers and be a member of their ROTC program.

Best of luck. And if you have questions, I'm more than happy to answer.

 

[///AMG]

I used to teach Navy flight screening. Get an engineering degree or other math/science degree if you can handle it and still get good grades. At least half my students had engineering degrees. The Navy likes that. My engineering students seemed to have less trouble with academics during Navy flight ground school later. That degree will be much more useful in the regular world than aviation science if things don't go right.

Also, about half the students I had were Annapolis grads. Maybe another 40% were Navy/Marine ROTC programs at other colleges/ universities. A few were from the Merchant Marine Academy. The rest were almost all prior enlisted miltary with degrees who had been picked up while serving already.

Most of my students had played some sort of athletics too, whether NCAA football, baseball, softball, swimming, soccer, track, lacrosse, wrestling, volleyball - male and female alike. Not talking intramural sports, I mean actual NCAA team sports. I am not exaggerating - I taught 4 Navy football players, 1 Texas A&M, and 1 Virgina football player in just a few weeks. Lots of running sport types. The Navy likes fit, athletic go-getter types as pilot candidates. I think the leadership development of some sports may be a factor too.

If I was you, my first goal if I wanted a pilot slot based on what I saw would be to attend the Naval Academy, second choice would be a major D1 NCAA school with a ROTC program where you could get involved in a sport. Third would be an Ivy League school or one known for amazing academics (say Stanford, MIT, Missouri S&T, Cal Tech etc) if you can't do sports.

While I wouldn't say that the folks you mentioned don't exist in decent numbers (particularly USNA grads and/or engineering majors), for every guy who went to the academy, or played D1 ball in college, or went to an Ivy League, there is at least another guy who didn't do any of those things. Myself being a prime example. I did study engineering in college, but I know many guys who got underwater basket weaving degrees from no-name schools as well who also got their wings of gold. Whatever route you choose, you need to make yourself competitive. The two main things that will make you competitive for an SNO/NFO spot are a solid GPA, and a good ASTB score. What is "competitive" in each of those categories varies a little by year, and a little by commissioning source. For the GPA piece, major area of study also matters……i.e. a guy with a 3.1 in Electrical Engineering is generally more competitive than a guy with a 3.1 in Political Science, at least only looking at GPA. That is kind of where the "Navy likes technical majors" thing comes into play. ASTB is also important, as they view it as an indicator of a person's ability to successfully complete the early stages of flight school, mainly API (Aviation Pre-flight Indoctrination) and IFS.

When you start looking at extracurricular activities, they want to see some stuff that shows you are well rounded, and that perhaps you have a responsible bone in your body, and maybe a little bit of demonstrated leadership ability. That could mean playing high school or college sports. It could mean being an Eagle Scout. It could be a lot of different things. The main thing is that they want to see consistency and some time having been devoted. If you have 67 extracurriculars which you just did to say you did them, but had no participation of real substance, that is going to mean a lot less than 1 or 2 activities that you have really spent some time and effort on. For the Academy and ROTC folks, this discussion is more of a "when applying for commissioning program at the end of high school" discussion, rather than a years later "applying for a flight contract from within USNA/NROTC" discussion. Those two programs provide you ample time and evaluation of your teamwork/leadership/well-rounded-ness. It isn't that you aren't doing extracurriculars, you are just doing them as part of your official duties as a midshipman. If you were an OCS applicant, then this is a little bit more important, at they will be looking for this kind of stuff at the college level as well. For you right now, in high school, yes, you should absolutely focus on doing some quality extra-curriculars that will enhance your application package to whatever commissioning program you choose.

I hope that helps brother. I'll caveat this all by saying that I began NROTC 14 years ago, and applied for a flight contract 10-11 years ago, so some things may have changed a bit in the intervening years. But most of this stuff stays somewhat static over time as well, so I think it is still probably a decent introduction and some big picture things to think about. Bottom line, go to school, do well, get into a commissioning program, complete that program, and you will be 90% of the way there. Or something like that

 

[///AMG]

6. Do well in school and keep a clean criminal record. Which school you go to doesn't really matter as long as it's accredited and you have good grades. The idea that your 3rd best option is to go to an Ivy League school if you're not a D1 athlete or going to the Academy is silly. As I previously mentioned, I'd be taking a free degree from Rutgers and be a member of their ROTC program.

This. I'd do the exact same thing if I were in your shoes and it were an option.

 

[Mano]

After reading what AMG said, let me add that my advice was solely describing the most risk averse, typical path to getting a pilot slot. Personally, I commissioned through OCS with a degree in political science. There's no "right" path, so take all this advice as just that - advisory.

 

[poser765]

Is airwarriors still a thing?

Sure is! https://www.airwarriors.com/community/

Op, check out that site. In no way am I discrediting the people responding to you on this site. The people who posted above me offer good advice and probably eat, sleep, and breath military aviation, but the COMMUNITY here is much more of a commercial aviation group. Airwarriors, as a COMMUNITY, eat, sleep, and breath military aviation, and all that is associated with it.

 

[Hacker15e]

Put your big-boy pants on over at AirWarriors, as well at Baseops.net if you want to look into the USAF route.

Use the search function and do A LOT of reading before you ask a question. Chances are, all of your questions have been asked and answered in glorious detail previously.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Since finances seem to be part of the equation I would go with USNA as option 1. I would follow that up with USAFA and the U.S. Coast Guard Academy (easier to get into and still has the option of going to Navy Flight School to become a U.S. Coast Guard aviator).

One thing you don't want to do at your age is put all your eggs in one basket. Ask me how I know? Have a first choice; a second choice; a third choice; and so on; and so on. Start working on a Congressional nomination to the academies. You should have a good shot with your academic and extra-curricular activities. Keep your vision 20/20 or better by making sure to take time away from studying. Go outside and play; look into the distance; do eye exercises. If your vision drops below 20/20 look into Orthokeratology.

Oh, and don't do anything stupid for the next two years. Resist peer pressure in high school to do stupid/illegal things that would ruin your chance of getting into an academy or a good school.

TP

 

[drunkenbeagle]

My plans are to continue on the path I am on with everything, and hopefully get the NROTC scholarship. I hope to attend Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University in Daytona Beach and get a BS in Aeronautical Science. I recently visited the campus and fell in love with it in its entirety. The only issue is that for the first 2 years, tuition would be around $75k, and $60k for the third year,

When I was going about this way back when, getting a scholarship from the AFROTC wasn't all that hard, assuming you were studying electrical, mechanical or chemical engineering (or meteorology). It isn't like being a regular college student when you are a cadet - you can't just change your major on a whim - you are told what majors are permitted. In the case of my classmates, that was anything you wanted, so long as it was engineering.

I wouldn't limit yourself though - apply to every service academy and for every scholarship. Just because you are awarded one, does not mean you are obliged to take it. And the applications and selection boards are good practice anyway. Apply to a bunch of schools, too. As you would expect, they tend to like students that have the government paying lots of full-price tuition...

 

[///AMG]

I also feel like getting a pilot slot @ USAFA or AFROTC is more difficult than getting one in the Navy. That could totally just be my impression, or inaccurate conjecture or whatever of course. I will say that there are a lot of folks who go through USN commissioning programs who have no interest whatsoever in aviation. I'd be willing to bet the percentage of folks in a USAF commissioning program who have aspirations of aviating is higher.

One other little known fact that Typhoonpilot indirectly brought up, is the fact that you can commission at any service academy, and still opt for a USN commission and apply to USN flight school. I know a number of folks who went through the Merchant Marine or USAF Academies who commissioned directly into the Navy on graduation day. There are just a few of those each class, but I know it happens, or at least has happened in the past.