Civilian CFI interested in Military Pilot Career

K

kh15

New Member
Hey people,

I currently have about 1500TT and little over 1000 as a flight instructor. I'm 21 years old and a sophomore in college. Recently I have become interested in enlisting in the military (after college of course) and more specifically, looking to fly in either the Navy or Air Force. Here are some of my questions:

1. Will my current flight experience help me at all in military pilot training?
2. How do I get started if I really want to pursue this?
3. What are the differences in flying for the Air Force vs. Navy?
4. My major is History, will that be an acceptable major for a person pursuing a flying career in the military?
6. What are the benefits of a flying career in the military?

Personally I feel the best trained pilots come out of the military and that is the kind of environment I want to be in. I guess I'm looking for a more challenging and rewarding career. I used to be one of the young regional airline "chasers" but over time my mindset has definately changed. I would love to serve my country and fly in the military. Any help is greatly appreciated! Thanks!

KH:cool:
 
kh15 said:
Hey people,

I currently have about 1500TT and little over 1000 as a flight instructor. I'm 21 years old and a sophomore in college. Recently I have become interested in enlisting in the military (after college of course) and more specifically, looking to fly in either the Navy or Air Force. Here are some of my questions:
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First, though I think you are using the term in a non-literal way, there are no enlisted pilots in the USN or USAF. You must earn a commission through some sort of a commissioning program, be it ROTC, OCS/OTS, or one of the service academies. Now that we have that clarified....

kh15 said:
1. Will my current flight experience help me at all in military pilot training?
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It can help in some ways like having a basic flying sense, instruments, maybe picking things up a little quicker early on, but that all being said, by the time you get through primary training and move onto advanced, most everyone is on a pretty level playing field. There are rockstars, but they aren't always the guys who have previous flying experience. Best advice I can give is that it will help you if you have the right attitude about learning, and not just assuming that you know what you are doing.

kh15 said:
2. How do I get started if I really want to pursue this?
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Talk to a local officer recruiter, or contact the ROTC unit of your choice at your school. ROTC may not be an option for you depending on how many credits you have (IIRC when I was in NROTC, the cut off was generally after you finish your sophomore year for example).

kh15 said:
3. What are the differences in flying for the Air Force vs. Navy?
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I'll let someone more experienced with both services answer this question, but from what I saw in flight school, there is a difference in the mindset of USN training compared to our AF counterparts. There are some obvious operational differences, like Navy guys going to the boat for deployments where AF folks don't.

kh15 said:
4. My major is History, will that be an acceptable major for a person pursuing a flying career in the military?
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Absolutely. There are no degree requirements for flying other than those required for getting your commission (4 yr degree from an accredited institution specifically). I know military aviators who came from all walks of life in college......drama majors, history majors, engineering majors, art majors, etc. There is a misconception that all military pilots have engineering degrees, but you will find that this is absolutely not true. Of the guys in my squadron, I'm probably in the minority of folks with engineering degrees.

kh15 said:
6. What are the benefits of a flying career in the military?
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Awesome flying that you wouldn't get to do anywhere else, good pay (compared to other entry level flying jobs), some degree of job security provided you make it through the program, opportunities to live and fly places that you never would have otherwise. Also, hopefully supporting a cause that you are passionate about.

kh15 said:
Personally I feel the best trained pilots come out of the military and that is the kind of environment I want to be in. I guess I'm looking for a more challenging and rewarding career. I used to be one of the young regional airline "chasers" but over time my mindset has definately changed. I would love to serve my country and fly in the military. Any help is greatly appreciated! Thanks!
Click to expand...

Sounds like this could be the job for you. I too started out in civilian aviation, and quickly realized that it wasn't the place I wanted to be career-wise. Not a knock on civilian pilots, just that there were things I wanted to do that a civilian career wouldn't allow. It is and always will be a significant challenge throughout your career. Remember that flying is also just part of your job as a military officer, so some of your greatest challenges and rewards might very well be out of the cockpit as well.
 
Superfly7XAF said:
I think AMG pretty much said it all. Just wanted to reiterate that you must be an officer to be a pilot in either the Air Force or Navy so you need a commission first.
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Huh? If I'm not mistaken, the USN has Warrant Officer aviators now in Rotary Wing and Patrol aircraft.
 
MikeD said:
Huh? If I'm not mistaken, the USN has Warrant Officer aviators now in Rotary Wing and Patrol aircraft.
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Does it require an Associates Degree or just a HS diploma? I don't hear much about Naval WOs but that is another option the OP could pursue. Mainly trying to emphasize that if he wants to fly then I wouldn't recommend enlisting as he stated here:

kh15 said:
Recently I have become interested in enlisting in the military (after college of course) and more specifically, looking to fly in either the Navy or Air Force.
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. . . and just go straight for a commission, but to each his own.
 
MikeD said:
Huh? If I'm not mistaken, the USN has Warrant Officer aviators now in Rotary Wing and Patrol aircraft.
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Affirm. Knew a few of the early ones in API/primary. Associates degree "or higher" is required. I'm not an expert on the process, but I do know that they are only pulling the cream of the crop of our NCO's for the program, so I'm *guessing* that most of the competitive ones may have some sort of formal college degree as well (many of our sailors in do). Must be E5-E7, so probably not a reasonable option for the OP given the age req's for pilot.
 
I was going to put in my 2 cents, but basically //AMG covered everything pretty much perfectly. I just finished up a tour teaching at Air Force UPT about 8 months ago, so if there are any gaps you need filled from that angle let me know.

As for the CFI experience, I've seen it help, I've seen it have a negligible effect, and I've seen it hurt. Use the experience you already have, but recognize that what you are going to learn will be different, and in some aspects, VERY different. The rules are different, the planes are different, the mentality is different. Everyone there will be studying their keisters off, so if you sit back and rely on previous experience you can go from top of the class to bottom of the class or washing out very quickly. If you study just as hard as the rest of the class does, though, you should do just fine.

Oh, last thing since no one has mentioned it yet. You may want to consider the Reserves or the Guard. They have their own version of OTS/OCS called... AMG, I think it is. I'm hardly the expert since I've been active duty my whole career. Anyhow, the point is that they have a commissioning program as well, and it seems like sometimes when the doors are closed on the active duty side, guys are able to work pretty decent deals through the Reserves or the Guard. Just another option for your research.

Good luck.
 
As a Navy primary flight instructor not too long ago. From my experience, students either had the it factor or didn't. If you had "it", then flight time and experience would only help. If you didn't have "it", then no amount of flight time would help. Some guys/gals have "it" with no flight time and do exceptionally well. The five best studs I flew with, none had prior flight time. The highest flight time stud I flew with had around 500 hours and was not good. The absolute best were former NFO's who transitioned to pilots. Either way, have it and you'll do just fine.

///AMG said:
Affirm. Knew a few of the early ones in API/primary. Associates degree "or higher" is required. I'm not an expert on the process, but I do know that they are only pulling the cream of the crop of our NCO's for the program, so I'm *guessing* that most of the competitive ones may have some sort of formal college degree as well (many of our sailors in do). Must be E5-E7, so probably not a reasonable option for the OP given the age req's for pilot.
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Yep, the program is for inhouse Navy folks and not applicable to folks off the street.
 
Thanks for all the imput guys. And as far as "enlisting," I actually meant "commissioned"....just to clear that up. Few more quesitons for you guys. Once I finish my degree, if I want to fly in the military, is this something I can determine before I enter? For example, can I say hey I want to fly in the military? From my understanding you should make it clear what your goals are when trying to get in? I'm just a little curious about the whole entering process, no one in my fam is in the military, or even a pilot for that matter. Thanks for the info thus far!
 
Air National Guard/ Air Force Reserves. Its a part time gig, but some units hire full time. National Guard OTS (ANGOTS) is 6 weeks, or OTS 10 weeks for reserve and then UPT, then traning in the a/c that you were hired into. (about 2-3 years total) Benefits are you know what ac and where you will live before signing the dotted line. Your flight time may help to interview for a AD position when sitting on the board, or interview for UPT Pilot board. But personalty, commitment to the unit would be more important at a Guard unit interview (from what I have seen) then flight time.

http://www.guardreservejobs.com/ has a bunch of units that are advertising hiring.
 
kh15 said:
Thanks for all the imput guys. And as far as "enlisting," I actually meant "commissioned"....just to clear that up. Few more quesitons for you guys. Once I finish my degree, if I want to fly in the military, is this something I can determine before I enter? For example, can I say hey I want to fly in the military? From my understanding you should make it clear what your goals are when trying to get in? I'm just a little curious about the whole entering process, no one in my fam is in the military, or even a pilot for that matter. Thanks for the info thus far!
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It kind of depends on the route you choose. Again, I will limit this to USN because that is what I have experience with; I'm sure there are some AF guys here that can talk to their service. If you do NROTC, then you compete for a pilot slot during service selection that takes place at the beginning of your senior year. If you get picked up for SNA (Student Naval Aviator) then, you will head to Pensacola following commissioning to start flight school. The downside to this, is that you are financially obligated to the service by this point, and generally expected to commission regardless of where the Navy decides to send you. Guys that apply to OCS/BDCP do in fact get selected for pilot long before they ever attend OCS, so they know where they are going before they are obligated for service. If I'm not mistaken, the Marines still have the PLC-Air program, where you can get a similar pilot guarantee prior to attending USMC OCS. Of course in either of those last cases, you still have to make it through OCS and get your commission before you actually get to head to flight school. Hope that answers your question!
 
Low_Level_Hell said:
True. W01's are not recognized as commisioned officers much less people.
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Now get back in your cage! J/K.

kh15 said:
Thanks for all the imput guys. And as far as "enlisting," I actually meant "commissioned"....just to clear that up. Few more quesitons for you guys. Once I finish my degree, if I want to fly in the military, is this something I can determine before I enter? For example, can I say hey I want to fly in the military? From my understanding you should make it clear what your goals are when trying to get in? I'm just a little curious about the whole entering process, no one in my fam is in the military, or even a pilot for that matter. Thanks for the info thus far!
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As for active duty USAF, I'm pretty sure the answer is "no, you can't determine that you will be flying before you enter" (for the MOST part). There are three basic routes to a commission active duty: the Academy, ROTC, and OTS. I know for a fact that there is definitely no guarantee what job you will get if you go either Academy or ROTC. As for OTS, that is a whole other kettle of fish, and I don't really know very much about it. I think that some guys who come from the enlisted side and go through OTS know what job they will be getting out of it before they enter, but I don't know for sure if that is true or not.

Of course, there are also "one-sy two-sy" deals that some people are able to work in special circumstances with the Air Force Personnel Center. For example, I am here in the sandbox with a guy who had retired from the Air Force as a KC-135 pilot, and then had some hard times with his follow-on job in the civilian world. So he basically came back into the service at his old rank, turned off his retirement, and is now earning active duty pay again. He has some kind of guarantee that he will not PCS or promote, and he has a re-retirement date already set a couple of years into the future. Stuff like that happens all the time, but I would not exactly consider that a "route" or a "career path." If only one guy has done it, that's more like a "career side trip through the weeds and forest," than an actual "path."
 
fish314 said:
As for OTS, that is a whole other kettle of fish, and I don't really know very much about it. I think that some guys who come from the enlisted side and go through OTS know what job they will be getting out of it before they enter, but I don't know for sure if that is true or not.
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For OTS, you're offered a job prior to signing anything, and can accept or decline. I was offered an OTS slot for pilot, and took it. It's the last place where you can know what you're getting prior to any committment. ROTC was the same back in my day, but they changed that in about 1993 or so.

[/QUOTE]
 
kh15 said:
Hey people,
1. Will my current flight experience help me at all in military pilot training?

Yes and no. In phase two you will probably fly a little better and have better SA for emergency procedures, but as a guy that went in with ~400 dual given the field was pretty much equal after the instrument phase of training.

2. How do I get started if I really want to pursue this?

Read other posts.

3. What are the differences in flying for the Air Force vs. Navy?

Boats full of dudes, or nice golf courses?

4. My major is History, will that be an acceptable major for a person pursuing a flying career in the military?

I majored in philosophy.

6. What are the benefits of a flying career in the military?

I'm still in UPT so I can't speak to the operational world, but into T-38s I will tell you that it is way more exciting, but training is a hundred times more intense and focussed.
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kaudbron said:
Air National Guard/ Air Force Reserves. Its a part time gig, but some units hire full time. National Guard OTS (ANGOTS) is 6 weeks, or OTS 10 weeks for reserve and then UPT, then traning in the a/c that you were hired into. (about 2-3 years total) Benefits are you know what ac and where you will live before signing the dotted line. Your flight time may help to interview for a AD position when sitting on the board, or interview for UPT Pilot board. But personalty, commitment to the unit would be more important at a Guard unit interview (from what I have seen) then flight time.

http://www.guardreservejobs.com/ has a bunch of units that are advertising hiring.

See baseops.net for more info on units hiring. Feel free to PM me any specific questions because I went the AFRC route.
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I can't say much that hasn't been said before. But I am in the process right now and it certainly isn't an overnight deal. It takes some patience
 
crazyjaydawg said:
It takes some patience
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Haha, some patience indeed. Started working towards a slot when I left college in 2007 and finally leaving this fall 3 years later; and I only applied once.

Definitely worth it, though if you can't wait that long, I'd suggest applying with the Navy rather than the Air Force. I know of a couple of people who applied to OTS boards after mine, got shot down by the Air Force, then put together an app with the Navy, got picked up, and are already at OCS. Seems like the wait time for Navy selects is about 6 months max whereas with the Air Force it's about 1.5-2 years (getting shorter though).
 
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