Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI route

challenger

challenger

New Member
Hello all,

I am currently a sophomore at the University of North Dakota and considering my options for ATC.

I never had the interest in ATC until I took, Intro to ATC which is a requirement for aviation students here. Something in that class opened up my eyes to the option of going for ATC, as it was really the only class in college I have enjoyed and learned much from to date.

So I have a couple questions, I know that MCTC has a CTI program that takes a year and costs less, would it be wise for me to do that and just get a normal degree as a backup plan? Or just stay here and do a double major? (the UND ATC degree leaves room for 25 credits aside from the normal core requirements)

I also am considering enlisting in the Air Guard in Duluth, is this something that would be compatible with having ATC as a career eventually?

I really have a lot on my mind here, just curious what anyone's input may be.
 
Re: Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI r

I'm not sure how much an ATC degree would be worth outside of aviation, but I still say go for the four-year degree. There are many rank and file jobs that, for some inexplicable reasons, require a four year degree. Get it. UND's a great place to do the degree, especially since you're already there. I don't know if the Air Guard does ATC, but I don't see how you could enlist in the military and attend college full time, unless you're in the reserves. I was in the off-the-street (OTS) ATC hiring process for a while, so I don't know much about the career beyond the AT-SAT (which all prospective controllers must take) and the LONG waiting process. I will tell you that CTI is the way to get into ATC, because OTS hiring is probably done.
 
Re: Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI r

twotwowoo said:
I'm not sure how much an ATC degree would be worth outside of aviation, but I still say go for the four-year degree. There are many rank and file jobs that, for some inexplicable reasons, require a four year degree. Get it. UND's a great place to do the degree, especially since you're already there. I don't know if the Air Guard does ATC, but I don't see how you could enlist in the military and attend college full time, unless you're in the reserves. I was in the off-the-street (OTS) ATC hiring process for a while, so I don't know much about the career beyond the AT-SAT (which all prospective controllers must take) and the LONG waiting process. I will tell you that CTI is the way to get into ATC, because OTS hiring is probably done.
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The Air Guard would be part time and not ATC more then likely, unless I decided to try and get a slot at one of the 10 (I think) ANG bases that happens to have ATC. Duluth does not have ATC.

I would be extremely happy if I could end up in Northern Minnesota after college if I was actually able to make a decent living there. I do not know how entirely plausible the goal of going back there is. It would be quite the amazing set up if I was a controller in Duluth and in the 148th Fighter Wing though in my opinion.

Having two retirement sources after 20 years and hopefully the option to try to secure a pilot slot would be absolutely awesome.

Who knows, maybe I am just off in lala land. . . lol
 
Re: Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI r

challenger said:
The Air Guard would be part time and not ATC more then likely, unless I decided to try and get a slot at one of the 10 (I think) ANG bases that happens to have ATC. Duluth does not have ATC.

I would be extremely happy if I could end up in Northern Minnesota after college if I was actually able to make a decent living there. I do not know how entirely plausible the goal of going back there is. It would be quite the amazing set up if I was a controller in Duluth and in the 148th Fighter Wing though in my opinion.

Having two retirement sources after 20 years and hopefully the option to try to secure a pilot slot would be absolutely awesome.

Who knows, maybe I am just off in lala land. . . lol
Click to expand...

It can be done. I'm looking to build my career in North Dakota. Hoping to transition into ag flying, but willing to anything to pay the bills. I'm glad to know I'm not the only one looking to live in a small town. I'd never want to live somewhere with more than 25,000 people.

As for ATC, it's certainly a possibility. As a CTI grad, as long as you don't medical out or flunk out of OKC you should be in.
 
Re: Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI r

OTS is certainly done for the time being. It wasn't ever the greatest option when it was around.

ATC degrees aren't worth anything outside of aviation. Also, they're not worth anything inside of aviation. Course, neither are many other degrees that people pursue. It's irrelevant to your ATC hiring prospects and success as a controller whether you major as ATC; everything you need to be able to apply CTI are addressed through the CTI requirements. If CTI = ATC Major at UND, I guess that decision's taken care of for you, but it's not necessarily the case everywhere.

If I were in your shoes, I'd just go for the CTI program at UND unless the financial issue was too much to bear. Reasons why:
1. It wouldn't be that big of a savings on time. You still have to finish up your degree at UND, and you'd add a year (at least) going elsewhere. Would it really add that much more onto your time at UND to just add the ATC classes? It's not a terribly challenging major.
2. Moving somewhere totally different and leaving your friends behind sucks. Both my wife and I transferred schools after our first year. You make new friends, of course, but we both wish that we could've stayed at the same place the entire time so we could've had that extra year or two with the same people we had gotten to know. Plus, moving can be expensive, and I'll bet that housing in Minneapolis is more expensive than it is in Grand Forks.
3. Kind of tied in to #2. After you finish your education, you're not going to go straight into ATC. You're looking at a wait of a year or longer. How people end up spending it will vary, of course, but I personally wouldn't really care to stick around wherever I did a fast-track CTI program, putting in hours at a temp job, when I could be either back with my college friends at UND or possibly back where I came from before college. Kind of a personal decision, but it'd be a factor for me.
4. Finally, is it really going to save you that much cash to go to MCTC? Take into account the above factors. It's probably a few thousand easier on the pocketbook, but at the same time, you're not going to have that year of your life back. It's another personal thing, but even if it cost me a little extra, I'd rather spend it among where I've made friends and settled in over the past four years instead of some random city I went to just because they had a fast-track CTI program. Some people are more inclined to move around, so who knows, maybe that's for you.

Anyway, just my two cents, spoken with the benefit of not having to deal with any of the consequences.

Oh, and when it comes to military, you need to specifically be doing air traffic control, for 52 weeks minimum, if you want to receive any real advantage. I'm pretty sure that the only paths that work for VRA are AF, Army and Navy... not National Guard. Someone'll jump in and correct me if I'm wrong. You'll still get veteran's preference, but that only applies towards bumping up your AT-SAT score. If you're going CTI, that really won't be much of a concern. Besides, there are enough resources available to study for the AT-SAT that anyone who's willing to put in a little bit of study effort shouldn't have any problem nailing an 85 or higher, pushing them into the WQ category.

If you want to serve because it's on your heart, by all means, go for it. In terms of it providing an advantage to making ATC a career, though, you have to put in for the long haul with one of the big boys.
 
Re: Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI r

Rosstafari said:
OTS is certainly done for the time being. It wasn't ever the greatest option when it was around.

ATC degrees aren't worth anything outside of aviation. Also, they're not worth anything inside of aviation. Course, neither are many other degrees that people pursue. It's irrelevant to your ATC hiring prospects and success as a controller whether you major as ATC; everything you need to be able to apply CTI are addressed through the CTI requirements. If CTI = ATC Major at UND, I guess that decision's taken care of for you, but it's not necessarily the case everywhere.

If I were in your shoes, I'd just go for the CTI program at UND unless the financial issue was too much to bear. Reasons why:
1. It wouldn't be that big of a savings on time. You still have to finish up your degree at UND, and you'd add a year (at least) going elsewhere. Would it really add that much more onto your time at UND to just add the ATC classes? It's not a terribly challenging major.
2. Moving somewhere totally different and leaving your friends behind sucks. Both my wife and I transferred schools after our first year. You make new friends, of course, but we both wish that we could've stayed at the same place the entire time so we could've had that extra year or two with the same people we had gotten to know. Plus, moving can be expensive, and I'll bet that housing in Minneapolis is more expensive than it is in Grand Forks.
3. Kind of tied in to #2. After you finish your education, you're not going to go straight into ATC. You're looking at a wait of a year or longer. How people end up spending it will vary, of course, but I personally wouldn't really care to stick around wherever I did a fast-track CTI program, putting in hours at a temp job, when I could be either back with my college friends at UND or possibly back where I came from before college. Kind of a personal decision, but it'd be a factor for me.
4. Finally, is it really going to save you that much cash to go to MCTC? Take into account the above factors. It's probably a few thousand easier on the pocketbook, but at the same time, you're not going to have that year of your life back. It's another personal thing, but even if it cost me a little extra, I'd rather spend it among where I've made friends and settled in over the past four years instead of some random city I went to just because they had a fast-track CTI program. Some people are more inclined to move around, so who knows, maybe that's for you.

Anyway, just my two cents, spoken with the benefit of not having to deal with any of the consequences.

Oh, and when it comes to military, you need to specifically be doing air traffic control, for 52 weeks minimum, if you want to receive any real advantage. I'm pretty sure that the only paths that work for VRA are AF, Army and Navy... not National Guard. Someone'll jump in and correct me if I'm wrong. You'll still get veteran's preference, but that only applies towards bumping up your AT-SAT score. If you're going CTI, that really won't be much of a concern. Besides, there are enough resources available to study for the AT-SAT that anyone who's willing to put in a little bit of study effort shouldn't have any problem nailing an 85 or higher, pushing them into the WQ category.

If you want to serve because it's on your heart, by all means, go for it. In terms of it providing an advantage to making ATC a career, though, you have to put in for the long haul with one of the big boys.
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As for ANG with ATC, I did not mean will it give me an advantage. I just wanted to know if it will fit with ATC as a career to be doing both. I am sure, it would not be a problem though.

My absolute ideal situation I would like to see 10 years from now is to be a Guard pilot and a Controller, I do not know if that would be plausable or not.

Money is not going to be as big of an issue as soon as I get my PPL (taking aviation 102 currently), as I have MN reciprocity and should be able to qualify as a ND resident as soon as I turn the papers in.

As far as friends go, I have basically walked away from most of my "friends" here because they were not good friends, so I am essentially starting over as far as that goes. So that is not a consideration at this point. You meet a lot of toolbags in the certain area of the social scale I was involved with here. . . . I am sure there are some good people up here, I just have not met them yet, which is making it easy for me to say I would like to leave. I am trying to figure out how to meet some more people here though.

Does anyone know with CTI, am I immediately eligible as soon as I complete the ATC classes or do I have to have a degree to move forward in the CTI process?
 
Re: Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI r

Just noticed I miscategorized this post, my bad :bandit:
 
Re: Currently a sophmore and considering how to do the CTI r

challenger said:
As for ANG with ATC, I did not mean will it give me an advantage. I just wanted to know if it will fit with ATC as a career to be doing both. I am sure, it would not be a problem though.

My absolute ideal situation I would like to see 10 years from now is to be a Guard pilot and a Controller, I do not know if that would be plausable or not.
Click to expand...

Ehhh... I don't know about that. I know a few guys who do Guard and control, but being a pilot? I think that requires more of a commitment than you'll be able to give. Remember that during your first year in your facility, the FAA owns you, and they can and will let you go for just about anything.

Maybe consider Civil Air Patrol?

Also, while I try to not direct conversations elsewhere, there are a few people at StuckMic in this situation. You may want to check in over there.

As far as friends go, I have basically walked away from most of my "friends" here because they were not good friends, so I am essentially starting over as far as that goes. So that is not a consideration at this point. You meet a lot of toolbags in the certain area of the social scale I was involved with here. . . . I am sure there are some good people up here, I just have not met them yet, which is making it easy for me to say I would like to leave. I am trying to figure out how to meet some more people here though.
Click to expand...

Yow. Well, I guess if you're not feeling tied to any people or relationships, that certainly gives you a lot more flexibility. Certainly would make a difference in the decision.

Does anyone know with CTI, am I immediately eligible as soon as I complete the ATC classes or do I have to have a degree to move forward in the CTI process?
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You need to have the CTI code that comes with completing the program. That's something that varies by college, depending on what their CTI requirements are. You'll need to ask the coordinator at UND if you receive it upon the successful completion of the curriculum or what.
 
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