Contract pilot vs Full time employee

Jimmy_Norton

Jimmy_Norton

Well-Known Member
How can someone justify a full time third pilot in a one airplane, two pilot operation, vs using contract guys for times when you need extra help? This is in a ~600 hour a year department with much international flying in a large cabin aircraft.
 
He's saying someone (the 3rd person) is needed to cover for the 1st and 2nd persons sick time and holidays.
 
highspeed said:
He's saying someone (the 3rd person) is needed to cover for the 1st and 2nd persons sick time and holidays.
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No kidding, that can be covered by contract pilots. My question is when should someone hire a third pilot instead of using contract to cover sick days, vacation, etc? Financially it makes sense to NOT hire someone full time, but you don't have the guaranteed availability of having someone on staff full time.
 
We are going to a three pilot rotation. It may not make financial sense, but little about operating a large cabin aircraft does. Contract pilots are getting harder to come by and those that are readily available normally are contract pilots because no one wants to employ them (this is not always true, especially in larger aircraft).

Alex.
 
I would say it gets justified the first time Big Boss shows up late for a meeting 1500 miles from home (and subsequently looses the "big" sale) while the $10,000,000 chariot is looking great in the hanger at home. Any corporation trying save $120K/ year (the savings are much less than that when you add in the cost of the contract pilots) operating a large jet internationally by not hiring a third pilot may not be the greatest place to work. Just saying......
 
CK said:
We are going to a three pilot rotation. It may not make financial sense, but little about operating a large cabin aircraft does. Contract pilots are getting harder to come by and those that are readily available normally are contract pilots because no one wants to employ them (this is not always true, especially in larger aircraft).

Alex.
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What do you mean by the ones who are available are the ones no one wants to employ
 
Inverted25 said:
What do you mean by the ones who are available are the ones no one wants to employ
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Yeah, I don't get that at all. Most of the contract guys are there because their situation changed (read: owners dumped jet for fractional/ charter/ $$ reasons).
 
I think what CK was trying to say was that if there are guys out there with lots of spare time, there are sometimes reasons for that....not always the case, but I've seen it myself.

I think the price of having a third full time guy will seem really low the first time a contract guy isn't available or cancels at the last minute and the airplane can't move. But sometimes a "what if" won't get the owner to crack open the check book.
 
Jimmy_Norton said:
I think what CK was trying to say was that if there are guys out there with lots of spare time, there are sometimes reasons for that....not always the case, but I've seen it myself.

I think the price of having a third full time guy will seem really low the first time a contract guy isn't available or cancels at the last minute and the airplane can't move. But sometimes a "what if" won't get the owner to crack open the check book.
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are we talking about guys with bad pasts or what? I don't see how they could get a type and enough time in type to be a contract pilot yet not be employable
 
Jimmy_Norton said:
But sometimes a "what if" won't get the owner to crack open the check book.
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Yeah, dealing with this right now. My new company so far doesnt have any intention of putting me on full time. The captain has been here a year and he's not even full time. I'm not really going to complain. Most of their trips are at least 2-3 days, sometimes over a week, and i have no problem taking 5 daily rates.

In their case, for as much as they fly, they would be saving money. I think right now they just dont care. Maybe their tune will change once the airplane is parked because both their pilots are taking other trips.
 
Jimmy_Norton said:
How can someone justify a full time third pilot in a one airplane, two pilot operation, vs using contract guys for times when you need extra help? This is in a ~600 hour a year department with much international flying in a large cabin aircraft.
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By showing that it is more economical/cost efficient to employ a third full time pilot than to pay a contract pilot. I think this is where you will run into a trouble. The attraction of a contract pilot is that the company can write a check for $1000 (or whatever) per day to the contractor, and they're out free and clear. They don't have to worry about health insurance, or workman's comp, or retirement benefits, or a myriad of other things. Just write the check, and leave all those problems for the contractor to sort out.

Also, keep in mind that a full-time pilot on staff costs a lot more than just his paycheck. In addition to the things I have already mentioned, there are training costs, payroll taxes, background checks, etc. I would guess that the salaried 120k a year pilot probably costs about twice that. You'd have to write an awful lot of $1000 checks to make hiring someone worthwhile.
 
NBAA Management guide has a "scientific" formula for department staffing. Quick google search should turn up the guide.
 
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