Candair CRJ200 from Heathrow Declares then Disappears

JustinS said:
The FPM read outs on the flight tracker seems pretty accurate. I sometimes go back and look at my own tracks on flightaware to kind of analyze how I flew an arrival or something.

Yeah it looks pretty nose down I agree. The crazy thing is I can't find anything in the photo that resembles a plane. No fuselage sections, no mangled up jet engines no pieces of wings or tail. Sorry to be morbid, but it's just astounding what a horrific impact that must've been. The fact that they're working to recover parts of the FDR/CVR also suggests a high speed impact.
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Nearly vertical, small prices, small debris field: ValuJet 592.


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As someone currently flying the 200....damn. I really want to know what caused this.

There's no mention of a trim disconnect activation. On the yoke we have a stab trim disconnect button, and our old memory items were to pull a set of breakers to stop a runaway trip.

One thing that stood out though was that it took aprox 30 seconds to idle the power. I wonder if pulling it back sooner could have helped with the overspeed situation?

Ugh, just an awful event :(
 
Jesus... That must of been a horrifying minute and 20 seconds. Sounds like something happened abruptly that led to the airplane becoming quickly uncontrollable.
 
GypsyPilot said:
I don't see that at all. The FDR timeline doesn't match that, and trim activation was said to be manual and was significantly after the CVR indicated weird crap was happening.
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Was it manual, or manual electric trim? If manual then yes, not a trim runaway but if it was manual electric trim then it still seems possible, I can't think of any other good reason to trim 1.9* nose down a cruise speed.
 
Roger Roger said:
Was it manual, or manual electric trim? If manual then yes, not a trim runaway but if it was manual electric trim then it still seems possible, I can't think of any other good reason to trim 1.9* nose down a cruise speed.
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Manual electric. There's no pure manual trim in the Canadian space shuttle.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
Manual electric. There's no pure manual trim in the Canadian space shuttle.
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Ok, so what I'm getting at is either the pilots manually set trim way nose down, or a fault of some kind ran it down for them. With the limited data and the airplane being annihilated we may never know which is the case I suppose.
 
Considering how very few CRJs are carrying boxes vs pax, if this turns out to be some unknown fault that just surfaced, the world is damn lucky there weren't 50 pax and an F/A killed along with the poor bastards up front. And that it happened in the middle of nowhere.

Damn scary.
 
Roger Roger said:
Ok, so what I'm getting at is either the pilots manually set trim way nose down, or a fault of some kind ran it down for them. With the limited data and the airplane being annihilated we may never know which is the case I suppose.
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They say the FDR data seems not to match what actually happened. I wonder if there was some sort of AHARS issue that led the autopilot into something goofy.

I don't usually like to speculate but since the initial report seems to create more questions than answers...
 
Roger Roger said:
I don't know much about the CRJ but the report seems to describe a trim runaway.
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Sheesh, I don't know... maybe a completely departed trim system. Reading that report shivered me timbers. What was hard to grok was why manually trim away from nose up position to nose down position with no reduction in power for for over 30 seconds while speed has exceeded Vmo?? That would seem to indicate that at onset the crew thought they were climbing. Something most peculiar must have been going on here. Something majorly weird.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
They say the FDR data seems not to match what actually happened. I wonder if there was some sort of AHARS issue that led the autopilot into something goofy.

I don't usually like to speculate but since the initial report seems to create more questions than answers...
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This is my thought.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
They say the FDR data seems not to match what actually happened. I wonder if there was some sort of AHARS issue that led the autopilot into something goofy.

I don't usually like to speculate but since the initial report seems to create more questions than answers...
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That's what I was thinking, except it says the autopilot kicked off at the beginning. My guess is some sort of AHRS failure and they inadvertently followed the attitude indicator. Purely a guess at this point though.
 
Roger Roger said:
Ok, so what I'm getting at is either the pilots manually set trim way nose down, or a fault of some kind ran it down for them. With the limited data and the airplane being annihilated we may never know which is the case I suppose.
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As others have said, it's manual electric. I have several thousand hours in the CRJ, and this is just a strange report so far. As I said previously, the main problem with your theory is that a trim runaway doesn't match the timeline. Crap hit the fan before the stab trim moved.
 
Recently I had an electric trim switch short out such that applying nose up trimmed the airplane nose down, and applying nose down trim did nothing.
 
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