CFI Advice

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WhiskeyTango17

Well-Known Member
Hi everyone,


I will try to keep this short but I would like some advice on how to finish my CFI rating. Last year in San Diego I scheduled my CFI ride and the San Diego FSDO scheduled me with a FSDO inspector. After waiting over a month to get in with him (he canceled and didn’t seem to know his schedule) I finally had a date for my ride. We started on FOI and Endorsements. The guy was really cranky and seemed to forget where he was half the time. We finished the Endorsements and he asked me to teach him a lesson on left turning tendencies, he failed me immediately and would not give a good reason why. While he was filing out the “pink slip” I asked what I needed to do to reschedule and he basically said that it would be a few weeks and that he would probably fail me again.


I was frustrated and left the FSDO. A couple months later I called the FSDO again and this time I got a DPE. After a 6 hour oral I failed on one section. That was my fault because I got nervous and did not review that area to well. The DPE was professional and fair. A couple weeks later on my recheck with the DPE the original FSDO inspector I had randomly showed up during the oral exam and told me he would be finishing it. He asked me one question and failed me. The FSDO inspector was previously the POI for my flight school and has told the owner several times he didn’t like the school. It’s a great school to. This FSDO inspector has a bad reputation in the San Diego area.


So now I’m looking at going to Sheble aviation in Needles, CA to finish. Any advice on whether I should go to Sheble and pay over $5,000 dollars or just do the training here at my flight school for $ 2,500 and take the airplane and checkride at a different FSDO.


Sorry for the lengthy write up and thanks for any input
 
WhiskeyTango17 said:
So now I’m looking at going to Sheble aviation in Needles, CA to finish. Any advice on whether I should go to Sheble and pay over $5,000 dollars or just do the training here at my flight school for $ 2,500 and take the airplane and checkride at a different FSDO.
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Why are you expecting to pay $2,500-5,000 for essentially a 61.49 endorsement?

My advice would be to study everything that you can get your hands on, for an extended period of time. Then find a CFI to give you a mock checkride and oral, and sign you off, which shouldn't cost more than a few hundred bucks. Sounds like there is something you aren't being honest with yourself about.
 
Ya im not sure how he knew. My DPE later told me that the FSDO inspectors can see what checkrides are going on within their district for that day and the inspector called my DPE and asked where the check ride will be held. I understand that for the 61.49 endorsement it should only be a few hundred dollars but its been 4 months since I've done any training for the cfi so I want to do 20 hours of ground and at least 3 hours of flight training. Which at my flight school would probably cost around 1,500.

Yes Sheble moved to Needles last summer. Not sure why.
 
Go to another FSDO near you.

I heard the same thing from an LGB DPE. The FSDO can see what checkrides are in the system now.
 
Unfortunately all DPEs must use a national calendar now when they schedule check rides which is why the inspector knows of the retest etc. The DPE program is one that FAA has to keep but doesn't trust. That will give you most of the insight you need when you look at things through that lens.

Shebles has been around a long time and has moved around. Jo jr. was terminated but Jo Senior still has his DPE the last I checked. I'd train with a good instructor at your place and if you have to, take the retest in a different FSDO; however remember that the inspector or DPE conducting the retest can just test the items failed or not tested but could also do another complete practical test or sample other areas. If you can stick with the same person and you feel comfortable with that then I'd do that.

It's too bad that there is no real standardization just what AFS 640 passes around as standardization for DPEs. There is one fact though that you can hang your hat on. That is that the test MUST be conducted in accordance to the PTS and that means that any question asked of you by a DPE or inspector MUST be in the references listed in that TASK in the PTS. If someone is asking you how the fly weights work in a constant speed propeller system that is NOT in any handbook or POH that I know of and therefore you don't need to know it. If you feel that a question is not fair because you think it's not in the references cited in that task in the PTS then do ask your inspector or examiner to show you where it is. This seems like it would only make matters worse, but I have to tell you when I was a DPE and there was no insistence to asking questions formulated from the references there were some times when the applicants CFI or applicant asked me that very question. In those cases I went to the references and came up empty handed which then made me retract the question and to put that applicant in a better space in my mind because I was getting the feeling that they actually knew what was in the references. It's all fair.

It's also too bad when instructors won't stick up for their students for fear of some made up repercussion from the FAA and so on. The relationship with a DPE or inspector should be a professional one. Fairness is all you can ask for.

With my own students we have a policy that if they fail the test and if the student says the test was conducted fairly using the PTS and the examiner or inspector didn't have an attitude problem then both the student and I accept that result no matter if the student had a bad day, felt stressed or whatever. If the student says that there was an issue with questions, or some part of the test that they feel was not conducted to the PTS then I will find out what happened from the student and I will meet with the inspector or DPE and have them explain why their test was conducted in accordance to the standard. This is not a one way street and it's the only way to replace DPEs who are not doing their jobs or give the students a hard time. But in fairness to the DPEs they are usually right and there is more to the story etc...

Oh well...anyway I just wanted you to feel like you had some recourse to a bad inspector anytime the test in not conducted to the standard.

Good luck on the retest.

- Mike Shiflett
 
where did you do your flight training? I could give you some advice, I know a great 141 school in SD with a fair DPE and solid advice on the FSDO. You shouldnt be failing that many times, esp more than 2.
 
I went to a local flight school at Gillespie Field. What 141 school is it? I have been looking at many local flight schools so any info helps. Thanks
 
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