Don't trust the ATO

WoH said:
Anyone worried that swinte00 still hasn't been back with an update?
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Nope. Not yet anyway. Dont people from the academy have like a two minute turn around for when they have to head back home and report to their facility? I think panic would only be valid if he doesn't respond not by next weekend, but the following weekend.
 
Hey folks..

So here's the deal: I didn't make it in OKC.

I personally feel like I got screwed on my second PV, but it is all in hindsight now. Not to go all religious on everyone, but I have a feeling there's a reason I didn't make it past OKC. A higher power has a different plan for me.

The training was easy. I understood everything, and I loved what I did.

I'll go ahead and say it for whoever is thinking it--"This career isn't for everyone." I know that, and I'm not bitter. I understand that I didn't pass the PV, however, I took this opportunity knowing with every day that there was a possibility that I wouldn't make it. I feel as if there needs to be more open communication between the instructors who work for Raytheon at the Academy and those who are actually evaluating you during the PV.

What busted my second PV, you ask?

I had a H/A310 on final approach to 28R. I had a B733 TIPH (No, the H/A310 was NOT cleared to land.. you can't do that!) I had a guy cross downfield at taxiway Echo. He stopped short of the hold short lines, so I wasn't able to launch the B733 that was in position. Ultimately I had a go-around.

BUT as any wise academy-goer knows, you will have a 2 minute flight path issue if that Heavy overflies your runway. So in my infinite academy wisdom, I issued the go-around (he was about 1nm away from the threshold at this point) and gave him a right turn to 310.

The right turn was an OE according to the evaluators from the FAA--EVEN THOUGH we had been told in class a million times that anywhere from 250 to 310 was within Local Control's jurisdiction and to just let your Departure Controller know that you were turning a guy, whether it was a departing aircraft or a guy on a missed approach. I coordinated with DP (who seemed stunned that I would turn the guy to avoid a flight path issue in the first place) and that's where the "deal" happened when it was all said and done.

Additionally I issued a right-360 to a cessna in the pattern for spacing and they told me that was a poor control decision.

All in all, I had reasons for everything I did and was able to justify my actions, but that didn't matter. I got a "we need your badge and headset, don't drive home today because the weather's bad, and have a great day."

Like the OP said, pass your PV on the first try. You'll be under less scrutiny and little mistakes won't matter as much.

What will I be doing now? I'll be going back to work in my original profession: Software Development and System Administration. I'll be happy to help anyone out who needs it regarding computer issues and the like. Shoot me a PM and I'll give you some contact information.

Thank you to everyone who read my blog, as sparsely updated as it was, and for supporting me through my time at the Academy. I wish all those behind me the best of luck and that you all don't have the same fate that I did.
 
swinte00 said:
Hey folks..

So here's the deal: I didn't make it in OKC.

I personally feel like I got screwed on my second PV, but it is all in hindsight now. Not to go all religious on everyone, but I have a feeling there's a reason I didn't make it past OKC. A higher power has a different plan for me.

The training was easy. I understood everything, and I loved what I did.

I'll go ahead and say it for whoever is thinking it--"This career isn't for everyone." I know that, and I'm not bitter. I understand that I didn't pass the PV, however, I took this opportunity knowing with every day that there was a possibility that I wouldn't make it. I feel as if there needs to be more open communication between the instructors who work for Raytheon at the Academy and those who are actually evaluating you during the PV.

What busted my second PV, you ask?

I had a H/A310 on final approach to 28R. I had a B733 TIPH (No, the H/A310 was NOT cleared to land.. you can't do that!) I had a guy cross downfield at taxiway Echo. He stopped short of the hold short lines, so I wasn't able to launch the B733 that was in position. Ultimately I had a go-around.

BUT as any wise academy-goer knows, you will have a 2 minute flight path issue if that Heavy overflies your runway. So in my infinite academy wisdom, I issued the go-around (he was about 1nm away from the threshold at this point) and gave him a right turn to 310.

The right turn was an OE according to the evaluators from the FAA--EVEN THOUGH we had been told in class a million times that anywhere from 250 to 310 was within Local Control's jurisdiction and to just let your Departure Controller know that you were turning a guy, whether it was a departing aircraft or a guy on a missed approach. I coordinated with DP (who seemed stunned that I would turn the guy to avoid a flight path issue in the first place) and that's where the "deal" happened when it was all said and done.

Additionally I issued a right-360 to a cessna in the pattern for spacing and they told me that was a poor control decision.

All in all, I had reasons for everything I did and was able to justify my actions, but that didn't matter. I got a "we need your badge and headset, don't drive home today because the weather's bad, and have a great day."

Like the OP said, pass your PV on the first try. You'll be under less scrutiny and little mistakes won't matter as much.

What will I be doing now? I'll be going back to work in my original profession: Software Development and System Administration. I'll be happy to help anyone out who needs it regarding computer issues and the like. Shoot me a PM and I'll give you some contact information.

Thank you to everyone who read my blog, as sparsely updated as it was, and for supporting me through my time at the Academy. I wish all those behind me the best of luck and that you all don't have the same fate that I did.
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That sucks, Swinte. I am truly sorry. Good luck with everything the future holds and thanks for all the great posts!
 
swintee your a good guy, your contributions to this forum alone make your wisdom infinate to the many of us still on the path to the FAA. Even though that didnt work out your still the light on the path to a bunch of us...good luck on your path bud...
 
swinte00 said:
The right turn was an OE according to the evaluators from the FAA--EVEN THOUGH we had been told in class a million times that anywhere from 250 to 310 was within Local Control's jurisdiction and to just let your Departure Controller know that you were turning a guy
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This is really disturbing to me. First we go through an 18-month long process to get an academy date, then they teach us things that fail us on the PV? Isn't there someone to whom you can appeal about an obvious failure on the part of the trainers?

I feel really bad for you swinte, man. I'm glad you have something to go back to.
 
Bernoulli Fan said:
This is really disturbing to me. First we go through an 18-month long process to get an academy date, then they teach us things that fail us on the PV? Isn't there someone to whom you can appeal about an obvious failure on the part of the trainers?

I feel really bad for you swinte, man. I'm glad you have something to go back to.
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90% of what you learn at the academy is going to be wrong compared with how your facility handles it.
Like the OP said, pass on the first time by playing ball and be done with it.
 
The Mighty Casey has struck out.

I think this news has dealt quite a blow to the confidence of people heading to the academy soon.

Thanks for the update, and good luck to you swinte00.
 
Wow, I am totally stunned. Swinte, I don't know you from Adam, but you seem like a very smart, capable person. The fact that they didn't see enough potential in you to pass you after two tries is a little scary to me. I am giving up a really good career to try for ATC becuase I think it is something I will love. Your story is a grim reminder that risk doesn't always equal reward, and I may be out on the street looking for a job when this adventure is all said and done. I just keep telling myself that if I don't at least try it, I will forever ask myself, "What if?".

I am really sorry that it didn't work out for you, and I know it probably sounds patronizing, but if there is anything that I can help you out with, please don't hesitate to shoot me a PM or something. Best of luck to you in the future!
 
boy you folks are spoiled,over 95% are passing this joke of a screen and one guy washes out and your all worried. try going through the old screen when 50% washed. what do you think that once you pass OKC your home free? ATC isnt easy,its tales alot to get through training and even more to make it 25 years.
 
We're spoiled and stupid for having sympathy for a guy that just got let go from the agency?

Hopefully I will never understand your point of view. Bitterness and elitism never looked good on me...
 
queeno said:
boy you folks are spoiled,over 95% are passing this joke of a screen and one guy washes out and your all worried. try going through the old screen when 50% washed. what do you think that once you pass OKC your home free? ATC isnt easy,its tales alot to get through training and even more to make it 25 years.
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I do feel bad for you swinte, but I have to agree with queeno. No one on here should freak out cause he's right, 95-97% pass. Just go there and try not to be one of the very very very few. Worry about how much harder the facility's are
 
lol queeno is always going to ruffle feathers no matter what is said, get used to it.

On another note, sorry about everything swinte, hope you got something positive out of it at least
 
All I gotta say is............ the real screen is how u handle being told how wrong you are at your facility every single day...:beer:
 
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