Cirrus(?) Down in Boulder, CO (Parachute Video, Fire)

Rudabega said:
I just talked to the pawnee pilot the other day, I didn't really know him at all. Not friends by any means but it is crazy for something like this to hit so close to home.

Is there any kind of auto deployment for those chutes? I don't want to think about those people pulling the chute just to go up in flames.

Time to call some friends and make sure it wasn't them....
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I do not believe that there is. It is my understanding that you have to pull, and PULL HARD !!!!
 
JEP said:
I do not believe that there is. It is my understanding that you have to pull, and PULL HARD !!!!
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That's my understanding also. I did the Cirrus checkout course and I was never informed of any auto-deploy. From what I've picked up, the handle has two stages-- a lighter pull to release the handle and it will hang down a few inches, and then pull again with all you've got and hang on tight.
 
TXaviator said:
for the love of all things holy can someone explain to me how you couldnt see not one, but TWO aircraft directly in front of you?
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Gliders are fairly difficult to see, you usually only catch a reflection off the sun off of a wing.

The rope is generally about 200'. It will hang from the towplane at about a 45 degree angle.

When the glider releases, it will make an immediate 90 degree right turn. The glider pilot checks for traffic on the right. The towplane makes an immediate 90 degree left turn. Traffic avoidance is the responsibility of the towplane with a glider in tow. It is entirely possible that the tow pilot would not have 3 o'clock traffic in sight, since that turn generally starts immediately, there isn't much time to scan for traffic before that turn. This is one of the many reasons a tow pilot needs his head on a swivel at all times.

Very sad, I just started flying a Pawnee myself last year. There is an FAA glider safety seminar in 2 weeks, better procedures for clearing traffic on the left side is something I'll be sure to ask about.
 
Mateo303 said:
To be fair, a low profile white glider can be tough to see on a gray day like we had today, but you should have no problems seeing a pawnee.
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If it was just after a glider release, the Pawnee would be making a steep, descending left turn. It is unlikely the Pawnee would have thoroughly looked for traffic before the turn, since the glider pilot is the one who initiates the release, and he's looking for traffic on the right.
 
drunkenbeagle said:
If it was just after a glider release, the Pawnee would be making a steep, descending left turn. It is unlikely the Pawnee would have thoroughly looked for traffic before the turn, since the glider pilot is the one who initiates the release, and he's looking for traffic on the right.
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That makes a lot of sense. I had not thought of this as being a result of the glider coming off tow and the pawnee essentially turning and diving into the Cirrus. I can see how the Cirrus very well may have had the traffic in sight above and thought it was no issue. Interesting...
 
RIP to all.

Very sad. I went to CU for college and I use to skydive at Boulder Airport. That video is eff'd up.
 
Mateo303 said:
I can see how the Cirrus very well may have had the traffic in sight above and thought it was no issue. Interesting...
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The Cirrus could have been passing 100' below the Pawnee, and caught the rope in his prop.

"Head always on a swivel" is something you'll hear tow pilots say a lot.

Really hits home, as I just started doing this myself. The soaring community is a very small one.
 
Mateo,

I agree with you and will add that most people who fly in that area are aware of the glider operations and where they operate. Sounds like they were between the airport and maybe lazy acres or glendale.

I have never towed a glider but how abrupt of a turn and a dive do you execute when the glider cut's away? 30 degree bank and 500ft a min?


Mateo303 said:
That makes a lot of sense. I had not thought of this as being a result of the glider coming off tow and the pawnee essentially turning and diving into the Cirrus. I can see how the Cirrus very well may have had the traffic in sight above and thought it was no issue. Interesting...
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CBpilot said:
I have never towed a glider but how abrupt of a turn and a dive do you execute when the glider cut's away? 30 degree bank and 500ft a min?
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45-60 degree 1000 fpm is more like it. You are at full throttle, and only slowly take it out for shock cooling. (oh no! what have I just started here...) In a Pawnee you will be close to Vne, then slow to about 80 on base, 70 on final.
 
Someone help out the sheriff spokesman.....

Rick Brough of the Boulder County Sheriff's Department did not release any information regarding the victims, and it was not immediately clear how many people were on board the planes when they collided.
.....

Brough said a parachute did deploy from one of the planes, but that no one was attached to it.
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drunkenbeagle said:
45-60 degree 1000 fpm is more like it. You are at full throttle, and only slowly take it out for shock cooling. (oh no! what have I just started here...) In a Pawnee you will be close to Vne, then slow to about 80 on base, 70 on final.
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That is pretty rapid. Your theory would make sense then. They probably pulled the "oh " chute when they realized a collision was going to happen. Such a tragedy.

Midair's scare the daylights out of me.
 
When I read this my heart just sank.

Im working on my PPL- Glider out of Boulder. Started last week. I was up flying all day yesterday and chatting with the tow pilot. Just saw the news on JC. I talked to my CFI about 5 minutes ago and he told me that it was the commercial operator and not our club. While I always knew this was part of aviation, I never thought a crash would hit so close to home. I've been getting calls from friends the past half hour wondering if i'm still alive or not. It's a very sobering feeling. RIP to all involved and I will keep everyone here in the know when I find out more.

Reed
 
Rudabega said:
Is there any kind of auto deployment for those chutes? I don't want to think about those people pulling the chute just to go up in flames.
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AviatorGator said:
There is no auto-deployment. It's supposed to be a smooth, downward pull. They say to do a "chin-up" with the handle.
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CBpilot said:
That is pretty rapid. Your theory would make sense then. They probably pulled the "oh " chute when they realized a collision was going to happen. Such a tragedy.
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There is no auto-deploy, and it is a forward and down action to pull the chute. I doubt they pulled the chute until after the collision, but we will have to wait to see what the investigation release.
 
rvg203 said:
When I read this my heart just sank.

Im working on my PPL- Glider out of Boulder. Started last week. I was up flying all day yesterday and chatting with the tow pilot. Just saw the news on JC. I talked to my CFI about 5 minutes ago and he told me that it was the commercial operator and not our club. While I always knew this was part of aviation, I never thought a crash would hit so close to home. I've been getting calls from friends the past half hour wondering if i'm still alive or not. It's a very sobering feeling. RIP to all involved and I will keep everyone here in the know when I find out more.

Reed
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Sad news for sure.

Reed, sounds like you are flying with SSB. If so, I'm a fellow member. Not many of us on this site (actually no one else that I know of). I'll look for you out at the field.

Matt
 
ComplexHiAv8r said:
There is no auto-deploy, and it is a forward and down action to pull the chute. I doubt they pulled the chute until after the collision, but we will have to wait to see what the investigation release.
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Also a lot of times the chute also deploys after impact during accidents.
 
Do tow planes usually have/use Mode A/C? TIS/TCAS (CIrrus) would be useless.

If part of the wing was missing (think barrage balloon cable = tow cable), before the fire got going, I could see the pilot pulling the chute. No control after that, though. That just sucks.
 
Word is the Cirrus hit the Pawnee at a 90 degree angle right behind the engine where the fuel tank is. The glider on tow flew through the fireball and then released the tow cable and climbed out to the right. The Cirrus was cruising from North to South and the Towplane was cruising due West. Supposedly, the passenger in the glider was taking video and has the accident on camera.

Matt, I hope to see you out at the field soon. Good to know there is another SSB member on here!

Reed
 
rvg203 said:
Word is the Cirrus hit the Pawnee at a 90 degree angle right behind the engine where the fuel tank is. The glider on tow flew through the fireball and then released the tow cable and climbed out to the right. The Cirrus was cruising from North to South and the Towplane was cruising due West. Supposedly, the passenger in the glider was taking video and has the accident on camera.

Matt, I hope to see you out at the field soon. Good to know there is another SSB member on here!

Reed
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Wow, so much for our theory that this happened with the tow plane diving into the cirrus while coming off tow. I still can not get it through my head how the cirrus did not see these guys and just slammed into them.

Reed, see ya around. SSB is a great club and flying gliders will make you a better pilot no matter what your experience level!
 
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