Checkride signoff's

saxman

saxman

Well-Known Member
Ok I can't find anything about this in the FAR's. I instruct at a 141 school and I am planning on leaving here in 2 weeks for a new flying job. I'm busting my ass to get two of my private students done with their checkride before I leave, and its coming down to the wire. I have one private doing 61 and one doing 141, both just a couple review flights and some ground sessions away. Best case they're going to finish in two weeks as long as weather holds, paper work looks good and to get the thing scheduled. Not to mention weather, and that they PASS!

I know all about the 3 hour rule within 60 days, but I see nothing about who has to give those 3 hours. Does the instructor signing the 8710 have to be the one giving those 3 hours? All I see in both 141 and 61, that an "authorized instuctor" has to make sure meets the requirements and signs them off, not neccisarily being the one that conducted the 3 hours. My chief pilot says this is so. I'm not so sure. My worry is the students don't pass, and then they're stuck paying for 3 more hours from someone else, after I've left. What do you think??

Chris
 
I just went through this and had the same impression as you. I was wrong though. As far as I remember it can be any instructor and they don't have to do 3 hours with them. Just as long as they have 3 hrs in the last 60 days they can be signed off by any CFI.

I lucked out and finished my two guys. My part 61 guy took his checkride two days after I made the move but he was all ready and everything worked out. Part 141 guy breezed right on through too.
 
saxman66 said:
My worry is the students don't pass, and then they're stuck paying for 3 more hours from someone else, after I've left.
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If an applicant fails, he does not need to have another 3 hours, unless he goes beyond 60 days before a second attempt. He only needs a sufficient amount of training to be able to correct the failed item(s).

Strictly according to regs, the 3 hours before checkride do not have to be with the recommending instructor, but it is traditional, and may be the operating policy of your school or chief instructor.
 
I wonder who would have more liability in case the new PP had an incident/accident..the main instructor who left, or the instructor who did 3 hours and a checkride signoff?

I have a few finish-ups that are only 3 or so hours away from the checkride.
 
Propilot said:
I wonder who would have more liability in case the new PP had an incident/accident..the main instructor who left, or the instructor who did 3 hours and a checkride signoff?

I have a few finish-ups that are only 3 or so hours away from the checkride.
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...or the DPE who gave him the certificate that removes him from the watchful eye of either, allowing the new pilot to make his own decisions?

Assuming anyone in the chain has any real liability to begin with, it will probably depend more on what the incident or accident was than who was the most recent link in the chain.
 
One of my guys is pretty much ready. The other needs a couple more flights. Today we got an airplane, got to the end of the runway and realized the ammeter was below zero, and the volt light was on. We turned on more stuff and it dropped even more. Great! I could ask if he was going to takeoff. He said it was required. I quizzed him and said it was only at night as it was part of "FLAPS." Knowing it was going to be a long flight, and I wanted to have radios coming back, I (he) made the decision to go in.

This is what made me mad, and I realized my chief is kinda a doof. Since we used 0.2 of time, I assumed it could be done as a maintanence item and my student wouldn't get charged. Nope, he said thats to be payed for by the student, as mx problems are part of the setback in training. Boy I was furious about that! I told the dispatcher not to charge him, and I just put it as a mx test run on the sheet. If I'm renting a plane for training I expect to have an airworthy airplane. Yes problems arise in flight, but UND never charged a student if something broke in flight and he or she wasn't able to complete a lesson.

Sorry, had to rant. Glad I'm getting outa here. Is this practice common where ya'll train or teach??
 
saxman66 said:
Is this practice common where ya'll train or teach??
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I've read quite a few comments on these boards about this practice, which has also become the basis for logging 'flight time' on a taxi-out-run-up that goes bad, but most of the places I have been at do not charge for a mx item before take-off.

If a take-off occurs, then I think it is fair to charge for the flight time even if the lesson cannot be completed. The idea is that a student will put more 'real-life' thought into checking everything before take-off.

And real life mx problems are 'training'. Any 'real-time emergency' or 'semi-emergency' is an experience you just cannot buy, so why wouldn't it be included in training and logging and paying.

Remember that University flight programs are subsidized by other funds, so an FBO cannot operate on the same finacial model.

Anyway, that's how we do it.
 
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