CFI Who Wears Shorts

I feel bad for my CFI since the school makes the instructors sport a white pilot shirt and slacks while I can just waltz up in some goofy plaid shorts and a dingy t-shirt. I mean, it's a million degrees outside and wicked humid. Then we're crammed like sardines in a dinky tin can of a plane with no a/c other than prop wash.

To be honest, I don't give a flying F how my instructor is dressed. I care about the instructor's attitude, dedication and knowledge to the craft. Throwing on important looking clothes doesn't necessarily impart knowledge. The clothes don't transfer information to your brain through osmosis. Sure, you look great and probably command a little more respect; but, do you have the knowledge to back it up?

It's like walking around or going to a restaurant in a full suit. People generally will use better manners, faster service, etc. But I could just be some dumbass in a suit.

I asked my CFI a million times whether or not I should dress up for my PPL checkride and she said no need. I agree - the DPE is focused on how well I fly, not whether or not my belt matches my shoes. I'll probably wear my nice linen shorts and a light cotton shirt just so I look a little more presentable, as I understand looking presentable helps you out in these instances.

If/when I ever become an instructor, I'd probably wear some of my nicer clothes with students, but I wouldn't see a need to dress like I'm the captain hopping in a Northwest A-330. If my school dictates that I wear a uniform, so be it.

Also Prozac Pilot needs to hop in his DeLorean and leave 1955. Girls show cleavage. It's okay these days for a woman to show some skin.
 
I'd be curious to see if there's any correlation between CFI dress and pay.

I bet you'd be hard pressed to find a CFI who makes more than $35k/year wearing shorts and a t-shirt to work.

Not saying you can't be a great instructor in shorts and t-shirt. I'd be lying if I said I've never given instruction in such attire. But if you want to work at a school with higher pay, and attract higher end clients, you're going to need to dress up a bit. Instructors can philosophize all day over what's professional or not, but at the end of the day, this is simply the way the game is played.
 
jrh said:
I'd be curious to see if there's any correlation between CFI dress and pay.

I bet you'd be hard pressed to find a CFI who makes more than $35k/year wearing shorts and a t-shirt to work.

Not saying you can't be a great instructor in shorts and t-shirt. I'd be lying if I said I've never given instruction in such attire. But if you want to work at a school with higher pay, and attract higher end clients, you're going to need to dress up a bit. Instructors can philosophize all day over what's professional or not, but at the end of the day, this is simply the way the game is played.
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I still have yet to find a student who gave a • how I dressed, so long as it wasn't "sloppy." Decent shorts and a nice t-shirt were fine. I think that most students/clients really only care about whether you're good, not how you dress. Once you develop a reputation, your ability and demeanor is virtually all that matters.
 
Bradg33 said:
I still have yet to find a student who gave a how I dressed, so long as it wasn't "sloppy." Decent shorts and a nice t-shirt were fine. I think that most students/clients really only care about whether you're good, not how you dress. Once you develop a reputation, your ability and demeanor is virtually all that matters.
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That may be the case, but note that CFI's aren't the only ones this happens to. It's all over corporate America. My last web development job at a large financial firm here in St. Louis had me on the 10th floor of our building. I never... NEVER saw any of our clients. In fact, our clients rarely came to our building downtown... they always went to the individual Financial Advisor offices. None of that mattered, however. Slacks, shirt and tie all day every day. We got to wear jeans in the summer on Fridays. Whoopee.

My new job has me in jeans every day. Tshirts, collared shirts, whatever. I still get my work done.

I agree with the above sentiments, though... if you are Part 141, you are almost definitely wearing a uniform that includes pants of some sort, no matter how scorching hot it is out there. Which is just silly when you are flying in a little aluminum oven.
 
Bradg33 said:
I still have yet to find a student who gave a how I dressed, so long as it wasn't "sloppy." Decent shorts and a nice t-shirt were fine. I think that most students/clients really only care about whether you're good, not how you dress. Once you develop a reputation, your ability and demeanor is virtually all that matters.
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Do you make more than $35k/year? If not, how are you disproving my point, other than making assumptions?

You're never going to hear how a client is judging you based on your dress. Appearance is a subtle, unspoken factor. The client won't come out and say, "I decided you're not worth $50/hour," or "I don't think I'll do my next rating with you," based strictly on the way you dress. They'll just quietly stop coming, or never start to begin with.

People make decisions based on emotion, not logic. The logic has to be there, but emotion is what ultimately drives them. Dressing up a bit builds the "perception of value" in their mind. It makes them think, "This guy is serious about what he does. He's more mature than the guy at the other flight school. I bet he's more careful..." and on and on. It makes them feel good about flying with you.

The way you dress is sending out an unspoken message in the same way showing up on time, not using foul language, and having good hygiene sends out messages. It can go to both ends of the spectrum, too...if you show up in a full airline pilot uniform, under some circumstances, it can scream, "I'm a tool."

Now, if all your clients are 19 year old college kids, you're right, they probably don't care what you look like. But when you start dealing with 45 year old businesspeople who own $300,000 aircraft, they're going to wonder about shorts and t-shirts. Those are the clients who will provide a decent living for the CFIs who want it.

There are exceptions to every rule, but I stand by my assertion of well-dressed CFIs getting paid better, on average.
 
SteveCostello said:
That may be the case, but note that CFI's aren't the only ones this happens to. It's all over corporate America. My last web development job at a large financial firm here in St. Louis had me on the 10th floor of our building. I never... NEVER saw any of our clients. In fact, our clients rarely came to our building downtown... they always went to the individual Financial Advisor offices. None of that mattered, however. Slacks, shirt and tie all day every day. We got to wear jeans in the summer on Fridays. Whoopee.

My new job has me in jeans every day. Tshirts, collared shirts, whatever. I still get my work done.

I agree with the above sentiments, though... if you are Part 141, you are almost definitely wearing a uniform that includes pants of some sort, no matter how scorching hot it is out there. Which is just silly when you are flying in a little aluminum oven.
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One of many excellent reasons why I don't want anything to do with a 141 school...
 
jrh said:
Do you make more than $35k/year? If not, how are you disproving my point, other than making assumptions?

You're never going to hear how a client is judging you based on your dress. Appearance is a subtle, unspoken factor. The client won't come out and say, "I decided you're not worth $50/hour," or "I don't think I'll do my next rating with you," based strictly on the way you dress. They'll just quietly stop coming, or never start to begin with.

People make decisions based on emotion, not logic. The logic has to be there, but emotion is what ultimately drives them. Dressing up a bit builds the "perception of value" in their mind. It makes them think, "This guy is serious about what he does. He's more mature than the guy at the other flight school. I bet he's more careful..." and on and on. It makes them feel good about flying with you.

The way you dress is sending out an unspoken message in the same way showing up on time, not using foul language, and having good hygiene sends out messages. It can go to both ends of the spectrum, too...if you show up in a full airline pilot uniform, under some circumstances, it can scream, "I'm a tool."

Now, if all your clients are 19 year old college kids, you're right, they probably don't care what you look like. But when you start dealing with 45 year old businesspeople who own $300,000 aircraft, they're going to wonder about shorts and t-shirts. Those are the clients who will provide a decent living for the CFIs who want it.

There are exceptions to every rule, but I stand by my assertion of well-dressed CFIs getting paid better, on average.
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I'm not a professional CFI anymore, but I've worked with plenty of clients with expensive airplanes and never "dressed up" for them. I disagree with your assertion that people put that much value how one dresses. I'm sure some people do, but that's just pure ignorance. Most intelligent people are able to recognize that how one dresses isn't relevant to how they perform at their job. So long as you're a good instructor, your reputation will more than make up for any "deficiency" caused by your refusal to wear "business casual" clothing. I say all of this as a guy who wears business casual and/or suits to his job as a lawyer.

Additionally, I'd rather see a guy wearing shorts and a t-shirt than an •, ill-fitting dress shirt and slacks, which is what most people end up wearing when they "dress up." I see it all the time with lawyers - ill-fitting "dress" clothes look like absolute • and at that point I do start to lose respect for people. It shows only that you're lazy, sloppy and have can't even do something right when you have to.
 
Funny...a student just asked me this weekend why I wasn't wearing shorts. My reply was something along the lines of "[grumble, grumble]...try to...professional...[grumble, grumble]." But seriously, folks, these guys are paying top dollar. We should at least look the part, whatever that is for where you are.
 
Bradg33 said:
I still have yet to find a student who gave a how I dressed, so long as it wasn't "sloppy."
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How would you even know? I remember looking around to buy a car in Ohio years ago. I pulled into the first dealership and parked my car, and immediately noticed the sales staff walking around the lot in jeans and company polo shirts. I cranked my car back up and drove down the street to the next dealership. Those salesmen were wearing shirts, trousers, and ties. That salesman got my business, and he made commission off of that sale. The salesman wearing jeans to work lost a sale, and he never even knew it.

I choose not to do business with people who can't wear big boy clothes. I'm not the only one. If you choose to give up that business, then that's up to you. But don't pretend that you know whether you're losing that business or not. Someone isn't going to tell you that you lost their business because of your slacker attire. They're just not going to do business with you in the first place, and you'll never even know it.
 
African_Swallow said:
Funny...a student just asked me this weekend why I wasn't wearing shorts. My reply was something along the lines of "[grumble, grumble]...try to...professional...[grumble, grumble]." But seriously, folks, these guys are paying top dollar. We should at least look the part, whatever that is for where you are.
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But what is the "part?" The part is providing instruction in a small, hot space. Any student with half a brain gets this, and shouldn't expect you to be wearing pants and a dress shirt. Nice shorts and a nice t-shirt or polo should be perfectly acceptable. Again, I emphasize the "nice" part. Ratty shorts or a t-shirt that you'd wear working in your yard aren't what I'm talking about. A nice looking, properly fitting, clean t-shirt or a similar polo, combined with nice, properly fitting shorts. I mean, you still have to use your head and make sure you look good, but that doesn't mean business casual.
 
Bradg33 said:
I'm not a professional CFI anymore, but I've worked with plenty of clients with expensive airplanes and never "dressed up" for them. I disagree with your assertion that people put that much value how one dresses. I'm sure some people do, but that's just pure ignorance. Most intelligent people are able to recognize that how one dresses isn't relevant to how they perform at their job. So long as you're a good instructor, your reputation will more than make up for any "deficiency" caused by your refusal to wear "business casual" clothing. I say all of this as a guy who wears business casual and/or suits to his job as a lawyer.
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Ok, maybe I didn't do a good job of explaining myself.

I would love to meet a CFI who brings home more than $35k/year who wears shorts and t-shirt to work. I'm skeptical one exists.

It's no different from being a lawyer. You dress up for work. It's just what you do. I don't know all the reasons for it, but dressing up is the way the game is played. If you want to make a living as a lawyer, you dress up. Period. It doesn't matter how smart you are, or how quickly you work, or anything else. If you want to exist in the world of lawyers, you dress up.

Full time, well-paid CFIs are no different. If you're content to do it part-time, or work for a little mom and pop FBO, shorts and t-shirt are fine. You can still be a good instructor, and maybe even stay busy. But that's not really a good way to make a living. You're probably either going to get paid peanuts or not be very busy.

How many Cessna or Cirrus factory instructors wear shorts to work? How many times have you seen John and Martha King doing their videos in shorts and t-shirts?

If you want to make a decent living as a CFI, not just a well-paid side job, you're going to need to dress up. You don't have to like it or agree with it. I'm just saying how it is.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
How would you even know? I remember looking around to buy a car in Ohio years ago. I pulled into the first dealership and parked my car, and immediately noticed the sales staff walking around the lot in jeans and company polo shirts. I cranked my car back up and drove down the street to the next dealership. Those salesmen were wearing shirts, trousers, and ties. That salesman got my business, and he made commission off of that sale. The salesman wearing jeans to work lost a sale, and he never even knew it.

I choose not to do business with people who can't wear big boy clothes. I'm not the only one. If you choose to give up that business, then that's up to you. But don't pretend that you know whether you're losing that business or not. Someone isn't going to tell you that you lost their business because of your slacker attire. They're just not going to do business with you in the first place, and you'll never even know it.
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When I was instructing professionally, I had more students than I could handle, so I suppose I didn't care about losing the ones who cared how I dressed, even if I didn't know I'd lost them. I also probably don't want to work with someone who is that picky and uptight, and who can't see the substance over the form.

You're certainly welcome to your old-school attitude, but it's pretty unreasonable. I can't help but laugh at people who put so much emphasis on the type of clothing a person is wearing, regardless of how nice/clean/well-fitting the clothes are. Please explain to me how jeans and a polo are not "big boy" clothes? Maybe it's a generational thing...
 
jrh said:
Ok, maybe I didn't do a good job of explaining myself.

I would love to meet a CFI who brings home more than $35k/year who wears shorts and t-shirt to work. I'm skeptical one exists.

It's no different from being a lawyer. You dress up for work. It's just what you do. I don't know all the reasons for it, but dressing up is the way the game is played. If you want to make a living as a lawyer, you dress up. Period. It doesn't matter how smart you are, or how quickly you work, or anything else. If you want to exist in the world of lawyers, you dress up.

Full time, well-paid CFIs are no different. If you're content to do it part-time, or work for a little mom and pop FBO, shorts and t-shirt are fine. You can still be a good instructor, and maybe even stay busy. But that's not really a good way to make a living. You're probably either going to get paid peanuts or not be very busy.

How many Cessna or Cirrus factory instructors wear shorts to work? How many times have you seen John and Martha King doing their videos in shorts and t-shirts?

If you want to make a decent living as a CFI, not just a well-paid side job, you're going to need to dress up. You don't have to like it or agree with it. I'm just saying how it is.
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I guess I generally just refuse to play the game, at least when I have control over it. My employer dictates what I wear to work, but if they did not I'd wear jeans and a polo or t-shirt. When I was instructing, I was an independent contractor and the flight school didn't care what I wore. I simply think the "game" is stupid, and it is perpetuated by people who just accept it and play, rather than question why its that way and insist on change. I maintain that one can look nice and professional in shorts, especially when paired with a polo. It sure as hell looks better than a guy who is sweating through his slacks and dress shirt...
 
Bradg33 said:
I guess I generally just refuse to play the game, at least when I have control over it. My employer dictates what I wear to work, but if they did not I'd wear jeans and a polo or t-shirt. When I was instructing, I was an independent contractor and the flight school didn't care what I wore. I simply think the "game" is stupid, and it is perpetuated by people who just accept it and play, rather than question why its that way and insist on change. I maintain that one can look nice and professional in shorts, especially when paired with a polo. It sure as hell looks better than a guy who is sweating through his slacks and dress shirt...
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That's great. I'm not saying you were a bad or unprofessional instructor. You probably looked as decent as one can look in shorts and a t-shirt, and obviously if you stayed busy, your clients probably enjoyed flying with you.

But the fact remains, many CFIs gotta make money! If all you want to do is have a cool side job, or build time for the next flying job, fine, do whatever you want. But if you want to pay bills and put money in the bank while working as a full time CFI, there's really no way to do it without dressing up.
 
Bradg33 said:
I guess I generally just refuse to play the game
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Bingo! That's the problem. That's the attitude that I want to avoid. When someone wears jeans or shorts to work, it demonstrates that they have problems with adhering to societal norms and traditions. That's not a professional attitude, in my opinion, so I look elsewhere. A dislike for following the rules and "playing the game" is not a good vibe to be letting off from a pilot.
 
Wow sounds like most of you have been pretty lucky. I WISH I could wear shorts, it would have been really nice all those summers in Phoenix working as a CFI. Oh I didn't have to wear a tie, what a relief that was :sarcasm:
 
ATN_Pilot said:
Bingo! That's the problem. That's the attitude that I want to avoid. When someone wears jeans or shorts to work, it demonstrates that they have problems with adhering to societal norms and traditions.
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I am primarily an engineer. In most cases, wearing a suit and tie results in customers not wanting to deal with me. Jeans or shorts - pretty much what most of my customers wear. And these guys make a lot of money, more than most pilots.

Depends on the job, depends on the clientele, depends on the industry.
 
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