career, money, family problems

splash

your social justice comic center
I'm looking for some been there done that or got through it advice. Most of you know that the start of this career is more than just a breezy walk in the park.

My future wife and I have a little girl together that is 3 and we have been together for 5 years. We live about 3 hours away from my future mother in-law that can not drive, refuses to move out of her house, and is literally afraid of dieing outside of her home. She travels very seldom and it's not for long at all because of this. She is 68 and very healthy. lol... a nut case but healthy. Well, my future wife (I'll call her Sue) ...Sue does not want to move out of driving distance from her mother because she feels she needs to be taken care of. I totally understand this need to take care of her mother. I have passed up job offers because I can not get us unstuck. There are 2 companies locally that I constantly knock on there doors and both say check back in 2 months...then a check back in 6 months...oh, we just hired back a guy that quit a long time ago...check back in 6 again. This has been the story for about 3 years of me with a chance to fly local.

I have worked off and on at a number of 5 and dime 40 hours a week jobs and small part time side jobs. When I fill out a application I always question myself should I put this one on here when I worked 6 days a month for 6 months. Or the 5 and dime 40 hours a week shop that I lasted 5 months at because I was sure to find something else to better myself, I just need to spend more time looking around here so I quit (which was not the right answer). Didn't know the wrong answer until I tried time after time.

Sometimes Sue feels like the only one putting effort into providing for the family. Sometimes Sue feels like, I do not help at all. Sometimes Sue claims to feel, she does all the work. Well, sometimes I feel like quiting Sue ...and taking the next flying job offered in any location. I'm tired of being anchored to high school pay shop work (high hire/quit rates) and only dreaming for better around here. The ship is sinking skipper. Gosh, if I could only get a job with 1 of these 2 companies flying and it's not the lack of hours that's holding me back.

I would be happy making 30K (something to live on) here not flying at all right now until one of these 2 companies pick me up but the problem is with a dagree in aviation I'm over quilified and they know ...me working there = me leaving when flying job opens up again. I'm willing to take vocational work anywhere flying.

Not enough and too many freak'n anchors. Maybe some new pilots read this mess I got myself into. Bah, humbug!
 

ljg

Well-Known Member
I hear you man, loud and clear. It sounds like a tough situation. My advice? it appears that you're chasing greener grass. Don't pick up and leave your 3 year old for a flying job. Flying sucks.

You're intending to marry this lady, so try compromise. Say you agree with her to stay put for awhile in the vicinity of her mother. Since you've already tried diligently for a flying job and no dice, and you're having trouble landing a professional job in another sector, you could use this time and get an MBA to compliment your aviation degree. If by the time you've graduated, and there's still no jobs that interest you more than flying, even with an MBA in hand - than it will be time for the entire family to relocate to an area where you can fly. Regional airline benefits can get your wife back to see her mother frequently, A lot can happen in those 2-3 years, since the industry is way down currently anyway.

Married life is all about compromise, dedication, and love for your spouse. Good luck in your decision.
 

lindseyv

Well-Known Member
I understand how you are feeling- but don't give up on the family just yet. Having a meaningful/enjoyable career is also pretty darn important. (IMHO) I can understand the soon to be wife not wanting to be too far from her mother, so maybe there is a compromise. I will say it takes a special spouse to be able to handle a pilot's career-especially when there are children involved- but the rewards are great too. My father was in the AF and a pilot for NWA and was gone very often. But, when he was home he was able to totally devote himself to his family

Would it be possible for you to commute? Of course that might mean lots of reserve time and many, many nights in a crash pad away from home- but you will be flying- and she would be close to mom. Plus, you won't be on call forever. It would just be a difficult period to get through.

Do you think she would feel any better if there was some kind of loose plan? Something along the lines of trying to find the job that might require a commute, with crummy pay initially (not forever) and continuing through the first couple of years until you can make a little more money...etc. I kind of equate it to a similar position I am in now. My husband is in grad. school making beans for salary, and he is constantly locked in his lab- but this is only temporary and one day he will actually be finished with grad. school and making better money!!!! Maybe if she could see the light at the end of the tunnel she would feel like you are keeping her in mind too. I hope things work out for you!!!!!
 

NotCoolEnufToFly

Well-Known Member
Does she have a career that's important to her as well? Is it really only because of her mother? Assuming you've already taken HER career aspirations into account... I don't get it. I would make sure you are really sensitive about it but try to have a honest talk with her. Find out if there is something else that might be holding her back here. Explain to her without her feeling attacked, that you feel as though you can't provide for them like you would like to because you just can't find the work here and that by her not being willing to relocate that she doesn't feel it's important. See if she's willing to move within a certain radius of her mother. Like anywhere within a 4hr drive or something and that might widen your search some too. Also, does her mother truely need 'Sue' there to take care of her or is it just some sort of a dependency? Honestly if my mother couldn't go on without me or whatever, she would have the choice of dealing with it or finding an apartment closer to us because that's really not fair. It's my turn to have a family and raise my kids. Again though, maybe there is another reason that she doesn't really just feel comfortable relocating. Maybe she's never lived anywhere else and is scared to move? Maybe she's afraid to uproot your daughter? Does she have a super job? Maybe she's afraid that she won't be able to find another job as good just anywhere and you'll be stuck living on pilot salary!? If it really is only her mother holding her back, again be super sensitive about it, but express to her that you feel as though she's putting her mother before the rest of the family, you who she's agreed to spend the rest of her life with and your little girl.

I think it's super important to work these things out from the beginning. I'm not necesarily speaking to you now Splash, I know you can't change things now, but maybe for some young couple who's just starting to get serious. It's really important. Oliver and I discussed whose career would be the more dominant and the one we were going to chase after from the beginning. I'm more of a family person than a career person anyways so it wasn't a big deal for us to decide that his dream of being a pilot was most important. (not saying that it's not possible to try and make both careers a priority but again, that's something that has to be discussed and definitely something that makes it just that tad bit harder) He also specifically had a talk with me one time about what it would be like to move away from home and was asking me if I really thought I could do it as I have NEVER lived more than a mile from my mother and neve lived outside of my hometown (since I was 2 anyways). These things can sometimes cause big problems and even be deal breakers.
 

splash

your social justice comic center
Mother in law and I don't talk at all and she somewhat despises me for not taking any 5 and dime job. I'm must... gonna have to...but tried not to throw in the fact that in-law is 100% Asian, just for some culture understanding of my next statement. Oh, she does put mother before the rest of the family!

Sue's father was in the AF and Sue moved around the world very often. I believe this plays part in it too somewhat because she feels she don't want the same for our little one. My family is also here in N.O. and they also help out with baby sitting and spoiling.

Sue teaches 2nd grade at Gretna park. I have rent property that pays out half our house note. All this comes up 2-3 times a year and at times I just want to ring her neck :)sarcasm:) because the good out weighs the bad by far and it's a constant loop argument of same stuff being said. Thanks for all the advice everyone. 3 days of the silent treatment from her and one more night of arguing last night and this morning things started to look brighter. But the problem still continues in the back of both of our minds. We just compress it for so long then all has to come out again it seems.
 

skydog

New Member
First of all, marry the woman. You already have a child together, it would be nice for that child to know that her mommy and daddy are married. Go down to the courthouse and get a civil ceremony. Do it now, before anything else.

Secondly, get a job. You're first responsibility is to the health and wellbeing of your wife and child. What YOU want to do comes a distant second. If you can get a job locally flying, great. But you've made some choices in your life (having a kid out of marriage) and that choice precludes you from making other choices (moving away for a flying job).

Now, as far as "Sue" goes: It seems to me that she has her priorities wrong. HER first priority is to the health and well-being of her husband and child. But apparently she doesn't understand that because she seems more concerned about her perfectly healthy mother than her own family. Somehow you need to make her understand that she has her priorities out of whack.
 

stuckingfk

Well-Known Member
First of all, marry the woman. You already have a child together, it would be nice for that child to know that her mommy and daddy are married. Go down to the courthouse and get a civil ceremony. Do it now, before anything else.
Bad advice.

Just cause a couple has a child together, doesn't mean they should be married. Would it be nice for the child? Of course, but if all the child sees is mommy/daddy fighting, what good is that?

To the original poster, you need to do what's best for you. I believe in taking care of your child is a priority but if you're miserable, get out. I'd much rather have a the parent's of a child be separated and loving, then married and miserable.
 

skydog

New Member
Bad advice.

Just cause a couple has a child together, doesn't mean they should be married. Would it be nice for the child? Of course, but if all the child sees is mommy/daddy fighting, what good is that?

To the original poster, you need to do what's best for you. I believe in taking care of your child is a priority but if you're miserable, get out. I'd much rather have a the parent's of a child be separated and loving, then married and miserable.
Wow. There's so much wrong with this post, I don't even know where to begin.

First of all, you've got it backwards. Just because you got married, doesn't mean you should have children. But that is water under the bridge now. They've got a child, so they need to legitimize and formalize their relationship and family. That child needs to know that mommy and daddy have a commited relationship and that she has a family.

If fighting is a problem. then don't let the child see mommy and daddy fighting. There's absolutely no reason mommy and daddy can't disagree and keep it private. Whatever the problem is, figure it out without the child being there. If that means you have to wait until the child goes to bed and you discuss it quietly in the bedroom, so be it.

As I said in my first post. The first priority is the child. If that means mommy and daddy have to suck it up for the next 18 years, then so be it. You've made your choices. Now own them.
 

killbilly

Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
Wow. There's so much wrong with this post, I don't even know where to begin.
Reserve judgment, why dontcha...

First of all, you've got it backwards. Just because you got married, doesn't mean you should have children. But that is water under the bridge now. They've got a child, so they need to legitimize and formalize their relationship and family. That child needs to know that mommy and daddy have a commited relationship and that she has a family.
They need to do what's right for them and their family and not what a bunch of screaming meemies on the internet tell them to do. Skydog, I'm sure you're a nice guy in person but your post absolutely screams of superiority and condecension. "Legitimizing" by your standards is a supremely arrogant way of telling them that their relationship, however they define it, is not legitimate. Jesus.

If fighting is a problem. then don't let the child see mommy and daddy fighting. There's absolutely no reason mommy and daddy can't disagree and keep it private. Whatever the problem is, figure it out without the child being there. If that means you have to wait until the child goes to bed and you discuss it quietly in the bedroom, so be it.
This I disagree with you on. Talked to my 84-year-old grandmother about this once; she and my grandfather would never, ever fight in front of the kids. She told me that decades later, whenever her kids had a fight with their spouses, they would completely freak out, not realizing that it's okay to fight and get past issues. They never got to see that it's a natural part of the friction between two people. There is no reason mommy and daddy can't civilly disagree or even have a heated argument in front of the kids, either. The values of conflict resolution they instill, however they choose to do it, will have lasting impressions, so let us be supportive and hope they do this wisely and in their children's best interests.

As I said in my first post. The first priority is the child. If that means mommy and daddy have to suck it up for the next 18 years, then so be it. You've made your choices. Now own them.
Again Skydog, if I were a less understanding person I'd have a whole slew of flippant remarks here. Instead, I'm going to hope (and say) that I don't think you really mean this the way it reads.
 

jhugz

#lighttwin Mafia
Hey Bro...sorry for other people arguing on your thread about a completely off topic subject. It is his thread and he has a problem...if you want to discuss marriage post a topic up in the lav...I will be more than willing to discuss it with you in there. Rant over.

I am 20 years old...have really never had a serious relationship so I am really not going to tell you to do one thing or another. You love your women and you love your profession so there needs to be a comprise somewhere in there. You need to make that discision where its going to be. Hit me up in a PM or on aim if you ever need to vent.

Good luck sir.
 

splash

your social justice comic center
Update

They are not very off topic here and what is said is good advice from both sides most importantly the fighting in front of kids. I believe some fights should be out in the open and some of them behind closed doors. It depends on the severity of the situations. Thanks for the vent invitation.

It got very nasty a few weeks ago. In a nut shell... I slept in my old bedroom at my folks house for about a week. We went to a relationship counselor for two sessions and worked things out compromising like couples that love each other should do. It's starting to feel crisp again, all the good old feelings rehashing. .....Life is sometimes a bit too damn crazy to sit down and figure out. I was looking for a job doing anything that paid over 30,000/year (being 32 years old with Bachelor, that isn't asking for too much, eh?). After spending so much time applying for jobs outside of aviation I get that phone call to go fly again and wow, the pay is good!

I waste my time thinking if the pouring rain did not happen would I still have gotten this offer to fly under the new sunshine? It's amazing the flips life can throw at you sometimes. At one point I was asking myself what can I do for existing? Now, the ball dropped in and it's time to haul arse with it agian. I never want to see those same old rainy days again. Overall lesson I can share with you... money can put a huge dampener on a strong, healthy, and loving relationship and it doesn't matter how hard we presently try to move ahead in life. Do we have control or is it mostly luck? Some may disagree here but from my experience it has been luck (good and bad) and I can only make myself more marketable if I get layed off again [knocking on wood] for the third time. Thanks for understanding and all the support. No relocating for this job! :rawk:
 

skydog

New Member
First of all, I apologize for coming off angry and arrogant. Thanks to you expressing faith in me. I appreciate the vote of confidence. I like to think I am a nice guy.

Here's the thing. My primary concern in this situation is not for the OP, but for his little girl. She is rapidly approaching the age, if she's not there already, when she is going to start recognizing that Mommy and Daddy aren't like other kids' Mommys and Daddys (i.e. they're not married). Mommy and Daddy have different last names. Who's last name does the little girl have? You see my point?

The original poster referred to this woman as his "future wife," indicating that he intends to marry her at some point. What is he waiting for? They've been together for 5 years and have a child together. Time to get it done. That child needs to know that Mommy and Daddy love each other and have a committed relationship.

My anger was not at the OP, but rather at another poster who essentially told him to get out if he is not happy. What kind of advice is that? This man has a little girl who needs him to live up to his responsibilities. Encouraging him to "take off" chase his dreams (or whatever) is not appropriate. His dreams don't matter any more. His child's does.

I also pointed out in my original post that the child's mother has her priorities out of whack. She is more concerned for her mother's well being than she is for her own family's. As such, she is preventing her child's father from going out and getting meaninful employment in his field. He has the ability to go out and earn a decent living to support his family, but because of the misplaced priorities of child's mother, he is unable to do so.

It's my guess that this man and woman were not in what I think of as a committed relationship. But then the child came along, and now they are kind of stuck with each other, hence all the other problems, misunderstandings, and misplaced priorities. This is what happens when people have a child outside of a committed relationship.

I'm sorry for this man's misfortunes. I truly am. But he brought them on himself. The last thing we need to be doing is acting like pilots, telling a fellow pilot that he needs to do what makes him happy. He is no longer a pilot. He is his daughter's father.
 

splash

your social justice comic center
Skydog,


I think you are a nice guy. I just need to fill you in more. We are waiting for a get away wedding with close family and money is the issue there. We are in no rush and we are committed. We have all the time in the world for that. I have no problem explaining this to our child. See these days, marriage seems like only a piece of paper and we want it to be more than that piece of paper with two of the same names on it. Yes, our little one does have my last name because we were committed way back then. If not, She would have two last names like most do when such happens. She was planed to happen. BTW, her mother wanted two last names! Ice pick in the eye! Why? She is stuck in that order...1. Love ...2.Marriage...3. Baby. Times are different! I must say she does take up for me alot when she argues with her mom about us.

You are right, I will never stop being a father. Pilot, maybe.
 

CaptBill

Well-Known Member
You know Splash, it is unlikely that a couple will find happiness together if neither can find it independently. You detesting her mother, and she detesting you for asking her to leave her mother, are issues that will not go away easily. Until each of you realize that the priority should be "us" and not jobs, in-laws and all the other BS that seems to fill our lives, it will be tough to make it work for the long run.

Go away for a few days together without all the daily distractions and plan your lives around each other. Talk about watching your little girl perform in school plays and dance recitals as she grows up. Jobs come and go, but little girls grow up way too fast. Talk about your dreams and how each of you can help the other accomplish theirs. Things have a way of working themselves out when you finally begin to focus on the right things. :)

Good Luck...
 

pullup

Homewrecker
You know Splash, it is unlikely that a couple will find happiness together if neither can find it independently. You detesting her mother, and she detesting you for asking her to leave her mother, are issues that will not go away easily. Until each of you realize that the priority should be "us" and not jobs, in-laws and all the other BS that seems to fill our lives, it will be tough to make it work for the long run.

Go away for a few days together without all the daily distractions and plan your lives around each other. Talk about watching your little girl perform in school plays and dance recitals as she grows up. Jobs come and go, but little girls grow up way too fast. Talk about your dreams and how each of you can help the other accomplish theirs. Things have a way of working themselves out when you finally begin to focus on the right things. :)

Good Luck...

Beautiful, just F-ing beautiful!!! Couldn't agree more. When my old lady and I finally realized that this realationship was about us and our family and not so much about our parents, siblings, etc then we really took off. It was time to realize that we had a marriage, house, kids, etc to plan for and not worry about still being someones child...if that makes sense. IE: Time to cut the apron strings!!

And Calcapts dead on...little girls grow up WAAAAAAAAAAY too fast. I am already dreading my baby doll marrying some loser who I do not accept. Which will be every guy on the face of this earth. :D
 

splash

your social justice comic center
Update
I get that phone call to go fly again and wow, the pay is good!
I waste my time thinking if the pouring rain did not happen would I still have gotten this offer to fly under the new sunshine? It's amazing the flips life can throw at you sometimes. At one point I was asking myself what can I do for existing? Now, the ball dropped in and it's time to haul arse with it agian. I never want to see those same old rainy days again. Do we have control or is it mostly luck? Some may disagree here but from my experience it has been luck (good and bad) and I can only make myself more marketable if I get layed off again [knocking on wood] for the third time. Thanks for understanding and all the support. No relocating for this job!
update#2
Nothing is real anymore. Much time and efforts wasted. Job offer fell through at last minute. Did it have something to do with my accident. Of course it did. Insurance is an excuse not to hire someone. Don't like the fact that a pilot had a non-pilot error accident then simply blame the insurance company. I have lost all excitement in this field. No use getting excited and happy about any offers anymore. false hope...false hope...false hope. 3x within this year. On the other hand, what a great short temporary pick me up. Get a chance, accident. ...Get a chance, take it away. Get a chance, take it away. Get a chance, take it away. I am presently numb. Ha, will I throw in the towel? When is it enough?
 

splash

your social justice comic center
Here is the root of the snowball....Chasing this aviation career! I understand for others it brings good things. Here is what it brought to me.

Depression, upsets, wasted time, wasted effort, wasted money, confusion how to start a new career (being over qualified), anger, rage, and most present lack of motivation

These are the feelings that effect other things in our life such as a family. These feelings come at a heavy price of chasing this aviation dream. I don't give up easy and I hate saying it like this but it is not worth it anymore. There are too many people suffering around me because of it. I feel selfish for not quitting sooner. I hate the sound of every plane that flies over my head for awhile which brings anger and frustration. It will be hard because I live next to a damn private airport. I grit my teeth in the mornings hearing them take off. I am jealous. If I didn't have bad luck in my career than I wouldn't have any luck at all. No more boo hooing, this stuff is for the birds (literally, :D).

Goodbye jet careers, it's been a pleasure. And good luck you all!
 

TangoBravo

New Member
Here is the root of the snowball....Chasing this aviation career! I understand for others it brings good things. Here is what it brought to me.

Depression, upsets, wasted time, wasted effort, wasted money, confusion how to start a new career (being over qualified), anger, rage, and most present lack of motivation

These are the feelings that effect other things in our life such as a family. These feelings come at a heavy price of chasing this aviation dream. I don't give up easy and I hate saying it like this but it is not worth it anymore. There are too many people suffering around me because of it. I feel selfish for not quitting sooner. I hate the sound of every plane that flies over my head for awhile which brings anger and frustration. It will be hard because I live next to a damn private airport. I grit my teeth in the mornings hearing them take off. I am jealous. If I didn't have bad luck in my career than I wouldn't have any luck at all. No more boo hooing, this stuff is for the birds (literally, :D).

Goodbye jet careers, it's been a pleasure. And good luck you all!
I wish you would contact your "friends" here at JC -
The only thing I can tell you straightfaced is that you are not alone.
Chasing Aviation has proven disasterous for my "family- life" too, and I for one am lucky not to have kids. You may be taking on lots of water right now - but old rusty ships sink very slow. I consider you a old rusty ship.
Organize - set priorities (short term) and go for them. If you would like to talk and hear another side - ctct me. :)
 

Bandit_Driver

Gold Member
Splash,

Simply getting married will not solve your problems. You should sit down with your wife and get everything out in the open an discuss it. If you really want to fly and she is not supportive of that you will end up resenting her and not create a good environment for your daughter to grow up in.

Good Luck.
 
Top