Designated Flight Engineer Examiner?

BravoHotel

BravoHotel

Well-Known Member
The topic came up at work getting the civilian ticket. However the question is how? I've looked my surrounding area on the FAA's website; I have found DPE, DPRE, DME, one for gliders etc but no DFEE. So I'd thought I'd ask the board and see if my RADAR returned any echos. Thanks!
 
The vintage (Ndper?) program has some listed.

I'd love the chance to do a checkride.

Just gotta get that written done I guess...
 
Hawks said:
The topic came up at work getting the civilian ticket. However the question is how? I've looked my surrounding area on the FAA's website; I have found DPE, DPRE, DME, one for gliders etc but no DFEE. So I'd thought I'd ask the board and see if my RADAR returned any echos. Thanks!
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I'd guess most places that still need a FE do it with their own in house guy. The hiring requirements are written only in most cases.
 
Is there something for military equivalency ? I haven't looked at that one in a while, might be something there.


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The engineer ticket is getting like the flight navigator ticket....only if you need it or for the truly dedicated ticket collector.

I've seen both done outside of operators, but it takes some kind of weird conjunction of opportunities.

Richman
 
Richman said:
The engineer ticket is getting like the flight navigator ticket....only if you need it or for the truly dedicated ticket collector.

I've seen both done outside of operators, but it takes some kind of weird conjunction of opportunities.

Richman
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Somewhere I have a link for this fun fact; as of 2013 there were 120 people holding Navigator tickets.


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Hardest license I ever did. You had to know the plane better than the mechanics, but still know piloty stuff to back up the pilots. It really changed how my brain works, and is a great talking point to the crusty captains telling me that I didn't pay my dues.

We did our training in house, and had a fed administer the checkride.

But if you just want it to have it, and have the money, Pan Am Academy in Miami still does FE training and checkrides:

Boeing 727 Flight Engineer (FE) Initial Certification, Part 63, Subpart B

This course provides the trainee with the necessary knowledge and skills to obtain a B727 Flight Engineer Turbo Jet Powered Certificate.


Prerequisites:

  • Commercial Pilot Certificate with Multi Engine Land
  • Instrument Rating
  • FE written
  • Meet the requirements Part 63.
Course Duration: Approximately 21 Days
Classroom Instruction: 72:00 Hours
System Integration Training: 24:00 Hours (16:00 hours classroom; mock-up or simulator without motion + 8:00 hours briefing)
Simulator/Flight Training: 20:00 Hours per trainee (Level B or higher)
Simulator/Certification Check: As Required, 4 Hours per trainee (Level B or higher)

https://www.panamacademy.com/boeing-727-type-rating-and-training-courses​
 
CFI A&P said:
Somewhere I have a link for this fun fact; as of 2013 there were 120 people holding Navigator tickets.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I met one guy who had a FAA Flight Navigator ticket. Wasn't even that old of a guy (at the time). The hoops he had to jump through was impressive, and even then he got some lucky breaks to make it happen that would be improbable to duplicate.

You can still download the FAA's Navigator book:

https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/handbooks_manuals/aviation/media/FAA-H-8083-18.pdf

Engineer tickets are going the same way, but plenty of operators still require FEs. Not sure what's gained in going out an getting your ticket other than to say you have it. In any event, the FE ticket sure seems FAR easier to actually do than the Navigator ticket. That math stuff looks complicated.

I also think there is a wrinkle with the FE ticket in that you need an actual airplane at some point, and not just do it all in a sim. When I did mine, you had a restriction on the ticket until you finished OE, and you had to take your OE form and ticket to the CMO to get a unrestricted FE ticket.

Richman
 
Adler said:
Hardest license I ever did. You had to know the plane better than the mechanics, but still know piloty stuff to back up the pilots. It really changed how my brain works, and is a great talking point to the crusty captains telling me that I didn't pay my dues
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Yep, hardest rating I ever received. Runs a close second to the one I'm most proud of achieving over the years. F/E'd on the B727 for a short time and learned a lot watching seasoned "Jet Gods" with the window seats make it look easy. Seems like yesterday I was sweating out my FE check ride in the sim with a crusty old FAA dude breathing down my back, but that was 28 yrs ago......
 
I keep planning to do the written, just for the knowledge, but it'd be a shame not to use it. Though authorisation to take the written seems overkill...

To verify that you meet the experience requirements of 14 CFR part 63, section 63.37, it is necessary to obtain a written statement and signature from one of the following authorized persons: • A qualified flight engineer with the appropriate class rating • A U.S. Armed Forces flight engineer instructor for the same class of airplane • A flight engineer instructor associated with 14 CFR part 121 training program • An FAA Aviation Safety Inspector (operations/airworthiness) 1 The endorser must include a statement that they have personally verified that you meet the experience requirements of 14 CFR part 63, section 63.37. They must also identify their position, such as flight engineer certificate number, name of the training facility, and FAA inspector’s office identification.
 
ahw01 said:
I keep planning to do the written, just for the knowledge, but it'd be a shame not to use it. Though authorisation to take the written seems overkill...

To verify that you meet the experience requirements of 14 CFR part 63, section 63.37, it is necessary to obtain a written statement and signature from one of the following authorized persons: • A qualified flight engineer with the appropriate class rating • A U.S. Armed Forces flight engineer instructor for the same class of airplane • A flight engineer instructor associated with 14 CFR part 121 training program • An FAA Aviation Safety Inspector (operations/airworthiness) 1 The endorser must include a statement that they have personally verified that you meet the experience requirements of 14 CFR part 63, section 63.37. They must also identify their position, such as flight engineer certificate number, name of the training facility, and FAA inspector’s office identification.
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Isn't that for the practical?
 
Richman said:
I also think there is a wrinkle with the FE ticket in that you need an actual airplane at some point, and not just do it all in a sim. When I did mine, you had a restriction on the ticket until you finished OE, and you had to take your OE form and ticket to the CMO to get a unrestricted FE ticket.
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That restriction basically just says that you need to to a walkaround on OE with a real plane. I know some people have the license, but never actually engineered, and never got it removed.
 
A300Capt said:
Yep, hardest rating I ever received. Runs a close second to the one I'm most proud of achieving over the years. F/E'd on the B727 for a short time and learned a lot watching seasoned "Jet Gods" with the window seats make it look easy. Seems like yesterday I was sweating out my FE check ride in the sim with a crusty old FAA dude breathing down my back, but that was 28 yrs ago......
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I was the #2 727 F/E on the list. June was #1. I got the line she didn't want.
 
DE727UPS said:
I was the #2 727 F/E on the list. June was #1. I got the line she didn't want.
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I think I spent more time training to be an FE than actually being an FE! Barely a year before upgrading to the right seat and then an even quicker lateral to the B757. I don't think June was very far behind me on the overall seniority list.
 
I wrenched for two years and later did the IP/Checkairman thing.

Don't know why people had a big hang up about it. Throw some switches, protect essential, do some walk-arounds.

As bonus, you got to rocket up the category list. After a year I was sitting at the top of the list, getting all my days off and some sweet vacay.

After beating my head against the regional wall for 7 years flying 90 hours a month, it was a nice, chill way to relax.

Richman
 
So lets say you are one of these certificate chasers and you were looking to get a Navigator ticket, where do you start?

I can find the FAA Navigator book, and I am sure the written can be taken and any location. So where do you go after that?

If anyone has any ideas or leads this would be appreciated.
 
BobDispatch said:
So lets say you are one of these certificate chasers and you were looking to get a Navigator ticket, where do you start?

I can find the FAA Navigator book, and I am sure the written can be taken and any location. So where do you go after that?

If anyone has any ideas or leads this would be appreciated.
Click to expand...

Yea, that's going to be a tough ticket to get. If I was all about it, I'd find out who can give the exam and work backwards from there.

The only people I knew that had it had some reserve/guard contacts that they were able to work into doing the ride on a military op of some kind. That's not going to help Joe Bag-o-donuts.

I flipped through the FAA nav book. It was like watching my cat read stereo instructions.

Richman
 
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