Delta off the Runway - LGA

ASpilot2be said:
Here is a bit more info from the company.
http://www.airdat.com/technology/tamdar-sensor-network/
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I scanned the website and it's super interesting. The one thing I can't figure out, is where the average pilot finds the data that's being collected. It seams they have installed their proprietary sensor in "hundreds of commercial aircraft" but I can't seem to find where we as pilots benefit. Am I missing some thing? If they do have all this data why not make it available? I can honestly say I've never heard of this program when I was at a regional or the last five years in part 91. It could be I'm just a little bit of a tard and it's been there the whole time.
 
PositionAndHold said:
I scanned the website and it's super interesting. The one thing I can't figure out, is where the average pilot finds the data that's being collected. It seams they have installed their proprietary sensor in "hundreds of commercial aircraft" but I can't seem to find where we as pilots benefit. Am I missing some thing? If they do have all this data why not make it available? I can honestly say I've never heard of this program when I was at a regional or the last five years in part 91. It could be I'm just a little bit of a tard and it's been there the whole time.
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All the websites are outdated and I think moved, so I cant find them. But it sounds like it really helps with forecasting. But this Powerpoint was really quite interesting. http://www.erh.noaa.gov/phi/presentations/aviation/RSmith.ppt It seems to a little more behind the scenes. If I can find a source where you can find the results I will let you know.
 
ASpilot2be said:
All the websites are outdated and I think moved, so I cant find them. But it sounds like it really helps with forecasting. But this Powerpoint was really quite interesting. http://www.erh.noaa.gov/phi/presentations/aviation/RSmith.ppt It seems to a little more behind the scenes. If I can find a source where you can find the results I will let you know.
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Thanks for the research. I appreciate it. It's a cool concept, especially if it's been done for the last few years.
 
CFIscare said:
I've never really understood the hate torwards DFW. For an airspace and airport that big, it's really simple and easygoing to get in and get out. Sure, they aren't as aggressive as Chicago, but there is no need to be. The airport has a layout that doesn't create a cluster****, so why push the boundaries?
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"Spot 48 Turn left"

"Turn left where"

"Left"

"That isn't an instruction."
 
PhilosopherPilot said:
I can buy that, with the understanding that the bar for negligence is really, really, really high.
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As in gross negligence? ;) I know, who knows what that is either? I'm not qualified to comment on what should or should not get someone fired but I will say that some of the best and safest pilots I know have made a really bad mistake using poor judgment and come away better for having done it.
 
Cav said:
As in gross negligence? ;) I know, who knows what that is either? I'm not qualified to comment on what should or should not get someone fired but I will say that some of the best and safest pilots I know have made a really bad mistake using poor judgment and come away better for having done it.
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It would damn near have to be intentional to be worthy of being fired, and I seriously doubt that's the case. I'm always amazed at the "that could never happen to me" crowd calling for heads on a pike.
 
PhilosopherPilot said:
It would damn near have to be intentional to be worthy of being fired, and I seriously doubt that's the case. I'm always amazed at the "that could never happen to me" crowd calling for heads on a pike.
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If you have a decision, for the right reasons, and it doesn't work out, the company will have your back.

If you make a decision, in poor judgement, and then adamantly charge forward through a sea of red flags, you may have shortened your career.
 
Derg said:
If you have a decision, for the right reasons, and it doesn't work out, the company will have your back.

If you make a decision, in poor judgement, and then adamantly charge forward through a sea of red flags, you may have shortened your career.
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True, though at my last company there are plenty of examples where metal was bent, and the crew was retrained, even with some very poor judgement.

The CHA windshear event comes to mind. Crew elected to continue in the face of a microburst with tower issuing multiple microburst alerts, in addition to a HUGE storm crossing the field. They got a massive wind shear at 30 feet, pusher, left wing stalled and contacted the runway. The only reason they didn't roll inverted and crash was the wind shear was so low that the runway "caught" them.

This was a case where you could say they were negligent. They made a bad decision, and continued in the face of red flags. But when you talked to the crew, they were so mission focused that they allowed themselves to get into a situation where they believed it was too late to go-around because the storm was "right there" and so big they thought it was safer to land than to go-around.

I guess my point with that example is that it's rarely just "cut and dry." They made some bad choices, and arguably the wrong choices at every single point, but they intended to do the right thing. They just effed it up. Repeatedly. So they were given some heavy retraining, and put on back to the line.

Their attitude factored heavily into the decision. They were shocked at the outcome and that it could happen to them. They thought they had made the best decisions possible "in the heat of the moment." They were open to retraining.
 
PhilosopherPilot said:
This was a case where you could say they were negligent. They made a bad decision, and continued in the face of red flags. But when you talked to the crew, they were so mission focused that they allowed themselves to get into a situation where they believed it was too late to go-around because the storm was "right there" and so big they thought it was safer to land than to go-around.
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Ah, then there's a fundamental misunderstanding of what the mission is. Yes, the point is to deliver the people and do so reasonably on time, but the overwhelming mission is "don't kill anyone."
 
Autothrust Blue said:
Ah, then there's a fundamental misunderstanding of what the mission is. Yes, the point is to deliver the people and do so reasonably on time, but the overwhelming mission is "don't kill anyone."
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Yeah. I think it's easy to get in a "gotta get on the ground" mindset. In their case, that's exactly what happened.
 
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