Anybody know what the deal is now that ExpressJet decided to keep the airplanes? CHQ won the contract from Continental to fly those birds....but now there are no birds! I assum Continental still needs that capacity.....does the flying go back out for bid? Does CHQ try to cover the flying with their birds? Is everybody backin the game?
CHQ and Continental Flying
- Thread starter cime_sp
- Start date
Cav
Former Maddog Whisperer
cime_sp said:
Perhaps CAL needs the capacity but plans on filling some of it with the 737's they are receiving over the next few years. It seems to me this was a good way to shed some 50 seaters. You will probably see another carrier flying jets as CAL Exp. but I doubt they will replace 69 jets worth of feed, I doubt they desire to have it all replaced. Not to mention CAL's mgmt. asked their union to discuss pay rates for "small jet flying" last week. I saw the email sent to their pilots and it was vague however it sounded as though they wanted to keep it in house so to speak perhaps like USAir is doing with the E190 flying. The CAL pilots have no reason to give up their scope since the pensions were already frozen in the last concessionary contract and surely they've wittnessed what loss of scope has done to their competitor's pilot groups. Mgmt. probably feels they have a better chance of getting favorable rates for 70-90 seaters from their pilots than they do scope relief. Let's all hope so anyway. It would be good for all of us if this happened. Just pure speculation on my part.
Baronman
Well-Known Member
cime_sp said:
Oh please...I hope this doesn't turn into a "My training department tells me that we're going to be flying etc...." Although I did think it was hilarious when all the TSA/ASA/SKYW/MESA people heard it was CHQ. Such dissapointment.
I think CAL is going to reduce the 50 seat capacity. Maybe CHQ will use some of their ERJs. If not maybe one of the above menitioned.
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
My opinion: 50 seaters didn't make sense when gas was $1.00/gal. 70 seaters don't make sense when gas is $2.00/gal.
CAL knows this, and will reduce their 50 seat flying and replace it with mainline 737's, and just reduce the freq. of flights available. This will allow them to charge more $$ (more demand for less product).
As for XJET keeping all of the CAL flying, personally I think that ship has sailed.
CAL knows this, and will reduce their 50 seat flying and replace it with mainline 737's, and just reduce the freq. of flights available. This will allow them to charge more $$ (more demand for less product).
As for XJET keeping all of the CAL flying, personally I think that ship has sailed.
pscraig
Well-Known Member
I agree that CAL is likely to take back some of the major city flying from us with the new 737s, and some of those routes are really hurting for more capacity. Mexico is the mystery-it's a source of huge growth and revenue, but we need the LR and XR aircraft to do most of the Mexico flying, and those are the planes CAL wanted back (and we are keeping). How CAL is going to deal with that will be interesting to watch.
CAL tends to use a smaller airframe for a given market than other airlines, (73 to Vegas/LA, 75 to Europe, 76 to Asia/S America, etc) so even with the new 737s they will need at least as much regional feed as they do now.
There's not much coming down the pipe from the company, and as you might expect we hear a new rumor daily. I'm still hoping we keep most of the CAL flying, but if not, I'd personally like to do more Mexico since that seems to be a hot market. And I would hope the mainline guys don't shaft all of us (including themselves) and go for the Embraer 170/190.
And no, the flying won't be re-bid. CHQ won the bid, but how they get airplanes to fly seems to be the $69 question.
CAL tends to use a smaller airframe for a given market than other airlines, (73 to Vegas/LA, 75 to Europe, 76 to Asia/S America, etc) so even with the new 737s they will need at least as much regional feed as they do now.
There's not much coming down the pipe from the company, and as you might expect we hear a new rumor daily. I'm still hoping we keep most of the CAL flying, but if not, I'd personally like to do more Mexico since that seems to be a hot market. And I would hope the mainline guys don't shaft all of us (including themselves) and go for the Embraer 170/190.
And no, the flying won't be re-bid. CHQ won the bid, but how they get airplanes to fly seems to be the $69 question.
Cav
Former Maddog Whisperer
pscraig said:
How do you figure we might "keep most of the CAL flying?" I have seen little to indicate that we will be keeping ANY of the flying that CAL bid out. Perhaps I miss understood you. However I would not be surprised to see CAL rebid the flying since I really don't see CHQ coming up with aircraft. I could see them rebidding it to CRJ operators since those aircraft seem to be available and thus cheaper.
Lastly, I guessing you meant that you would hope that the CAL guys don't let go of scope regarding larger aircraft. If so I agree with you however everything I've heard points to CAL pilots flying any 70/90 seaters on their list under their contract which would be a good thing. I'm guessing that's what you were already saying.
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
Cav said:
I'm not sure what's going on with Chautauqua and their Florida flying, but Freedom seems to be taking over some of their routes. In fact, they are closing FLL I believe.
I wouldn't count Chautauqua out of this entirely, they have a good management team who seems to know how to make a buck in this industry.
***note I do not work for Republic Holdings or any subsidiary***
Cav
Former Maddog Whisperer
wheelsup said:
I've heard the FL rumors as well. According to a friend at CHQ that would provide approximately 30 airframes that could be used at CAL which makes sense to me since I really don't think CAL needs nor wants to replace all 69. They can put some of the new 737's they are getting on some of the longer E145XR routes we currently do which will free up those XR's to cover the Mexico flying.
I view this as a good thing personally. XJT finds new flying or combination of new flying (which we probably will depsite the naysayers). CAL pilots keep 70/90 seater flying in house, and CAL puts 737s on routes that should have been 737 routes to begin with. IF (a big if!) that's the case. what's not to like?
Just out of curiosity wheelsup, who do you fly for?
. I have no dog in this fight...but hopefully ExpressJet can place those other aircraft no problem, and already has a plan for them vs. a knee jerk reaction.
Cav
Former Maddog Whisperer
wheelsup said:
I hope so as well. I'm cautiously optimistic. I've been here for almost 2 years and feel that any knee jerk reactions would seem out of character for this mgmt. team. They've been too cautious in all of their decisions to do that in my opinion. Examples would include not entering the 70 seat market, building the paint shop in Saltillo to provide added revenue, and paying off the vast majority of XJT's debt all while stockpiling cash. From what I've heard, they were hardly blind sided by CAL's decision and have been working on contingency plans for longer than we might think...of course what are they supposed to say! However like I said all of their actions, past and present, seem cautious and calculated.
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
Cav said:
Now contrast this with ACA vs. AWAC. ACA did a knee jerk reaction and went out on their own, vs. AWAC management doing an end-around and purchasing a place for their RJ's at US Air.
ACA management were risk takers, AWAC management are risk minimizers. ACA is no longer here; AWAC is.
AWAC management also has stated that they do not want ANY 70 seaters. They feel that the 70 seat market will be what the 50 seat market is today - simply a bandaid fix. They have expanded their core business to do ground handling for United, and apparently they picked up 24 stations for NWA.
A lot of pilots blame pilots at places like MESA for "lowering the bar", and while they do to some extent (my pay raise was 30% less due to Mesa), I believe the core issue is who is running the ship. A good management team can do wonders. Just look at Skywest - they are growing and still are probably *the best* regional to work for. Like it or not, JO runs a tight ship over there and he's a great business man. He helped get America West through its bankruptcy stuff back in the 90's and his 'investment' paid off with a huge, very long term contract for AWA feed.
Cav
Former Maddog Whisperer
wheelsup said:
I will say that in this business you get what you negotiate. Mesa pilots really have not done a very good job of negotiating especially in the quality of life arena and that is hurting a lot of other regional pilots right now. Furthermore that has enabled JO to build his business on the backs of his eployees. I will however be the first to say that the pilots have not had a lot to work with and were backed into a corner during their last contract with the whole Freedom thing. I've heard that there's some new blood in the MEC which is trying to get things going in the right direction. Let's hope they do.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
wheelsup said:
When did this happen?
Personally, I LIKE the idea of CAL keeping the routes and flying 737s on them. I'd be surpised to see all 69 planes worth of flying go back to 50 seaters. The CAL 737-500s don't seat too much more than a E190 anyway (105 when I was at XJT last year, but I heard they were reducing some 1st class seats to make room for a couple more rows in coach, so it might have gone up about 4-6 seats). Gives me hope there might be a place to move out of the regionals at some point of CAL keeps the flying.....
Bandit_Driver
Gold Member
From my sources at RAH. The CAL flying that CHQ won is going to have to be rebid to include bringing your own a/c.
CHQ is closing FLL (fact) and that may free up the necessary aircraft (rumor) to make them attactive to CAL.
CHQ is closing FLL (fact) and that may free up the necessary aircraft (rumor) to make them attactive to CAL.
chrisdahut1
Well-Known Member
Bandit_Driver said:
The closing of FLL isn't going to free up any aircraft. While it seems to us FL guys that our Delta flying has been dissapearing as Mesa takes over, a quick trip to the CVG A terminal will reveal where all those planes and flying went off too. We have 71 departures a day out of CVG next month, compared to 4 this time last year. We also have 16 departures a day out of ATL, where as this time last year we had 0. At it's peak, FLL had 39 daily departures.
