DOT ponders PMDY's future

[BobDDuck]

The DOT has put out a request for comment in regards to spending the about $100 million tist it is going to take to keep the airport up to FAA standards for ETOPS use. In the notice they point out that Shemya and Wake work equally as well for diversion airports (narrator: but they don't).

Between Hawaii and Asia, Midway is the most efficient ETOPS alternate about 90% of the time, and if you are going anywhere south of San Fran on the US end it mostly going to come into play more than Wake (and certainly more than PASY). The most work I've ever had to do on an east bound crossing was try to figure out a plan when the weather in Midway started dropping.

https://www.regulations.gov/document/FAA-2026-8185-0001

 

[Minuteman]

“Welcome to Boeing Midway Field, operated by Accenture"

(Boeing actually did invest in some Pacific airfields in the 1990 to enable more 60-minute ETOPS)

 

[Fixtur]

"oh you want the ILS? That only comes with our ETOPS+ subscription..."

 

[FlyingAccountant]

If you get bored, someone took the liberty of street viewing almost the entire island of Midway on foot on Google Maps. It's pretty neat.

 

[///AMG]

Isn't the weather in Shemya pretty horrible, like most of the year?

 

[JordanD]

"oh you want the ILS? That only comes with our ETOPS+ subscription..."

"Your runway will be open after this brief ad"

 

[bike21]

Isn't the weather in Shemya pretty horrible, like most of the year?

Aye. Except the night we diverted there. Magically clear and a million.

 

[BobDDuck]

Aye. Except the night we diverted there. Magically clear and a million.

Oh... you actually got to divert? I came close a few months ago but the plane decided it was ok with going to Japan and resolved its issues. Which was good because it was pretty much right at mins.

 

[DE727UPS]

Oh... you actually got to divert? I came close a few months ago but the plane decided it was ok with going to Japan and resolved its issues. Which was good because it was pretty much right at mins.

If you went to Shemya what do you do with 300 people. Is there even a terminal there?

 

[BobDDuck]

If you went to Shemya what do you do with 300 people. Is there even a terminal there?

There's a pretty big note on the station bulletin page that says your best bet is to feed 2/3rds of the passengers to the polar bears.

Same issue with Wake and Midway. I think they stock water and emergency food packs and that's it. Passengers stay on the plane until a rescue flight gets there.

 

[MikeD]

Midway is a cool place. lots of history still around there.

 

[Richman]

Way, way back in the day, Northernjets had commissioned a study of divert airports on the NOPAC routes, including the Russian Far East.

Their conclusion was to treat it like a big ocean, and unless you’re burning, keep on going.

 

[DE727UPS]

Way, way back in the day, Northernjets had commissioned a study of divert airports on the NOPAC routes, including the Russian Far East.

Their conclusion was to treat it like a big ocean, and unless you’re burning, keep on going.

We had a 76 shut an engine down on a Norpac route years ago. The diverts were into Siberia. Capt chose to fly three hours until he got to Japan. He was ex-military. Many thought it was a bad call but I'm sure he had his reasons.

 

[bike21]

Oh... you actually got to divert? I came close a few months ago but the plane decided it was ok with going to Japan and resolved its issues. Which was good because it was pretty much right at mins.

Yep, 2019 Christmas eve out of PEK to SEA. 767 motor rolled back in cruise and we were actually pretty close to Petropavlovsk at the time but kept right on flying by. Even before the war we weren't to divert to Russia unless we were on fire like @Richman noted. I was in the bunk having a good snooze when the call came and upstairs we went to see what all the fuss was about.

Flew another hour and half to Shemya and settled on that given it was clear and a million. Worked with mx and dispatch along the way trying resets and discussing where to divert. Cold Bay was a good ways away yet and we weren't sure why the engine quit, so didn't feel great about passing up a perfectly good airport to keep going to PACD.

There's a longer story, but the folks were handled on the ground with a mix of cots in a hangar and being on the airplane overnight. Made it all work and we got a rescue bird in the next day then flew back to SEA.

CPO promised they'd have someone there to greet us, but alas you can't get managment to the airport on a holiday. Got a hotel for the night and made it home the next day in time for a powder day!

 

[bike21]

Yep, 2019 Christmas eve out of PEK to SEA. 767 motor rolled back in cruise and we were actually pretty close to Petropavlovsk at the time but kept right on flying by. Even before the war we weren't to divert to Russia unless we were on fire like @Richman noted. I was in the bunk having a good snooze when the call came and upstairs we went to see what all the fuss was about.

Flew another hour and half to Shemya and settled on that given it was clear and a million. Worked with mx and dispatch along the way trying resets and discussing where to divert. Cold Bay was a good ways away yet and we weren't sure why the engine quit, so didn't feel great about passing up a perfectly good airport to keep going to PACD.

There's a longer story, but the folks were handled on the ground with a mix of cots in a hangar and being on the airplane overnight. Made it all work and we got a rescue bird in the next day then flew back to SEA.

CPO promised they'd have someone there to greet us, but alas you can't get managment to the airport on a holiday. Got a hotel for the night and made it home the next day in time for a powder day!

Oops, 2018. The space time continuum since Covid is hard to keep track of.

 

[BobDDuck]

Yep, 2019 Christmas eve out of PEK to SEA. 767 motor rolled back in cruise and we were actually pretty close to Petropavlovsk at the time but kept right on flying by. Even before the war we weren't to divert to Russia unless we were on fire like @Richman noted. I was in the bunk having a good snooze when the call came and upstairs we went to see what all the fuss was about.

Flew another hour and half to Shemya and settled on that given it was clear and a million. Worked with mx and dispatch along the way trying resets and discussing where to divert. Cold Bay was a good ways away yet and we weren't sure why the engine quit, so didn't feel great about passing up a perfectly good airport to keep going to PACD.

There's a longer story, but the folks were handled on the ground with a mix of cots in a hangar and being on the airplane overnight. Made it all work and we got a rescue bird in the next day then flew back to SEA.

CPO promised they'd have someone there to greet us, but alas you can't get managment to the airport on a holiday. Got a hotel for the night and made it home the next day in time for a powder day!

That sounds pretty smooth for a Aleutians NOPAC divert. Great it worked out that way.

I really feel like that, especially with Russia being Russia right now, that routing is probably one of the most "send it bro" routes with tons of regular traffic as far as having ETOPs alternates that you really hope you never have to use. Maybe I'll feel differently about things once I start flying NAT/HLA more often... and I suppose the guys at LATAM that do Santiago to Melbourne straight across the south (really south) Pacific might feel differently, but for now, it just seems like there are almost no places up there where I'd feel super happy having to go into with something wrong. It does make me feel much better about having to possibly use Nandi or Rarotonga or something when going SouthPac.

 

[MikeD]

To think, at one time, AS had service ANC to Russia with the MDs. Now, it’s not even a good divert option unless critical.

 

[Richman]

To think, at one time, AS had service ANC to Russia with the MDs. Now, it’s not even a good divert option unless critical.

Russia seems to be like that alternate earth in "Journey to the Far Side of the Sun" where everything is opposite and just plugging in your toaster is to invite certain doom.