Delta Connection Academy???

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galvestonaggie

galvestonaggie

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I recently became a reader of this forum and I have been very impressed with the level of commentary which for the most part seems very professional and unbiased. With that being said I was wondering if someone would mind giving me a fare assessment of the Delta Connection Academy specifically the branch in Houston.

But first to tell you a little more about myself I am recent business grad of Texas A&M and am currently holding down a corporate job where every time I go to the bathroom I think about hanging myself by the tie around my neck just so I don’t have to go back to my cube and answer some mindless email that begins with “gentle reminder”. Needless to say the cube farm is no place for the aviation soul and while I want to get out of this place and into an airplane soon, I also want to do so in a prudent manor-if such a thing exists. Anyways I presently have 12 hr’s at my local FBO and my instructor tells me that I am getting close to Solo, but since I have made the decision to go the academy route I decided to pull the plug and opt to save as much as I could.

I would really appreciate hearing from anyone who has had an experience at DCA or somewhere else. Namely:

  • How much of an advantage-if any- does training on the SR22 give you? I have heard it’s much easier to master than a 172 or PA-28.
  • They claim impressive statistics about job placement with the academy as an instructer-85% of all students who apply- and they also claim to guarantee you an interview you with one of the airlines in the Delta regional family, is this true?
  • There are claiming an average price tag of 77k, how does this compare to Flight Safety and others?
  • Lastly I still have about 20k in debt left over from A&M, is life at a regional with 100k in student loan debt livable?

As we say in the cube farm, thank you in advance for your time and assistance.
 
I say, to each their own, so without addressing DCA specifically, here are my thoughts on your other questions:

Training in an SR22 gives you no advantage over learning to fly in any other plane except that you may travel a farther distance in a given period of time. With that in mind, about 1/3 of your training is going to be in your local area/airfield practicing maneuvers so the speed is useless in that regard.

What you;ve heard in regard to "mastery" of an airplane being easier than another, I cannot agree with. There comes a point in your experience when an airplane is an airplane is an airplane. That's not going to occur when you are a student. The SR22 is no easier to master than a 152 or 172, only more expensive.

I'll guarantee you an interview with any regional you want if you train with me from private through CFI or ATP. Seriously. On the flip side, I want the money that you're paying DCA. I will quit my current job and train you full time. I am not joking. The best part is is that I will guarantee you an interview with any regional. I can even guarantee you a job as a CFI (that's 100% not 85%) should you not be offered placement with the aforementioned regional.

That's a hell of a bargain. I'll do it for $65K instead of the $77K at DCA.

That's a good segue if I do say so myself. Do you know how many hamburgers you can buy with $77,000 ? A lot of freaking hamburgers. Now, if you're going through accredited flight schools to use your VA bene's, that's another story. But, out-of-pocket or with loans? Then you might want to rethink your plan. You can get the same training in the same timeframe, at the right FBO, with diligent planning and a dedicated instructor.

Finally, if you have $100K in debt, payments average $950 / mo for the next 20 years. IF you get hired at a regional right after you finish training you might make about $1,350 / mo. That gives you a whopping $450 for food, gas, bills, and rent.

If you don't believe me, a little more poking around here should validate what I am saying.

I'm glad you're asking for help. I'm glad you're asking for advice. This is a good place to start.
 
My advise would be to continue working on your private certificate at the local FBO. Even if you decide to go the academy route, the initial training in the non-academy environment will be worth its weight in gold.

I went the academy route after completing my private certificate and flying a while on my own. I can honestly say that I was much more comfotable in the airplane than other students that began their training there. (I knew people that were scared to go on the long commercial solo cross country, no kidding! By that time you should feel very comfortable jumping in a plane and going somewhere.)

Use your time while working on your first cert to research your options, here is a gret place to start. Good luck!
 
As an a&m grad, you probably don't have what it takes to become a successful pilot. They always need folks to clean the lav, though.

Just F'n with ya.
 
Props Moxiepilot!!!!

DCA have a huge ego, and my personal opinion that DCA still in business only because delta are backing them up..... if they didnt so...they will belly up...on the other hand...they are charging 77000 and thats what they are telling you!!!

my opinion do your search more on flight schools and academy(141schools) in florida and try to go to the outfit and see it in your eyes .... coz their place isnt that good as their website lol ...
anyways igood luck hunting
 
moxiepilot said:
What you've heard in regard to "mastery" of an airplane being easier than another, I cannot agree with. There comes a point in your experience when an airplane is an airplane is an airplane. That's not going to occur when you are a student. The SR22 is no easier to master than a 152 or 172, only more expensive.
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Absolute truth.

In regards to the OP, I went 0 to commercial-multi at the DCA main location. I now instruct elsewhere. I, too, worked out a cube farm before becoming a pilot.

1. Firstly, DCA uses SR-20s, not -22s. The difference is huge. The -22 can be an unforgiving beast for a private pilot. The -20, while more docile, is, in my opinion, an altogether inferior training platform to a Piper, Cessna or Diamond. Doing primary training in glass cockpit aircraft is not necessarily a plus. While many of the newer regional jets have glass, the overwhelming majority of the commercial fleet stills does not. Transitioning from round gauges to glass is very easy, going the other way can be rough, and it's not something you want to be doing during first officer standardization.

2. Job Placement. DCA actually has pretty high washout rate, mostly due to people leaving for financial reasons, coupled with a relatively low retention rate, due to general discontent with their program. These people are not counted in their statistics. Regardless, an instructor hire rate below 99% is actually pretty poor--there's a fundamental disconnect with the program is someone trained by your program is incapable of meeting your standards after passing their checkride.

As to the regional interview thing, it's a non-starter. When regionals are hiring, they'll interview most anyone who meets their experience criteria. So a "guaranteed interview" is worthless. When regionals aren't hiring, a "guaranteed interview" won't magically make them decide to hire.

3. The cost. 77k is a nice quote. When I went through the program they were quoting around 60k. Most people I know went over that number, some into six figures. As a rule-of-thumb, add at least 20% to any quote for flight training, 30% if it's from an academy.

4. Taking on excessive debt to train, especially right now, is a sketchy proposition. Only a couple regionals are still hiring and, until the economy rebounds, that isn't likely to change. Minimums have gone back up, and competitive minimums can be even higher with all the furloughed pilots out there. As Moxie outlined, paying back 100k of loans on FO salary is very tough, and that's assuming the jobs are available when you finish the program. Paying back loans is no more fun on CFI wages.

5. While not really one of your questions, I'd consider a non-academy route for the following reason: dispatch. Academies schedule their planes back-to-back-to-back. This means you're always in a rush and, when it comes time for cross countries, you often don't even have time to get your $500 hamburger. Above all, flight training should be fun. As long as you're paying to fly, you shouldn't let an organization bleed the fun out of it. There will be plenty of time for quick-turn misery once you're at a regional, but at least you'll be getting paid for it.

My advice: finish your private at the local FBO. If you're still hooked, find somewhere local with 141 instrument and commercial programs (many FBOs have them, not just academies), pay-as-you-go and work at least part-time while you finish your ratings to keep your debt to a minimum. You'll be just as employable at the end (airlines don't care where you got your ratings), far less deep in debt and may well have had a lot more fun in the process.
 
I have to agree that it's better to begin and do most of your training at your local FBO.

I've done the FBO and the academy thing. The local FBO is usually better and much less expensive.
 
galvestonaggie said:
[*]How much of an advantage-if any- does training on the SR22 give you? I have heard it’s much easier to master than a 172 or PA-28.
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None. Chances are, the "zero to hero" method where you're student pilot one day and a full-fledged regional airline pilot in six months are, in my opinion, yesterday's news. Unless you're going to be instructing in an EFIS cockpit or flying around freight in a SR22, there's no advantage.

[*]They claim impressive statistics about job placement with the academy as an instructer-85% of all students who apply- and they also claim to guarantee you an interview you with one of the airlines in the Delta regional family, is this true?
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Ehh, highly debatable. Read the fine print on that one.

[*]Lastly I still have about 20k in debt left over from A&M, is life at a regional with 100k in student loan debt livable?
[/LIST]
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I'd suggest keeping costs low by looking for an FBO in your local area. You do NOT want to embark on a career in aviation with a large amount of debt. There are a couple of guys that I know that have gotten furloughed from a regional that have almost $100K in debt that still must be paid. That's one heavy financial monkey on your back when jobs (flying and non-flying) are scarce.
 
I really appreciate everyone's input; the voices your echoing seem to be part of a common thread which is to say that the academy route is not a good value, then again is anything in aviation? It's like that joke about "what's the fastest way to become a millionaire, become a billionaire and buy an airplane." There is no getting around some of the facts you guys have been laying out; thousands of pilots are out of jobs, minimums are going up and in general now is just not a good time to be living out childhood flying fantasies. That being said I think I'm going to stick around my local FBO, Just Fly at DWH in north Houston, and get my private debt free; then like you guys said I will see if I still have the bug-which I will- and then go from there. Also I think the comments made about going from the glass of the SR-20 to round gauges is a good one, nothing against the cirrus but it does kinda seem like learning to fly with a G1000 is a bit like learning how to use a keyboard before learning how to use a pencil. Lastly, I still feel that at some point-probably after private- I'm going to attend an academy because I just learn best in a structured environment so what I want to know is what is the lesser of the evils, DCA, Flight Safety ect...? Thanks again for everyone's input. ​
 
galvestonaggie said:
I really appreciate everyone's input; the voices your echoing seem to be part of a common thread which is to say that the academy route is not a good value, then again is anything in aviation? It's like that joke about "what's the fastest way to become a millionaire, become a billionaire and buy an airplane." There is no getting around some of the facts you guys have been laying out; thousands of pilots are out of jobs, minimums are going up and in general now is just not a good time to be living out childhood flying fantasies. That being said I think I'm going to stick around my local FBO, Just Fly at DWH in north Houston, and get my private debt free; then like you guys said I will see if I still have the bug-which I will- and then go from there. Also I think the comments made about going from the glass of the SR-20 to round gauges is a good one, nothing against the cirrus but it does kinda seem like learning to fly with a G1000 is a bit like learning how to use a keyboard before learning how to use a pencil. Lastly, I still feel that at some point-probably after private- I'm going to attend an academy because I just learn best in a structured environment so what I want to know is what is the lesser of the evils, DCA, Flight Safety ect...? Thanks again for everyone's input. ​
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Sounds like a good plan. Just to reiterate something from my earlier response, though: an "academy" is not the only place you'll find a structured 141 program. Many smaller FBOs are also 141 approved and are more than happy to put together a tightly structured program for you.

Secondly, academies may not have "structured" courses in the way you imagine. Basically, there's a classroom-style ground school and then they schedule you for flights. You may have to wear a uniform. At the end of the day, it's still mostly self-study, with the pitfall that your instructor may be scheduled in a way that it's hard to get extra one-on-one time with them if you want/need it.

On the other hand, many FBOs offer classroom-style ground schools periodically, and you get to schedule yourself for flights. No uniform required and typically better instructor availability.
 
to tell you the truth your searching for a approved part 141 flight school.
if you wanna compare apples to apples
DCA is a 141 flight school and its an accredited by ACCST and they have to report to the Department of education...so that means its regulated and u ll have quality training ....
in this category if you wanna compare .....there is only 3 flight schools in Florida that is accredited by the DOE ....DCA, Phoenix East Aviation and Ariben

from these 3 141 accredited flight school i would highly recommend PEA flight school. its been in business for along time and i hear they are very well strutured and ur getting what your paying for ..."Quality"
 
wis3384 said:
to tell you the truth your searching for a approved part 141 flight school.
if you wanna compare apples to apples
DCA is a 141 flight school and its an accredited by ACCST and they have to report to the Department of education...so that means its regulated and u ll have quality training ....
in this category if you wanna compare .....there is only 3 flight schools in Florida that is accredited by the DOE ....DCA, Phoenix East Aviation and Ariben

from these 3 141 accredited flight school i would highly recommend PEA flight school. its been in business for along time and i hear they are very well strutured and ur getting what your paying for ..."Quality"
Click to expand...

This forum gets more amusing every day. :bandit:
 
wis3384 said:
Props Moxiepilot!!!!

DCA have a huge ego, and my personal opinion that DCA still in business only because delta are backing them up..... if they didnt so...they will belly up...on the other hand...they are charging 77000 and thats what they are telling you!!!

my opinion do your search more on flight schools and academy(141schools) in florida and try to go to the outfit and see it in your eyes .... coz their place isnt that good as their website lol ...
anyways igood luck hunting
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who said anythingabout florida? he is talking about houston.

wis3384 said:
to tell you the truth your searching for a approved part 141 flight school.
if you wanna compare apples to apples
DCA is a 141 flight school and its an accredited by ACCST and they have to report to the Department of education...so that means its regulated and u ll have quality training ....
in this category if you wanna compare .....there is only 3 flight schools in Florida that is accredited by the DOE ....DCA, Phoenix East Aviation and Ariben

from these 3 141 accredited flight school i would highly recommend PEA flight school. its been in business for along time and i hear they are very well strutured and ur getting what your paying for ..."Quality"
Click to expand...

i just got done doing training at PEA. not real impressed. for all the planes they have, alot are broken and alot of times you are sitting waiting on a plane while the dip####s in dispatch are ########ting with each other and then give you a plane 5 min before you are supposed to be taking off. and alot of planes have multiple gripes which are "overlooked". not at all impressed with the way i spent my 4 grand there.


to the OP I am about to start at DCA Houston next week. If interested I'll PM you and give you my initial impressions. Main reason I chose them is 141 so I can use GI Bill and also I like training in the academy style as it "forces" me to study more. Plus the two FBO's I've trained at I have been well below pleased with.
 
welll Juan Valdez i think thats your part of your experience with PEA....but for me everyth went smooth...and did my PPL to CFI/ CFII ,,,and i never heard an airplane is "broken" its usually when it out to maintenance its either the 50 hour and 100 hour inspection...new fleet ...and on their website they annouced that there is 10 skycatchers coming end of 09 ....
10???? my personal opinion it might be something good going on still over there ...not like other flight school that shutting down in this time ....
and yeh good luck in DCA :D
 
wis3384 said:
welll Juan Valdez i think thats your part of your experience with PEA....but for me everyth went smooth...and did my PPL to CFI/ CFII ,,,and i never heard an airplane is "broken" its usually when it out to maintenance its either the 50 hour and 100 hour inspection...new fleet ...and on their website they annouced that there is 10 skycatchers coming end of 09 ....
10???? my personal opinion it might be something good going on still over there ...not like other flight school that shutting down in this time ....
and yeh good luck in DCA :D
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Three times I had to turn around without leaving the ramp area. And all three times I was charged. Not to even mention the times I got to my airplane and it had tires that had flat spots that were too severe or the one aircraft that has had the secondary battery (can't remember now if thats what it's called for the g1000) that has posted bad at least 4 times in the last month. MX either signs off as ok or "replaced battery". Obviously something is wrong with that a/c's electrical. Or all the times my instructor said we should not write somehting up bc dispatch would get mad.

Anywho, back on topic here, again I say the OP never mentioned FL so PEA is a moot point here. Good luck with your decision and please don't hang yourself by your tie. :D
 
85% job rate? Dude let me tell you something...anyone can get a job in aviation when they meet minimums. The problem is a lot of jobs really suck and provide leverage for the powers-at-be at decent qol companies to begin lowering the bar.

I spent 25k on all my ratings going the FBO route. I have no debt. Save the 100k for a mortgage. I'd work for the man for a year or two while you get your ratings and by then hopefully there will be some movement in the industry. You also won't have to wear a dorky outfit to fly.

Learn to fly in a cub. SR-22's are for rich old guys...I think Viagra is doing a package deal now for 5 hours free in a Cirrus with your first devastating ED episode. Check out Harvey-Rihn if you're on the south side of Houston.

Finally, HOOK EM!!!
 
Juan I really appreciate your input, please do let me know how things go at DCA Houston. I know it is a little different going to a place like DCA with VA bennies than it is for someone like myself who would have to borrow all of the money. That being said what I would really like to know is; would you still attend DCA if you did not have support from the VA?

More on DCA..... I got a call today from a really nice guy over there name Tom something, he seemed like a pretty straight forward guy and for once I didn't feel like I was buying a used car. Anyways, Tom acknoldged alot of the mistakes the school had made in the past and told me that it is now under new managment-now what that is supposed to I don't know. Suffice to say I get the felling that all of these big 141 academys run pretty much the same way; you take out a really really big loan give it to them and hope they will give you what there website says it will before you have to file chapter 11. Now don't get me wrong I know these places have turned out some good pilots and that there are quite a few sucess stories but I just don't know if the juice is worth the squeze. But who knows in 3 months I could be another unemployed statistic with a fat ass loan flying it up at DCA or FSA. Who knows? For now anyways I'm going to keep pluging away at my local FBO.

Thanks agan guys and Juan I will forgive you for that stament you made about Texas University.

Gigg' Em Aggies!!!
 
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